New to barefoot and feet badly chipping down - what can I do??

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Fflurcomet

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Hi, new to barefoot and need some advice!

Had to take my haflinger horse's front shoes off 6 weeks ago as after she pulled them off (even with huge overreach boots) several times there was just no hoof left to nail to. So we didn't start in great shape but now it seems like more and more chips off the edges every day.

I have a pair of old mac g2 boots with firm easycare pads in so I hack her in those without a problem (no smooth tarmac round us) and walk her to the field in them (very stony track). I school and jump on the arena surface barefoot and she is sound. She is turned out without boots in quite a steep field with rougher rocky patches so perhaps this isn't helping but I didn't want to leave the boots on in the field as she is turned out 24hrs so didn't want feed to get soggy and the associated problems. I do put the big overreach boots on to try and stop rocks and stones making contact with her hooves.

Overhauled her feeding about 8 weeks ago - now on Hifi lite no molasses with biotin, baileys low cal balancer (with biotin and probiotic), seaweed and Naf Pro-feet. Have been painting on Naf Rock Hard, cornucrescine on coronet band and Kevin Bacon but is this the right thing to do? Hear some people say the ointments are a waste of time but anyone got an opinion on Rock Hard? I understand the feeding will take a long time to have an effect but will the chipping ever stop?

So is there anything else I can do? Is there anything I could paint on the edges to harden them up/protect them/make them less susceptible to chipping until better quality hoof starts growing through? It just feels like we took the shoes off to let them grow and they are getting worse...

Any advice from more experienced barefooters much appreciated, thanks :)
 
OP photos would be helpful but chipping in the newly deshod foot is really common. Often the foot is too long from toe to heel so the horse is self trimming it back. But also the foot has often been rasped along the dorsal wall, so the wall is thin and will chip until the rasping grows out. And shoeing can lead to a softer hoof wall in many cases and it will take a little time for this to harden up.

I am really glad you have taken on board the need to feed an appropriate diet. Not sure about some of the choices though. I'd drop the seaweed unless your horse especially likes the taste, it's a bit of a waste of money IME. You can combine what you spend on the Baileys low cal and the seaweed and get instead a more effective mineral supplement from Forage Plus or Pro Hoof.

I agree with the people who say ointments are a waste of time. Again spend the money on the quality supplements I mentioned above. Hooves are very good at maintaining their own moisture balance and don't really benefit from us messing around with that.

The hooves will harden up in due course with appropriate diet and exercise.

As I mentioned before - photos would be helpful.

Good luck with your barefoot journey
 
Sounds like you are doing the right things! My geldings feet chipped a lot whilst the nail holes were growing out and his feet were hardening up, but now they have been trimmed a few times they are much better and hardly chip at all :)
 
Thanks so much for your help Lucy it really is appreciated. I will try and take photos tonight.

I admit I dont know enough about the right thing to feed and tried seaweed because someone suggested it and the lo cal balancer because I wasnt aware of more hoof friendly options at the time, just saw it had biotin in. She is such a good doer and was eventing on a handful of hifi and some equivite before but I realised she needed something with protein in for the work she does and chose a balancer. So if I feed say the forage plus hoof health balancer for example, do I need to feed any supplement with that or not? Or anything else at all apart from a bit of the hifi?

Thank you!
 
Thats encouraging to hear, thanks Gemma. Her feet are so short that I worry if she chips any more off she will have no feet left! It cant put her in very good balance when I ride her barefoot in the school... fingers crossed she starts improving soon :)
 
Are there any hoof related benefits to feeding hay rather than haylage? I have the option at my yard but she has always been on haylage, no particular reason other than she likes it and seems to do well on it.
 
Fflurcomet said:
Are there any hoof related benefits to feeding hay rather than haylage? I have the option at my yard but she has always been on haylage, no particular reason other than she likes it and seems to do well on it.
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as far as I am aware it is lower in sugar and sugar has a negative effect on the feet.

personally I feel haylage is not a natural form to feed grass in so I avoid feeding it
 
Would not mind betting that the cracks, splits do not go any higher than the old nail holes.
If that is the case you have no worries, if they do go above them then you need to make sure the hoof balance as well as the diet is correct.
Remember: correct concussion promotes correct growth!
 
When I went barefoot with my Haflinger, his feet looked awful. Chipped, cracked, rough, just horrible to the point I was ashamed to hack him out in case people saw them.

Farrier said it was just old hoof chipping away as it was poor quality (pony was VERY fat when I got him and he had been loose on a 40acre field for 6 months!) Radically changed his diet to fiber only and resrticted grazing and once he had grown a whole new hoof (about a year) his feet are hard as nails and look excellent. Even now though they start to chip, or self trim as I call it, when they are due a trim anyway. Hooves are amazing things!
 
Honestly don't worry about the chipping. It's natures way off getting rid of the weak foot.

Hoof ointments I won't entertain, I feel they clog the hoof pores, diet and exercise all the way.

Diet wise, drop the seaweed and the lo cal, it's a v low level vit/min level product and a waste off money. Agree with Lucy save your money and buy a better spec supplement.

