New puppy unhappy

Miss L Toe said:
They were up all night for a week, indeed they were unable to sleep due to the pup howling.
The vet who sold them the crate gave them instruction, they did not use the crate after night one.
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Perhaps if they had followed the vets instructions and persevered with the crate they would have resolved the problem, crate training doesn't happen in one night.
 
Miss L Toe said:
They were up all night for a week, indeed they were unable to sleep due to the pup howling.
The vet who sold them the crate gave them instruction, they did not use the crate after night one.
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You said earlier in the post that they would not get up in the night if the puppy cried to put it out for the toilet. The puppy keeping them up howling is not the same thing.

Giving up on the crate after night 1 was not the answer. The answer was to put the puppy out when it cried for the toilet, or at set intervals and then to ignore the crying. Putting the crate at the bottom of their bed was also suggested but ignored.

I stand by my statement, this is completely the humans at fault, not the poor puppy.
 
OP I put my word in earlier for what it is worth, I can't speak I bought a x breed last year but have learnt a hrll of a lot over the last 18 months I'm v lucky Dylan is an amazing dog never have had big problems with him. But don't you dare say what you said to Cayla she puts her self out for her rescues she advises on here and really helped people on here. If a.pup not being house trained was such a big problem for your neighbours she may have been willing to offer advice! Sorry but OP you are rude and out stir a problem here!
 
Miss L Toe said:
Sorry, the neighbours are elderly and lost their lovely lady dog four months ago, they waited a few months then decided to get a new one, not on a whim.
If the breeder they knew had one available it would have worked out, but her bitch was expected to have pups sometime in the next two months, so they decided to get this one from some unknown person. They were naive not morons.
My God, some of you on here have severe attitude problems.
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Im afraid the outcome would have been exactly the same if the prefered breeder had a pup available. These people had no idea of a puppies needs and how to cater for them. I take it you did not ask Cayla for a puppy guide because if you did and they had followed it they wouldnt have had a problem.

Its a sad fact of life people put more thought, and research when buying a washing machine or some other household appliance than buying a puppy.

What worries me is they will now wait for the prefered breeders dog to have puppies and will have one of those and the whole thing will happen again.
 
galaxy said:
You said earlier in the post that they would not get up in the night if the puppy cried to put it out for the toilet. The puppy keeping them up howling is not the same thing.

Giving up on the crate after night 1 was not the answer. The answer was to put the puppy out when it cried for the toilet, or at set intervals and then to ignore the crying. Putting the crate at the bottom of their bed was also suggested but ignored.

I stand by my statement, this is completely the humans at fault, not the poor puppy.
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If a new pup of mine creates in the night, I know he has water, a full belly, a comfy bed and a place to poo. He is lonely, that makes me sad but I know that if I ignore his cries he will eventually overcome his loneliness and get used to sleeping alone. Harsh, but it has to be done. Crates are not the be all and end all, they have their place but toilet training a young pup is not one of them.
 
I am a relatively new convert to crates, and actually think they are great for toilet training a pup. If you leave a pup with the run of say your kitchen, it will wake up and wander away from its bed to have a wee or poo. If it is crated it doesn't like to mess its bed so will cry and the owner is then able to let it out, thus puppy soon learns to ask to go out. I would agree that if once it has been out it still cries then it is just lonely and if you are a bit tough and leave it then it will soon learn to settle and sleep.
 
MurphysMinder said:
I am a relatively new convert to crates, and actually think they are great for toilet training a pup. If you leave a pup with the run of say your kitchen, it will wake up and wander away from its bed to have a wee or poo. If it is crated it doesn't like to mess its bed so will cry and the owner is then able to let it out, thus puppy soon learns to ask to go out. I would agree that if once it has been out it still cries then it is just lonely and if you are a bit tough and leave it then it will soon learn to settle and sleep.
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MM you beat me to it, like you we are new converts to a crate and with Caylas puppy guide our pup was no problem at all. Used correctly it is wonderful and Pip still sleeps in her crate but with the door open. We took the crate at night beside our bed and if she woke in the night we would talk softly to her and she went back to sleep.
 
