New puppy - reassurance needed!

[ecrozier]

Argh! Suffering a bit from lack of sleep a bit today. Was all set to be super strict and leave puppy downstairs in crate with us ignoring all whining, then read up again and all my puppy books say let them sleep upstairs in a box the first night or two... So up he came. And up we got every other hour! He did a bit of whinging in general, but settled quite well with a quiet stroke and a word of reassurance. But every other hour he made a real fuss so I took him out and he did wee every time, so I suppose it's a good result that we didn't have any mess in his bed this morning, and managed to get him outside at 6.30 for a poo, so we are still going well on keeping the house clean, but I guess I am just after reassurance that he won't need to get up every two hours for too long? I don't mind - do understand that puppies take work, but I'm home alone next week and am going to be exhausted!*
He's 8 weeks now. We are going to keep practicing with the crate during the day, and may put him in a smaller crate upstairs tonight instead of a cardboard box as the sides of that caved in if he made for freedom!

 

[Annette4]

Mine have always stayed downstairs. Means crying the first couple of nights but then they settled. Let them out once in the night for a couple of weeks then just went to bed a bitlater/got up earlier and increased to just over night.

 

[RhaLoulou]

I am not a expert just a run of mill dog owner! However I would leave the puppy downstairs and let him have a little cry then go off to sleep. My parents allowed their puppy upstairs when they first got him and they have had continual problems getting him to stay in the kitchen overnight and he is six now! If you wake him in the night he is bound to wake up and if you take him out he is bound to have a wee! Hope you get some sleep!!

 

[Crugeran Celt]

I have always left a puppy in the kitchen on its bed where it will be expected to stay but I have always had two dogs, usually one older one and a new puppy. Did have two pups together once with same results, no crying and two happy, contented dogs. Have you thought about getting another one? I really do think they benefit from company.

 

[galaxy]

We had H in upstairs for the first few nights. He would get up twice a night for the first week, then once a night the second week then he slept through. He went downstairs after a few nights and we had no problems with that.


I remember the tiredness though!

 

[Booboos]

There are about as many views on this as there are about parenting techniques!

Personally if I think a puppy needs the toilet I do take them out, it's physically not possible for a young puppy to hold in his wee/poo overnight and it's best to avoid toileting accidents. If you can tell when his crying is for toilet that is brilliant.

If you don't want the puppy to get used to sleeping in your room then I think you are best getting over this hurdle now. It's bound to be upsetting for a while because the puppy had been used to sleeping with its mum and litter mates and the adjustment takes a while. An Adaptil colar/diffuser may help.

If you decide that the puppy sleeps in the kitchen you have the following options (which funnily enough correspond to baby sleep training techniques);
- let him cry it out. Only go in to take him to the toilet, ignore everything else and wait it out.
- let him cry for a few minutes, go back reassure him, settle him and leave again. Repeat (usually through the night).
- stay in the room with him. Pop a mattress in the kitchen and sleep there until he is more used to the space.

and, most importantly,

WHERE ARE THE PUPPY PHOTOS WOMAN?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MurphysMinder]

I haven't taken pups upstairs because they always have another dog with them downstairs, usually their mum. However, I always suggest to people who have puppies from me that they try them downstairs but if they get very distressed to take them upstairs for a few nights. None who have done this have ever had problems getting them back down.
I would however crate him while he is upstairs, so that he accepts that is the place to sleep. The downside of them being with you is of course they will be aware of your every move and will wake more, and at 8 weeks when a pup wakes up it want to wee. If he wakes and you take him out keep it very short, take him out, give him the command you use, praise him when he has done something then straight back up and in his crate, no playing or further fuss.

 

[ecrozier]

Thanks all. I do have another dog who sleeps downstairs but that didn't seem to help, he was really making a huge fuss. Think I will pop him in crate upstairs for the next few nights then move crate downstairs once he is used to it.
Those who don't take puppies out overnight, do you just accept they will mess in beds? He wee'd 3 times during the night (in garden, with minimal fuss)

 

[Annette4]

Mine only had accidents when I over slept. But we were going out for a last wee at 11pm then up at 6am. I have always had puppies nearer 12 weeks though.

