New dog law - implications for country owners.

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pennyturner

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I'm a bit worried about the recent change in the law - you know, the one that says that anyone who 'feels threatened' by your dog, even on your own property, can accuse it of being 'dangerously out of control'.

My garden is large, and the dogs are frequently outside. One of them is a bullmastiff cross, who is gentle as a lamb, but quite imposing to look at. It's quite possible someone who doesn't know her could reasonably 'feel threatened' on meeting her, but I'm damned if I'm going to not let her out in her own garden. Visitors cannot alert the house of their presence without entering (unless they phone), as the entrance is 200yds from the house. For practical reasons the gate is open; the dogs are trained not to leave the grounds. We have many frequent visitors, including postie with no issues whatsoever, but I'm worried a stranger could make trouble.

Do I have to put a sign on the gate forbidding entry to strangers?
Thoughts anyone?
 
I have a lovely upstanding Shepherd Dog, and we too are a long way from the road and cannot hear visitors. To protect my dog we lock the gate!

I agree it would be far more convenient to have it unlocked for welcome visitors, but I cannot risk unwelcome ones coming in and accusing my dog of anything.

We have a ship's bell outside for visitors to make a racket with, and this generally alerts the dog, who barks and alerts us. And, yes, sometimes we miss deliveries, but the gate stays locked, for Talos's sake.
 
A friend has this on her yard gate.. genuine..
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Or even something like this ..
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We used to have people opening our gates, coming down our drive and turning around then buzzing off - That soon changed with electric gates. :)
 
Lol. We operate quite a friendly household. The above doesn't quite feel right. Would 'Warning, dogs running free' be enough?

Sometimes we have loose ponies in the garden too. Do I need to warn people about them? Is there a 'dangerous cobs act' I need to comply with?
 
pennyturner said:
Lol. We operate quite a friendly household. The above doesn't quite feel right. Would 'Warning, dogs running free' be enough?

Sometimes we have loose ponies in the garden too. Do I need to warn people about them? Is there a 'dangerous cobs act' I need to comply with?
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lol-actually the dogs running free sign might work. our place has one (left by the last owners) and it has put some people off, including delivery drivers, off (we dont actually have dogs running free). Saying that, it didnt put off the JW so can't win them all.
 
We also have a huge black (friendly) boar that sometimes gets free run of the yard. 5" tusks and all.
I can't help thinking that the folk who make these laws don't have my domestic situation in mind :/

Geese I don't want - the chickens are bad enough, but at least they're not mental.
 
We had geese on our front lawn and postie refused to come to the front door- we had to put a box on the gate for him!!! They were harmless but he obviously felt 'threatened'.
 
OH's Auntie, has a a front garden which is her whole garden (if that makes sense), quite large and the dogs have access to most of it, but she is on a private lane.
Her sign says - 'WARNING - Dogs running free'

We have a sign on the gate to the back garden which is next to the front door saying 'Warning - Dog on Property' but she looks scarier then she is! lol
 
The dogs that scare my mare are in a garden with a sign on the fence that says 'Our dogs can make it to this fence in 3 seconds. Can you?'
 
Anyone have police or legal views on whether warning signs protect an owner from vexatious claims of intimidation / collision / tripping up by a well-meaning dog?
 
pennyturner said:
Anyone have police or legal views on whether warning signs protect an owner from vexatious claims of intimidation / collision / tripping up by a well-meaning dog?
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Not any more I'm afraid. Previously if a dog was on private property and scared/bit anybody no offence was committed - the new law has changed that. It isn't even enough to have the dogs fenced off/secured in behind a fence/locked gate as the only time you can't be potentially prosecuted is if somebody forces an entry to the house...forget the fact that if it was my house they would have to scale a 6ft high fence and/or break through a locked tall gate with a caution, dogs running free sign to get to the house to break in! I would still be liable for any damage they did in the secure, fenced garden.


https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa..._dogs_provisions_updated_for_Lords_Report.pdf

Read points 4&5 and weep.

