New horse worries - long moan sorry!

Oh dear - I was hoping it would be good news for you. I really feel for you - and your horse because it really isn't his fault.

Paula
 
Would it be worth considering turning him away for a few months and then rebacking him properly? I'm sure that someone on here could recommend a good professional near you.
 
I don't know to be honest. I've got so much to think about now. But all I know is he will be staying with me :) just want him home so I can give him a massive hug. My poor boy. Thanks everyone x
 
The last few weeks must have been very unsettling for him - he'll have moved 3 times when you get him back. Take some time, get to know each other and build some trust between you. I love working with Bree in hand with a dually halter and a long line as if I mess up I don't jab her mouth or bounce on her back.

Paula
 
After a good cry and a nights sleep i feel a little better about everything.

I know i am out of my depth with him and he does need to be started from scratch which is a massive job but i have got to focus on the positives and spend some time and get a bond with him. I am going to need alot of help and assistance with him.

I def do not think he is a rig as i checked his passport and he was gelded at 2.

I'm not entirely convinced about him being dangerious to hack in company as although i had only taken him out in company a few times before he went to my instructors he didn't ever do anything that i would consider dangerious.

I am going to keep up with my lessons and ride friends safe horses to build my confidence even more.

I've got to give him a proper chance and time to settle and if i'm no further on this time next year he will just become a pet.

I think i will give him a bit of chill out time before i start anything when he comes home etc i'm not really sure what else i can do!

I'll try and upload a pic of him if i can.

Thanks again to everyone for your help and support.
 
Good to hear you are feeling a bit better this morning. I guess you have unknowingly bought yourself a project horse. But it's fantastic that you are giving him a chance - he so easily could have been pushed from pillar to post having more and more problems.

Paula
 
Often I find the rig label is thrown about easily: " a prancing, snorting, misbehaved gelding? Must have some testosterone in there!" Unless the rig accusation comes from his behaviour around mares, I would take that with a pinch of salt.

Starting again is more than doable, and while a big and slow task, I cannot wait to hear you beam with pride about how far you've come together. There's hardly another journey on earth like it! Hacking will come with experience, time and confidence too.

Keep doing what you're doing: taking the advice of those most experienced and being enthusiastic about doing the best for you boy! 80)
 
Hi, I'm not sure where abouts you are but I would highly recommend my friend / old trainer (we moved area). He will travel. What your trainer has suggested seems a lot of things wrong and doesn't quite fit with your previous experiences of him. Also, has anything changed with him feed or tack wise as that can make a huge impact?

My old trainers name is jayceson (Jason) pferdmitfaher. He is german based and his number is
+44 7584 975801 . He works a lot on remedial horses and is brilliant with horses of all sorts. He'll also travel quite a bit and isn't hideously expensive.

I'm not saying your trainer isn't a good trainer for you but it can't hurt to get a second opinion (without him leaving your yard again).

Hope this helps :)
 
I've just been to see him and for the first time ever he actually walked over to me :) I stayed with him for ages in his field and he just stood with me having a scratch, kiss and a cuddle. Although he is always gentle he is not really bothered by me so it was nice that he actually wanted to be around me and he followed me to the gate. I know i can't give up on him now :)

FW - Thanks for the well wishes and i know it is not a massive job its just something i have never done before!

Vixen - i have not seen any evidence of this rig behaviour to be honest. He was turned out with just geldings at home and the mares were only the other side of the fence and he never seemed interested in them in the slightest.

Rocky - thank you for the recommendation. I may give him a call if i decide to get a second opinion.

Thanks again everyone and i will keep you informed!
 
My advice would be to change your trainer. The one you have now has it in their head that you are going to fail with him. You need someone more positive to help you now.

Is there any chance that this trainer is miffed that you did not ask them to help you choose the horse? Was there another horse that they were suggesting you should buy? It wouldn't be the first time that a trainer has written off a horse because they were annoyed the owner bought it and not one that they chose.

There is absolutely no reason why he shouldn't be fine for you in time, with proper help. And when that time comes you are going to feel immense satisfaction at what you have achieved.