 

[Chestnutmare]

When we got our pup she was upstairs with us in a crate in bedroom she settled well with whine for us to take her out for wee but other than that she was great.
During day she was in crate I'm lounge in front of tv (kids channels on) a bit of a squinny at beginning but off we went out but popping back every couple hrs to let her out for toilet (we work by house) so were lucky there.
As she got older leaving her was easy as she was used to a routine of being on her own til lunchtime.
We bought a x large crate put that in lounge we leave door open during day whilst were at home then one night she took herself off to bed in the big crate so we thought ok if that's how you want it we shut door on her and went off to bed where we didn't hear a peep out of her all night.
She's now 8mths old and loves her routine she takes herself off to bed by 10pm as this is also our bedtime so before we go up we let her out for wee then she pops herself back to bed and settles til morning.
I do believe we have done well with her though she's been great to train

 

[LovesCobs]

I started with upstairs intending on gradually distancing the crate, to be honest it didn't help. When it was time to put it all the way down stairs it was hell! Next time I'm just going to go for it straight away, maybe sleep down stairs myself. It was very short lived though and we were then on 10pm wee and 6am wee by 11/12 weeks old (picked her up at 10 weeks)

 

[CorvusCorax]

I would start as you mean to go on, especially as it is winding the other dog up. Re the patting/reassurance, that's a very human response but it isn't in the pup's best interest long term, try to be the strong and silent type!!

 

[MagicMelon]

We got our puppy when she was 11 weeks old, now had her about 3 weeks. We immediately put her in the kitchen overnight, she did bark on and off the first 3 nights so we'd get up and let her out to pee etc., but after that she then only barked for about 10 mins when we left her to go to bed, now she doesn't bark at all but is up barking at about 5.30am every morning wanting out to pee (which is fine as we get up at 6am anyway). Rarely does she have an accident in the night, so she obviously holds it in well!

The only problem we're having is she's just started going to the cat litter box and knicking bits of their poo and bringing them through to the living room to eat - JUST GROSS!!

 

[CorvusCorax]

MM get a hood for your litter tray or separate it from her with a stairgate or similar - if she has open access to it and you're not there to supervise her, train her that it's not OK, she will of course stick her head in it!!

 

[Crugeran Celt]

Always put pup out last thing at night and OH gets up for work at 4.30 so pup gets let out then but to be honest even on weekends I don't get up until 6.30 but haven't had a problem with the puppy messing in the house. Obviously there have been accidents but they are few and far between. Saying that the pups I have bought have been 12 to 13 weeks old.

 

[inamac]

I've always put a 'puppy pad' in the crate (as far as possible from the bed) so that if puppy is desperate at night it's easily cleared up in the morning (in fact after a few days they've generally not needed it and turn to shredding it for bedding instead!)

You have to accept that once a dog gets the idea that bedrooms (and beds) are for dogs as well as people it's a difficult idea to shift.

 

[emm0r]

I think everyone has their own ways! When I got my pup she went into her crate downstairs from day 1, she did whine for 4 days but she then settled down! I go to bed quite late so she would go in her crate at about 10pm and then be let out for a last wee at 1 am, and I got up at 6 with LO. I gradually let her out for her last wee earlier and got her up later. She had very few accidents and is more than happy to take herself off to her crate. We also fed her in her crate from day 1 so she associates her crate with nice things. She is still fed in her crate now. Best of luck! We need pictures!!!!

 

[ecrozier]

Thanks all - we had a MUCH better night last night, he was very sleepy by about 10pm so put him out for a wee then put him in crate by bed, not a squeak from him, OH then woke him up and took him out at midnight for another wee, and I set an alarm for 3am and again woke him up and took him out. We then got up at 7, and each time he went out he had a wee quietly, and settled back down almost immediately, the odd snuffly noise but not distressed like last night. So I am going to stick with that routine for now I think, may try for 11pm, 2.30am and 6am in a couple of days and probably keep that up til he is 9 weeks old, and then gradually move the middle of the night one further back. 11pm is pretty average for our older dog's last wee anyway, and its very rare I am not up by 7!
Interestingly re dogs that start upstairs not wanting to go downstairs, when my rott was a puppy he had to sleep upstairs as we were initially in a flat and then a VERY small cottage both of which only had room for a crate in the bedroom, and when he outgrew his crate at about 9months he was never even slightly difficult about sleeping downstairs. In his advancing years he has sometimes come up when OH is away and sleeps on the bed next to me, but equally if told to stay downstairs he does. So I guess it depends on the dog. Once I am confident Nelson can go from 11pm to 7am without being desperate for a wee, I will move crate out of room then downstairs, but at least then I can ignore any whining knowing he doesn't NEED to go. So far we have only had one accident in the house and that was on the first day, so am pleased with currenf progress on house training at least!!