MurphysMinder said:
I am a relatively new convert to crates, and actually think they are great for toilet training a pup. If you leave a pup with the run of say your kitchen, it will wake up and wander away from its bed to have a wee or poo. If it is crated it doesn't like to mess its bed so will cry and the owner is then able to let it out, thus puppy soon learns to ask to go out. I would agree that if once it has been out it still cries then it is just lonely and if you are a bit tough and leave it then it will soon learn to settle and sleep.
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Not if you've placed it on paper/pads immediately after it has eaten or showing signs of wanting to defecate, it soon learns that's the place to go at night. (i'm talking about tinies) As I mentioned in an earlier post, I need my sleep or I'm a basket case (hence why I only had one baby!) I know a certain dog trainer advocates the method of getting up every hour to take pup out, but she hasn't got children and lives in a flat the last I heard. All mine ask to go outside, it was a gradual process and one that results from repetition and consistency.
 
Dobiegirl said:
MM you beat me to it, like you we are new converts to a crate and with Caylas puppy guide our pup was no problem at all. Used correctly it is wonderful and Pip still sleeps in her crate but with the door open. We took the crate at night beside our bed and if she woke in the night we would talk softly to her and she went back to sleep.
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I agree, my pups were never shut in their crate overnight.
 
I have used the paper method for many years, but just found they learned so much quicker with a crate, and I like the fact that you are able to get the pup outside rather than them first learning to use paper.
 
I used paper with the first two then realised I had to re-train them to go outside :rolleyes:

A puppy is a baby and cannot be expected to go overnight without loo breaks. It will need feeding much later than 5pm if the next feed is 7am or so.

Some dogs are easier than others and the really would have seen a benefit to using a crate had they persisted. I hope it all works out.
 
MurphysMinder said:
I have used the paper method for many years, but just found they learned so much quicker with a crate, and I like the fact that you are able to get the pup outside rather than them first learning to use paper.
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I just don't like leaving young pups in crates for long periods of time/overnight. I would rather they piddle/poo on the floor than in their crate. During the day they are whizzed out to do their business and at night they go on the paper by the door. As they mature and can hold more, the night time doings diminish, eventually becoming non-existent.
 
blazingsaddles said:
If a new pup of mine creates in the night, I know he has water, a full belly, a comfy bed and a place to poo. He is lonely, that makes me sad but I know that if I ignore his cries he will eventually overcome his loneliness and get used to sleeping alone. Harsh, but it has to be done. Crates are not the be all and end all, they have their place but toilet training a young pup is not one of them.
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I totally agree with ignore crying for loneliness. But when I toilet trained I never "let" my pup toilet inside. I put him out, even in the middle of the night so he could go. Then returned him to his safe crate to sleep. I then ignored any crying he did, knowing that it wasn't for the toilet. Crates are a great toilet training aid for pups.
 
blazingsaddles said:
I agree, my pups were never shut in their crate overnight.
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I have obviously not explained it properly, when we first had our pup she was shut in the crate over night with the door closed but now she is over 10 months we leave the door open.

MM Caylas puppy guide was brilliant and covered every eventuality, I even passed it on to a friend with his Chi and he couldnt get over what a difference it made. His pup now uses the cats litter tray but that is a different story.:D

Its such a shame that the op didnt ask for one as I think the outcome would have been different.
 
blazingsaddles said:
I just don't like leaving young pups in crates for long periods of time/overnight. I would rather they piddle/poo on the floor than in their crate. During the day they are whizzed out to do their business and at night they go on the paper by the door. As they mature and can hold more, the night time doings diminish, eventually becoming non-existent.
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I got H at 8 weeks and from the 1st night he was shut in his crate (at the bottom of my bed for about the 1st 4 nights). When he woke a cried I put him outside. The 1st week he woke twice a night, the 2nd week once a night and then he slept through. He never ONCE messed in his crate!

I have a form of chronic fatigue, so also need my sleep :)
 
galaxy said:
I totally agree with ignore crying for loneliness. But when I toilet trained I never "let" my pup toilet inside. I put him out, even in the middle of the night so he could go. Then returned him to his safe crate to sleep. I then ignored any crying he did, knowing that it wasn't for the toilet. Crates are a great toilet training aid for pups.
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If it worked for you, great. It's not a tool I would use though. Shutting a pup in a crate overnight and waiting for the I-need-to-go-out-now cry, well, I'd never get to sleep anticipating it!!
 