My last bit of advice is that Welsh cobs that I have known looked for leadership and walked all over people who baby them, especially at 5 and 6 years old. It may be key that the person selling him gave him a whack on the bum and he behaved for them. I'm not suggesting you beat him up all the time but it certainly is possible to be too soft.

Good luck.
 
cptrayes said:
My advice would be to change your trainer. The one you have now has it in their head that you are going to fail with him. You need someone more positive to help you now.

Is there any chance that this trainer is miffed that you did not ask them to help you choose the horse? Was there another horse that they were suggesting you should buy? It wouldn't be the first time that a trainer has written off a horse because they were annoyed the owner bought it and not one that they chose.

There is absolutely no reason why he shouldn't be fine for you in time, with proper help. And when that time comes you are going to feel immense satisfaction at what you have achieved.

My last bit of advice is that Welsh cobs that I have known looked for leadership and walked all over people who baby them, especially at 5 and 6 years old. It may be key that the person selling him gave him a whack on the bum and he behaved for them. I'm not suggesting you beat him up all the time but it certainly is possible to be too soft.

Good luck.
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i actually agree with this.... seriously he will be one heck of an expensive pet to sit and look at. Sec D's do need to know who is boss and while a kiss and a cuddle is nice, he may need a rather firmer approach. If you're not going to part with him, get help from elsewhere.
 
Oh he definitely loves people and fuss etc.

I am not a pushover with him on the ground and i try not to baby him but there is nothing wrong with a kiss and a cuddle especially when your feeling down :). Although when i ride I am not firm enough with him and this is where the problem stems from which was why I was getting help with him initially.

I am going to get a second opinion as I cannot see how not taking him out at all is going to work with improving his confidence to be honest.

Everyone's advice has been great so thank you! I'm arranging for him to come home as soon as poss so I can get him settled and work out a plan.
 
With regards to my instructor she did not know that I was buying any horse etc so it can't be any reason like that for her to write him off but there is quite a few things that she has said that don't add up but it is difficult as she is a friend so don't really want to question her
 
Grumpymoo said:
With regards to my instructor she did not know that I was buying any horse etc so it can't be any reason like that for her to write him off but there is quite a few things that she has said that don't add up but it is difficult as she is a friend so don't really want to question her
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From this, it sounds like she is quite negative about your horse. Find an instructor who is positive about your horse and get them to help you with him.

You aren't alone with this problem. when I first got my chestnut mare I had a lesson with a highly thought of instructor, who declared that CM was only suitable for dog food, despite the fact that CM had actually been pretty good for a very green horse (one small nap at the gate, she was corrected and she didn't even think about napping again for the rest of the lesson). :mad:

I found a very nice (and better qualified ;) ) instructor who was very positive and CM came on really well. I even ended up using her to escort youngsters and a horse that had been in a traffic accident and needed a bombproof lead to get her hacking again.

I'm sure that you'll get there too, you just need the right instructor. :)
 
Thanks Faracat. I don't know why people just write horses off sometimes especially when you are paying them to help you. I'm pleased that it worked out for you in the end:)

It's all arranged for him to come home on Sunday and I cannot wait. I've had an amazing amount of support on here and from people at the yard I am moving from and I'm quite overwhelmed with it to be honest. Someone has recommended a lady who is local and should be able to help me with ground work so going to give her a call for a chat.

I did consider Ali Al Ameri but decided against it as I do not feel that this is something that should/ can be fixed in an hour.

Thanks everyone. Will keep you updated once he is home.
 
I have only just read this post - so my contribution is:-

1) Your boy sounds lovely
2) Welshies have a definate character all of their own. Once they trust you, they will be fab, if they don't trust you, they "take charge" - and their idea of "taking charge" often, whilst out hacking, is spinning and running.
3) Take baby steps with him. Ignore your instructor, as for what ever reason she is putting negative thoughts into your mind.
4) With my welshie, aged 5 he was a nightmare. Wouldn't (or couldn't) hack alone and many of my friends were not happy to hack with me - only the ones with lots of experience and confident horses!

