New foal colour, can anyone identify it?

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Dam is non-reg "connemara", grey with chestnut and black fleabites, she was apparently "biscuit coloured" when born. Sire could have been a donkey but as we don't think we have a mule here it was presumably the chestnut welsh section D, again not papered. We didn't choose the breeding!

This is the little chap today at around 21 hours old, I originally thought he was bay but his coat doesn't seem to have any red tones in it but more yellow and his "black" points aren't black and there is a lot of pale hair lower down. The hair round his eyes, whilst pale, seems yellowy not grey. He has a dark dorsal stripe.

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So can anyone tell me what colour he is and what colour he's likely to end up?
 
Looks bay right now (although flash photos can be deceiving--possibly dun), but given his dam is grey and he has lightening above the eyes there is the definite possibility he will grey out. I've had 2 bays in the past that had the dorsal stripe. Dun isn't the only color that can have the dorsal stripe and the ones I had were both full TB.

Its common for bays to not show the true black points (ie. black legs) until the foal coat sheds out. They are commonly that mousy color he appears now.

BTW he is just adorable!!
 
I thought bays were born with lighter legs that turned black as they got older??
He looks like he might have the zebra markings in that 1st picture so dun?
 
OOh dear, he is so cute, I'd never get anything done if I had a foal, I'd be watching them all day long !

No idea on the colour, my friend breeds Section C ponies and every year I see the foals and I am amazed at how much the colour changes !
 
Thanks all, I've not had anything to do with foals so far so it will be interesting to see what happens. He is very watchable!
 
Connemara's do NOT have Dun in the breed - they have Buckskins which have been incorrectly identified as Dun. Foal looks bay, likely to grey out.
 
crellow4 said:
Connemara's do NOT have Dun in the breed - they have Buckskins which have been incorrectly identified as Dun. Foal looks bay, likely to grey out.
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Please explain the buckskin color in the breed? The Connemara Pony Breeders Society says Dun in the breed standard but does not say buckskin. Same of American Connemara Society, New Zealand. Curious where the buckskin is coming from.

http://www.cpbs.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5&Itemid=11

http://www.acps.org/connemaras/breedstandard.htm

http://www.horsetalk.co.nz/connemara/connemara.shtml
 
DRSsporthorses said:
Please explain the buckskin color in the breed? The Connemara Pony Breeders Society says Dun in the breed standard but does not say buckskin. Same of American Connemara Society, New Zealand. Curious where the buckskin is coming from.

http://www.cpbs.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5&Itemid=11

http://www.acps.org/connemaras/breedstandard.htm

http://www.horsetalk.co.nz/connemara/connemara.shtml
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Buckskin is caused by the same cream gene than palomino, so if palomino exists then you've also got buckskin. A palomino is a chestnut horse with a cream gene and a bucksin is a bay horse with a cream gene (a black horse with a cream gene is a smocky black). 2 cream genes make a cremello or perlino.

I don't know very well the Connemara registry but looks like they are mixing up dun and buckskin. They have also missed smoky black and sabino in their color list.
 
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The problem with Dun and Buckskin (which can in some cases look similar) is that before DNA testing no-one understood that different genes were involved. Now (due to DNA testing and a greater understanding of how the colour genes work) we know that Dun and Buckskin are caused by different genes. Connemaras have the Buckskin gene, not the Dun one. :)
 
Faracat said:
The problem with Dun and Buckskin (which can in some cases look similar) is that before DNA testing no-one understood that different genes were involved. Now (due to DNA testing and a greater understanding of how the colour genes work) we know that Dun and Buckskin are caused by different genes. Connemaras have the Buckskin gene, not the Dun one. :)
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Very confusing.So ,Highlands? Dun? My Highland is exactly the same colour as my old Connie..so please explain how you tell without DNA? AND, not sure I have ever seen a Cremello connie..but how do they occur then?
All Double Dutch to me ..please explain for us plebs.
 
Highland's do carry the Dun gene. 'True' Dun horses have a dorsal stripe running in to the tail and mane, primitive markings on the legs (stripes), frosting in the mane and tail, 'cob webbing' on the face, white tips to the ears and dark shading across the withers - Buckskins have a diluted body colour and dark points, mane and tail - that's about it. At first glance they do look similar but are in fact very different.
 
EAST KENT said:
Very confusing.So ,Highlands? Dun? My Highland is exactly the same colour as my old Connie..so please explain how you tell without DNA? AND, not sure I have ever seen a Cremello connie..but how do they occur then?
All Double Dutch to me ..please explain for us plebs.
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It's a tough one about the dun/buckskin.
From wikipedia:
"Since the dun gene, when on a "bay dun" horse, can closely resemble buckskin, in that both colors feature a light-colored coat with a dark mane and tail, classic duns are frequently confused with buckskins. The difference between these two colors is that dun is a tan color, somewhat duller than the more cream or gold buckskin, and duns also possess primitive markings. " http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dun_gene

Dun can also show up in other colors. You will get the grullo or blue dun (on a black based coat) and red dun (on a chestnut based coat).

The cremello is what I was taught was a true white, i.e. white with pink skin all over. But a true white can also be a maximal sabino. The cremello's got a bit of creamy shine to it's white coat.
You can see cremello connies on this website: http://www.thecremellosite.co.uk/CREMELLOPHOTOGALLERY.HTML
 
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