Dobiegirl said:
I have obviously not explained it properly, when we first had our pup she was shut in the crate over night with the door closed but now she is over 10 months we leave the door open.

MM Caylas puppy guide was brilliant and covered every eventuality, I even passed it on to a friend with his Chi and he couldnt get over what a difference it made. His pup now uses the cats litter tray but that is a different story.:D

Its such a shame that the op didnt ask for one as I think the outcome would have been different.
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How young was your pup when you first crated her overnight and she was clean? I'm not disputing that crates have their place, but to expect a 9 week old pup to go through the night without toileting is absurd. If the pup needs to go whilst crated and 'holds on' due to the owner not hearing his cries or his reluctance to go where he sleeps, that is not healthy.
 
MurphysMinder said:
I would never expect a pup to go all night, that is the point, pup cries and you let it out.
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That is your point and if you are willing to get up every couple of hours minimum, good on you. I prefer the crate open, piddle and poo on the paper when the urge grabs you, back to bed, happy puppy, rested owner option.
 
Pip was about 12 weeks when we had her first and she did cry to go out for the first week and then she slept all through the night. After that she would wake on the odd occasion but has been an absolute poppet, cant believe how easy she was. House training was just as easy and she had in all about 5 accidents.
 
Fair enough it's what works for each individual. Don't think i've ever had to do every 2 hours I must say. Having said that at the moment I am waking every 2 hours just to switch the monitor on to check Evie's pups :)
 
Dobiegirl said:
Pip was about 12 weeks when we had her first and she did cry to go out for the first week and then she slept all through the night. After that she would wake on the odd occasion but has been an absolute poppet, cant believe how easy she was. House training was just as easy and she had in all about 5 accidents.
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That is good! I suppose I am recalling when I had very young pups (5/6 weeks old - don't ask!) and they would toilet every hour or so and having a baby that would wake every 2 hours during the night! Oh, well, it all worked out in the end! Pups are adults, daughter is nearly an adult and I am back to getting a full nights sleep!!
 
Im no saint, it was not me getting up in the middle of the night to let her out, Pip belongs to my daughter and her bf and they used to take it in turns to let her out.

It has to be 20years that we last had a pup and couldnt believe how having a crate made such a difference, I look after her during the day and the biggest problem I had with her was to stop her worrying the Dobes who have been wonderful with her from day 1, MM had I believe a similar problem with Pickle and Evie:D
 
galaxy said:
You said earlier in the post that they would not get up in the night if the puppy cried to put it out for the toilet. The puppy keeping them up howling is not the same thing.

Giving up on the crate after night 1 was not the answer. The answer was to put the puppy out when it cried for the toilet, or at set intervals and then to ignore the crying. Putting the crate at the bottom of their bed was also suggested but ignored.

I stand by my statement, this is completely the humans at fault, not the poor puppy.
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Its all rather pointless, what I said was that they would not put it out in the yard because the vet told them it was not to go outside, they were up and down all night with it.
I advised them to make the pup sleep in one place not all over the place, and to limit the area used for paper, again not all over the house.
It was howling continuously every night, not just when it wanted to pee or poop. They did not ask me for any further help, really I could hardly go an knock on their door and insist they did this or that. They are still smarting at the cost of the chrome cage, but I tried pup in cage, and it was happy to go in and out, so I agree they could have worked on that, but the cage should come with instructions, to me it was a reasonable size for a pup, but small for a dog and its water tray.
 
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Miss L Toe said:
but the cage should come with instructions, to me it was a reasonable size for a pup, but small for a dog and its water tray.
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cages dont need to come with instructions - people need to read up before they buy puppies:rolleyes: This sounds like the blind leading the blind. Sorry but they smarting at the cost of the 'chrome cage' but willing to pay £800 for the pup in the first place? The cost of the pup is just the mere beginning. Thank goodness the pup has gone to a rescue and next time a neighbour or friend needs help with a puppy perhaps point them in the direction of someone who actually knows a thing a two:rolleyes: As someone else said, anyone can be a dog owner, it doesn't make you a dog person.
 
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