To get him out hacking take your time. I used to tack up and take him out of the yard. Sometimes I rode for 5 mins and then got off and led him around the route I wanted to go, and other days, when he felt more confident I would ride for longer. I eventually increased the amount of time I was on board . Now, my lad is in demand as a confindence giver to other horses. We regularly hack alone for hours.

Give it time and you and your boy will be like this
 
What was he like hacking out in company?

I have a 19 year old welsh cob who will not hack out on his own - never has and doesn't look like he ever will! Luckily for me he doesn't do anything silly, just plants and wants to turn for home, and being a cob he is very strong! I know that I am not the most confident of riders, and it was suggested that I 'get rid' and get something else, but in all other respects he is perfect for a mature, not-been-riding-long, nervous, first time owner!

I moved to a yard where there are usally plenty of other people to ride out with, and to be honest, I dont bother attempting to get him out on his own very much. I have taken him out alone, but it is hard work and not very enjoyable, he gets his confidence from the other horses, so we ride with others. He is fine with people walking or cycling so thats always an option, or if there is nobody around I take him in the school.

As long as he is not dangerous, I would ride out with others and get him confident leading for short periods of time (mine wont lead either :rolleyes:) and gradually build up the time and distance in front.

Good luck, and keep us updated.
 
If this horse is far too much for you and you can't get on and do what it is you want to do, please think about letting him go and finding yourself something you enjoy. He's young and for the next few years he's going to need a jockey who can be his leader and his boss, you can't be that if he scares you and gets the better of you.

You aren't doing him a favor by giving him a home for life when he's young and he has real prospects of finding a home that can set him up for the future as a general good lad and useful horse. There are many horses out there that would love a home for life, who's rider wants to move up or has lost interest, who are a good match for you. Why stay resolutely committed to this one just because he's the one in your possession at the moment, when you know yourself he's too much horse for you? :confused:
 
I could have written this post 5 years ago! I to bought a Sect D 5 year old that had supposedly been hunted and done some dressage but having got him home he was a nervous wreck! He hated hacking on his own and would just stop outside the gate and refuse to move, with a lot of encouragment and somtimes having to get off and lead him he would leave the yard. I have thought so many times of selling him and finding something that would suit me better but have stuck with him and I am glad I have. Spent years just going on the same hack until he was completely relaxed going that way then just slowly introduced a little extra unknown bit to the route and followed that for a few weeks before introducing another new path home. He is much better but 5 years on I still find him spinning and trying to run for home but I have learnt that all he needs is a gentle voice and calming encouragment and he settles very quickly and will continue on the hack. I always ride alone as I prefer to, I like the peace and quiet. I am sure I could have sold him years ago and had far more enjoyment with a suitable horse over the last 5 years but I made the chioce to keep him, only you can decide what is best for you but it could be a long haul before you get him as you want him I still haven't!:)
 
Never underestimate the power of developing a good relationship on the ground.

And find a more positive instructor!

A few years ago I started teaching a lovely lady who had slightly over-horsed herself, and her original instructor had said pretty much the same to her as yours has said to you - she was devestated as she had fallen for her lad and did not want to part with him.

She came to me for lessons and we went right back to basics, and worked through everything one step at a time together. It's not overly difficult with the right support network and assistance, but it takes time. The relationship you develop with your horse along the way is more than worth it though!

Feel free to PM me any time x
 
montysmum1 said:
Never underestimate the power of developing a good relationship on the ground.

And find a more positive instructor!

A few years ago I started teaching a lovely lady who had slightly over-horsed herself, and her original instructor had said pretty much the same to her as yours has said to you - she was devestated as she had fallen for her lad and did not want to part with him.

She came to me for lessons and we went right back to basics, and worked through everything one step at a time together. It's not overly difficult with the right support network and assistance, but it takes time. The relationship you develop with your horse along the way is more than worth it though!