In saying that I did think that the law needed to be updated but this is a gross over reaction IMHO.
 
The new law has caused myself and a friend to be really nervous, we have two collies and one can look very intimidating when concentrating on something, we have two gates into our back garden when people come through the first the dogs hear and alert us. The bark and go into the garden and wait for us to come out. Now friend a and family just come on in as they know the dogs won't do anything but strangers wait in the little bit between gates.....now though that could be taken at
S feeling threatened can't it?:(
 
My local police officer has issued guidance stating that visitors must be able to access the front door without encountering the dog, and the householder shouldn't allow the dog to green visitors. It criminalises dog owners whether the dog is dangerous or not. It's a joke.
 
Can't take the dog out anywhere can't leave it in the garden...and they wonder why dogs and people aren't socialized,we call ourselves a nation of dog lovers!!?
 
The dog signs are there to deter before they get onto your property. The best one I have seen is "lots of illegal practices happen here the dogs are well trained compared to the humans"
 
OP - unless you change something, like how you let the dogs out, there really is nothing you can do. We have a large front drive a good 60ft from the house but there is no window overlooking it that we can see out of easily. It's a wraparound garden and so we can't shut the dogs out the back. For this reason, given the new laws, the dogs aren't outside unless one of us is with them. It's just a risk we can't afford to take as if anyone reported one of my lovely dogs just because they felt threatened, I would be devastated.

It's worth mentioning that these laws are yet to be fully tested in court so I don't think we'll really know the true implications until we start to see the first few case conclusions.

It's not ideal, but I don't see any other way, unless you build a big kennel/run that allows them to be outside without being able to be an implied threat to anyone.
 
We padlock our front gates. There is a doorbell and a letterbox just outside them on our fence. No need for any unexpected visitors to proceed further than this, the gate/ door bell combo is the equivalent of a front door.

JRT has free run of the garden.
 
pennyturner said:
I'm a bit worried about the recent change in the law - you know, the one that says that anyone who 'feels threatened' by your dog, even on your own property, can accuse it of being 'dangerously out of control'.

My garden is large, and the dogs are frequently outside. One of them is a bullmastiff cross, who is gentle as a lamb, but quite imposing to look at. It's quite possible someone who doesn't know her could reasonably 'feel threatened' on meeting her, but I'm damned if I'm going to not let her out in her own garden. Visitors cannot alert the house of their presence without entering (unless they phone), as the entrance is 200yds from the house. For practical reasons the gate is open; the dogs are trained not to leave the grounds. We have many frequent visitors, including postie with no issues whatsoever, but I'm worried a stranger could make trouble.

Do I have to put a sign on the gate forbidding entry to strangers?
Thoughts anyone?
Click to expand...

Its all a bit ridiculous isn't it? All these signs warning folks about loose dogs.. I prefer no warning signs & anyone with ill-intention will have the surprise of their life when six dogs come charging towards them. Only one might bite (!) & quite frankly, if you're in my garden without permission then I hope she gets you in the privates.
 
_GG_ said:
OP - unless you change something, like how you let the dogs out, there really is nothing you can do. We have a large front drive a good 60ft from the house but there is no window overlooking it that we can see out of easily. It's a wraparound garden and so we can't shut the dogs out the back. For this reason, given the new laws, the dogs aren't outside unless one of us is with them. It's just a risk we can't afford to take as if anyone reported one of my lovely dogs just because they felt threatened, I would be devastated.

It's worth mentioning that these laws are yet to be fully tested in court so I don't think we'll really know the true implications until we start to see the first few case conclusions.

It's not ideal, but I don't see any other way, unless you build a big kennel/run that allows them to be outside without being able to be an implied threat to anyone.
Click to expand...

I am sure it will be tested in court soon and more specific guidance given.

If anyone caused problems for my dog, I would never ever ever forgive them, their relations or anyone they loved .... maybe I should put a sign up to that effect!
 
canteron said:
I am sure it will be tested in court soon and more specific guidance given.