 

[ecrozier]

NB he will NOT be sleeping in our bed - way too hairy!
I would link to some pictures but not sure can do via iPhone?

 

[horseperson]

I always have my new pups in a crate in the bedroom by my bed until their about 16 weeks old, then I move them into the living room with my other dogs. this has worked out fine for us, I don't like leaving pups to cry.

 

[Superhot]

Good news that he has settled much better. From a pups point of view, it must be very frightening to be taken away from mum and siblings and everything that is familiar, to suddenly be with strangers and left alone. Far better to settle in to new home and routine gradually as confidence grows with the reassurance of someone being there. I think I would try to reduce the number of times you wake him up in the night though, as his body clock could adjust to waking and going for a pee more often than is really needed. I guess he isn't drinking anything once he goes to bed??

 

[ecrozier]

Horseperson, same, can be quite tough when I need to be re ignoring crying but only if I KNOW there is no good reason for it!
Superhot, yes, will stick with this routine til he's 8 weeks, then reduce to just one maybe from 9-10 weeks, then hopefully he will sleep through. He does quite like to have a little sip of water on way back in from toilet trips, he's quite a thirsty creature!

 

[MurphysMinder]

How old is the pup? He really shouldn't have left his breeder till he was 8 weeks old . However I am glad you had a better night, I would agree best not wake him, far better let him wake you, then he will hopefully soon sleep for longer. Have I missed the pictures?

 

[CorvusCorax]

I didn't realise he was so young either - that will certainly have a bearing on how much he cries/how unsettled he is, if he has been taken from his mum before 8-9 weeks.

There does seem to be a new trend to let pups go at 6-7 weeks as some sort of 'bonding' or socialisation exercise but being cynical, I suspect some breeders might have other reasons for letting them go up to three weeks earlier than was the norm back in the day!!!

This is purely a personal observation but I know people who got pups out of a litter at six weeks, two females, raised in different homes, and they were both moved on after about 18 mths as they were very clingy and could not take any sort of stress - I must add that's obvs OK for a pet dog but these dogs were expected to work and you could definitely see they were not as confident/independent as some of the other dogs. Like I say there is nothing to say your pup will be the same, just an observation and it's not the worst thing in the world.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Gah and after all that rambling, my point was, it's probably less what you're doing or not doing, but the fact that the puppy is very young and will be much more likely to whinge in that routine, than one at eight or nine weeks. Apologies!!!

 

[ecrozier]

He is exactly 8 weeks, or rather was on Wednesday when we collected him - he is technically a 'working' breed but seems most agree they are a bit out of place in that group really and their personality tends towards the gun dog more than working. Or that's what one breeder told me anyway.
But yes, exactly 8 weeks, so no concerns regarding that although I believe his mum has been away from the litter for a couple of weeks now. Interesting that many who posted earlier on thread had puppies at 10 weeks plus though, I think we will be a fair bit further on by then.
Interesting re letting him wake me up though - read the exact opposite somewhere else! That guide suggested I wake him, so that he doesn't get the idea that I come when he cries.... But you guys would suggest I should leave him until he does cry?

 

[ecrozier]

Sorry no pictures, they are all on my phone and I'm posting on here from phone so don't think I can link to them!

 

[millimoo]

Thanks for posting OP - my parents collected their new Bull Mastiff pup at 8 weeks of age yesterday. He's her 5th, and whilst very settled and chief yesterday, howled at bed time.
Thud ignored him, but he started again at 2am so moved him to the bedroom (must to my shock as they've always had them in the kitchen as pups)
They didn't hear another peep from him, and by all accounts he had a lie in this morning.
It's not the plan for him to be up there moving forward, but its interesting to read everyone's thoughts.
I shall point her in the direction of this thread

 

[millimoo]

Sorry about all the spelling mistakes - predictive text on iPhone ... Let me know if a translation is required

 

[kal40]

No advice just curiousity getting the better of me. What kind of pup do you have??