Good luck, take plenty off pics it's fab watching the changes
 
twiggy2 said:
as far as I am aware it is lower in sugar and sugar has a negative effect on the feet.

personally I feel haylage is not a natural form to feed grass in so I avoid feeding it
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You can get brand name haylage which is low in sugar. But haylage is acidic and this can upset the pH balance of the hind gut which will kill off the good flora and encourage the bad guys. Not what you want as the after effects will be seen in the feet. But hay can be very high sugar so if you have a fattie or foot sore horse it is worth soaking the hay for at least 12 hours and then rinse in clean water afterwards. If you are obliged to feed haylage then you may also need to feed a neutralising product. Some people use sodium bicarbonate. I have no personal experience of whether this works.

Unshod feet are often much shorter top to bottom than shod feet. This is not because they are too short, but that shod feet are commonly too long. X-ray evidence will often show that the coffin joint has dropped somewhat into the hoof capsule, so you will have a tall foot but a thin sole. This is not a good thing, but most people are in blissful ignorance, not only that this might have happened to their horse, but also of the unhappy consequences.
 
LucyPriory said:
Unshod feet are often much shorter top to bottom than shod feet. This is not because they are too short, but that shod feet are commonly too long. X-ray evidence will often show that the coffin joint has dropped somewhat into the hoof capsule, so you will have a tall foot but a thin sole. This is not a good thing, but most people are in blissful ignorance, not only that this might have happened to their horse, but also of the unhappy consequences.
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Just to elaborate on this point. http://www.hoofrehab.com/SinkingCoffinBones.html

Hoof walls on working barefoot horses tend to be just a tad (mms) longer than the hard sole plane. This is different to the overall length of the hoof as above.

ps. Sounds like your horse is chipping off long, weak hoof wall.
 
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Thanks so much for all the advice everyone, it is so helpful. I have never uploaded pics before on here but here goes...

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Hopefully you can see her hooves now!
 
In my opinion, looking at those pictures the hooves have not been very healthy for a while. It is to be expected that when the hooves are weak the hoof wall will break back to the nail holes when the shoes are removed, which has happened here. Where the laminae have stretched and in the walls there could well be white line disease further weakening the walls.
The real problem is with the imbalance between the height of the heels and the toes and with the weak back of the hoof the foot is probably landing toe first which is also causing the toe to wear and the heels to be left long. The heels are probably also long as they haven't broken away like the toe from nail holes.
My suggestions would be: get a trimmer to set the feet up to a better balance, feed a good supplement and diet to encourage healthy hoof growth and treat the frogs for thrush so she is happy to land heel first and soak the whole feet in Milton or similar to help treat the WLD. all imho of course.
 
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Some pretty unhealthy feet there :( But they can be improved and IMO even if you choose to shoe again later they need to stay barefoot for a while until they are healthier. Agree with the above poster they are out of balance, personally I would be looking for a second opinion wether that be a farrier or trimmer. Diet I have not had good success with Lo Cal in the past. Something like Forage Plus would be better value. And yes they need some soaking for the WLD and Thrush.
You will be amazed how quickly they will improve though. Keep a record with photos if you can it really helps you see the changes. Good luck.
 
Advice?

Keep the total diet sugar content down - so keep off the grass
Walk as much as he is comfortable
Add in a good mineral and vit supplement such as Forage Plus Winter to help feed these from the inside

And make sure your trimmer or farrier keeps the bloody rasp away from them for a while - these need to grow for a bit.

Worth doing the standard check for PPID next time your vet is visiting - it's free if you have the voucher
 
I will do a soak for WLD and thrush- is milton best used for that or dettol? I have footmaster purple spray- will that keep the thrush at bay with regular applications?

Won't my farrier have to use the rasp to balance the foot out by taking off some at the heel where it is too long? He is coming a week today and is very good, i will make sure he doesnt touch the front.

Forage plus winter hoof health on order and we are doing little walking sessions on the gravel and stony tracks, she doesnt seem too unhappy to do this.

I am changing to hay from haylage and there is hardly any grass in their field, they are coming in at nights in a weeks time so that will keep her off it too.

I really really hope in a few months time she will have something near healthy normal looking feet......

Thanks for your help everyone :)
 
Agree that diet is going to be a major factor looking at the photos. Soak the hay for 12 hours and rinse. Use clean water each time. FP is a great balancer.

I have mixed feelings about trimming. A good, experienced HCP is perhaps a good idea to have on board for on the spot advice. I wouldn't walk her on stony tracks without protection myself at this stage. The sole at the toe may be thinned. I would stick to sand, grass or smooth tarmac without protection to the sole. pea gravel (if available) is good for support but literally the size of a pea and at least 4 ins deep so it moulds to the hoof and supports. Larger gravel can be too much when hooves are compromised and often contains sharper bits.

Here's the link to the free PPID (Cushings) test voucher. http://www.talkaboutlaminitis.co.uk/
 
To add to my post above re surfaces. Put simply, stick to surfaces where she walks comfortably and think about getting some boots for stony areas.
 
The original codlivine min suppl has everything in it for good hoof growth, incl myocine which works with biotin, biotin doesnt really work as well on its own. If your concerned about shortness of the foot, divide the hoof from toe to heel buttress by 3, so 1/3, 1/3, 1/3, the tip of toe to point of frog should be 1/3, so tip of frog to heel buttress should be 2/3, so you could then divide the heel buttress to middle of frog, halfway mid line of hoof and it should look 1/3 as well, if this looks right then it should be the natural size of the foot,
 
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