If anyone caused problems for my dog, I would never ever ever forgive them, their relations or anyone they loved .... maybe I should put a sign up to that effect!
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Yep, me too. I had a knock at the door 6 years ago from a no win no fee solicitors clerk. He was wanting to take a statement about my dog attacking a local 6yr old girl. I obviously knew nothing about it. He said it had happened that morning and he just wanted a statement so that we could hopefully settle out of court. I said, "Ah...your client would be the woman who let her little girl run over to my dog then?" He said, well yes, but your dog still bit her. I said, "No, my dog didn't bite her because I had my dog on a lead, right next to me and I shouted at the girl to stop, which she did about 12ft away from me. My shouting made her mother look. Her mother then saw fit to leave her baby in a pram, unsupervised right next to a busy road at rush hour while she told me how her husband was going to come and kick my ass for making her daughter cry. I had to remind your client that she had a son, about 50 yards away that she had seemingly forgotten about. Is that a good enough statement for you?". He said he'd be in touch, I told him to knock himself out. Had a few weeks of fake doctors reports, old pictures being taken to the police (stupid cow forgot she'd put those pictures on facebook when her daughter really was bitten by THEIR dog about a year previously) and the dog warden wanting to come and assess Stig and Hollie and how I handled them.

The dog warden came, recognised me straight away as I did a fair bit of canine behaviour therapy with them and all was sorted.

People can be (insert word I can't speak here) so until the laws are tested, I won't allow that situation to even arise.
 
not heard about this new law. good job mine is on of the friendlist breeds going, although it could still i guess scare anyone scared of dogs of course
 
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My G*d, has the world gone mad! I feel threatened by the Low lifes that terrorise my animals, damage my fencing, get drunk underage on cheep booze and drugs. I and my animals keep ourselves to ourselves, if someone trespasses on my legally owned private property why should I or my animals be at fault. What the hell has this country come to when if an animal looks at someone the wrong way you are liable for prosecution. What an absolute boon for the no win no fee ambulance chasers and a superb way for people to make trouble and money!
 
One thing I do agree with is that the court will have to consider the character of the owner.

I've said time and again, the owner can make all the difference to the dog.

We had a lady with an American Pitbull in work last week- another lady complained about the 'dangerous dog' while it was lead out at the owners side while I was seeing to her!

Ax
 
Right now I'm lucky enough to be working somewhere where I can take the dog to work. Alice the big scary Bullmastiff x rottie is the darling of the office. She's a trip hazard of course, due to being upside down in the middle of the floor; not to mention reducing productivity considerably...

I'm relieved to hear that the character of the owner is considered. Does that mean that the character of the dog will also trump any paranoia of the 'threatened' party - i.e. common sense will rule? It's going to be a rough ride through the courts for someone, even so.
 
i understand the law to an extent- basically the postman must be able to make it to the front door without meeting your dogs! i would just have a post box at my gate. i have a garden flat with no proper high side gate so dog always supervised and not left to chill when postman might arrive as has to go through garden. he does bark at the door at people but as soon as i open the door- blocking him behind my leg, he is fine and most delivery people have had a chat and a stroke!

it is the 'feel threatened' part i don't get- if my GSD runs over to someone in a completely friendly manner he could seem 'scary'- but a smaller dog could run over barking and less likely to be accused. no- i do not let him run up to strangers! but i can see future legal action when people have accused owners of 'threatening' dogs even if they get no where near them.

i spoke to my dog trainer and she said also if on lead out and about even if they are barking you are in control so should not be accused. but if off lead someone could accuse your dog of 'threatening' them even if you think they are being friendly.
 
It has yet to be tested in court.

Basically the intentions are to cover postmen and delivery drivers, a child coming into a garden to retrieve a ball, visitors to the property etc. If should not be successful against owners subjected to violent crime - with persons assaulting the dog's owners, forcing entry to a secured property, committing burglary, robbery etc.
 
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