Feel free to PM me any time x
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I agree with this. You certainly have the right attitude to get through this so you are part way there already, with the RIGHT help and support I’m sure you will achieve your dream of having the partnership you want with your horse.

Something tells me your instructor is not the right person for you, maybe it’s because she is your friend. You need someone you can question without worrying about things.

Totally different scenario but my boy had a major operation after he fractured his elbow, I had only dealt with your every day knocks and bumps before and was worried sick when he came home from hospital, didn’t know what I was dealing with – you learn as you go along (as long as you want too) and the more you build up your relationship with him the more you will forgive each other for little mistakes. You will get to know his little quirks and he will get to know yours:D.
 
EllenJay could have written that post about my experiences too. I bought a green 4 year old section D who was a dream at that age, but I wasn't ready to take him out on my own, so we didn't hack alone. Then when I was ready, he (now a bigger,stronger 5 year old) just said no, we're not doing this. He terrified me with his spinning and bolting behaviour. I had people tell me that I was being too weak with him, so they offered to get on him, thinking they could bully him into going by himself. He did exactly the same thing with them. They suggested stronger bits - put him in a Dutch gag, Pelham, etc were regular bits of advice. I decided to do lots of groundwork with him; we were going to go out together and if it wasn't going to be out riding, we'd do it walking. So, we did lots of walking in hand - all the rides I wanted to eventually do, I progressed onto long lining, then we did all this in tack and then I gradually built up to riding him home. One day, I got on him on the yard with the intention of getting him up the lane, then getting off and walking one of our routes and instead we just carried on and went for a four hour ride along a route I'd never been with him. It just happened - we'd both decided it would be ok. We haven't looked back since this day.
I, like you, had decided that he had a home for life. I don't like schooling and wasn't prepared to rely on others to hack out, so was prepared to put in the time to accomplish it.

Think positively, don't do anything until you're ready to and, most importantly, go with your gut instinct about what methods may work with your horse
 
Thanks everyone for your stories of success!

There is no way I can just give up on him after only having him briefly and one failed attempt with an instructor. If this was two years after I bought him and I was still nowhere with him and 10 different professionals said it was hopeless then he would live out his years in a paddock as a pet. I do not see there is a problem with that at all.

Thanks for your encouragement and support once again. It's so nice to hear what others have been through and where they are now.

I know he is not a danger in the school (other than napping when going past the gate) and out hacking in company even thought my instructor states otherwise.

I love my boy and it's not fair to pass him on without giving him a chance and at the end of the day none of this is his fault.
 
Oh dear, I'm afraid I'm going to join the "other" side and say that I think you should get a more suitable horse, there are plenty out there you know. Lots of people do exactly what you have done and buy the wrong horse (Welsh Cobs are famously hot, and can be stroppy and difficult. 5 year olds are rarely the right choice for less experienced people), why condem yourself to looking after a pasture ornament when both you (and he, incidently, with a different rider) could be out there actually enjoying the experience?
 
cptrayes said:
My advice would be to change your trainer. The one you have now has it in their head that you are going to fail with him. You need someone more positive to help you now.

Is there any chance that this trainer is miffed that you did not ask them to help you choose the horse? Was there another horse that they were suggesting you should buy? It wouldn't be the first time that a trainer has written off a horse because they were annoyed the owner bought it and not one that they chose.

There is absolutely no reason why he shouldn't be fine for you in time, with proper help. And when that time comes you are going to feel immense satisfaction at what you have achieved.

My last bit of advice is that Welsh cobs that I have known looked for leadership and walked all over people who baby them, especially at 5 and 6 years old. It may be key that the person selling him gave him a whack on the bum and he behaved for them. I'm not suggesting you beat him up all the time but it certainly is possible to be too soft.

Good luck.
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Agree with this totally. You say he's not dangerous, he's fine in company, no problem with mares, doesnt sound like a rig to me. He does sound like a typical young welsh cob, and possibly needs firm leadership. I hope it works out for you, it sounds like you really want to get it right with him. Good luck :)
 
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I've tried to add a picture. Not sure if this will work :/
 
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