NO he doesn't come with a full wardrobe!!

[Umbongo]

I completely understand both sides. You have a lovely expensive saddle and I to would be unwilling to give it....especially as you use it on another horse, however I don't think it is unreasonable to ask....as most loans do come with basic rugs and basic tack.

I have had 4 loans in the past, and all came with the basics. One came with ripped rugs and I replaced a couple of them which I didn't mind. One loan was ridden in an expensive saddle that the owner used on other horses, however they equipped the horse with a cheaper but equally well-fitted saddle for me to use.

I have always looked after the owners rugs and tack better than my own, however I understand some loaners out there may not be so careful.

Loans sometimes do not work out. I would be quite hesitant to kit out a horse that isn't mine TBH just incase it did not work out. However I would be happier to buy a few more expensive items once I had the horse a while and was sure that the horse would be staying with me.

Can you change your advert to state no tack/rugs? Or can you kit out your horse with the very basics?
Good luck finding a loaner for your boy

 

[HaffiesRock]

I am in agreement. I too want a loan horse to come with tack and rugs. And with regards to a PERMANENT loan, as far as I am concerned, no loan is permanent. The definition of loan is something borrowed.

 

[el_Snowflakes]

I wouldn't expect to go buying a whole new wardrobe of stuff for a Loan horse (maybe a few bits & bobs) if I was the loaner I certainly wouldn't want someone else choosing a saddle to put on my horse- could be poorly fitting & cause a lot of damage....

 

[MadBlackLab]

I personally think that for a loan with a full wardrobe should be included so you know your horse has well fitting tack and rugs.
I can understand your worried about expensive stuff getting damaged so maybe put a clause in the agreement that anything damage that isn't normal wear and tear is replaced like wise for the same item or something of similar standard of quality, or the damage is paid for.

 

[DragonSlayer]

If you don't want your posh tack to go, get a second hand wintec for him. I picked a lovely one up off FB for less that £100, got it fitted by my saddler, perfect for the job. You could do this, AND a second hand bridle too, that way....no worries over your good stuff.

 

[Elsbells]

Just how many times have we read on here when a loaner reappears to reclaim a horse that the loaneehas invested good time and money on improving?

Just for instance and purely a metaphorical question OP but if suddenly the horse your looking to loan amazed everyone and started to win big, could you honestly swear hand on heart that you wouldn't take him back?

No, I for one would not kit a loan horse out or school it to a high level, or compete it successfully and into the ribbons or resolve its existing problems. But that's just me I guess and I'm a synic.

 

[Polos Mum]

In the current climate. coming into winter, for the sake of a good loan home why don't you see if your saddler has anything cheapish second hand? Second hand saddles have crashed in value so you might be able to kit him in basic bridle, saddle and a couple of turnout rugs for c.£400.
Whether you agree or not most loans come with tack so it's not too much of a surprise that people are asking.

Mine is on loan with tack, out contract states loaner returns exact tack or £ value as stated in the contract at the end of the loan, it is a perminent loan and I don't expect the tack/ rugs back until the horse dies. Yes its anoying to have several hundred £ tied up for many years but it's my choice to keep him not sell him and if keeping him means keeping him tack, so be it.

 

[Inthemud]

As will be stated in my contract though, I would NOT ever ask for the horse back unless there was welfare concerns. When I took a horse on a long term loan years ago, I got nothing with him. This isn't a short term type loan, it's a permanent one so I'm sorry but I totally disagree he should come with anything especially given the price of things nowadays, you can get decent fitting tack for not a huge amount. I can't afford to literally permanently GIVE my stuff away when I have other horses...

I suppose the problem is that although you say this (& I'm sure you are a highly responsible and honest person), how does the loaner know that you really mean it?

Could you buy an inexpensive, but well fitting synthetic saddle to loan with your horse and keep the wow?

 

[1abs]

I have heard of loans where tack is not included, however majority of cases tack/rugs go with the horse on loan. If you're reluctant to send the WOW with the horse, why not send a cheaper saddle fitted to the horse?

And as for 'freebie rugs/ tack' when buying a horse, they're not usually free but included in the price...

ETA, you state you can't afford to 'give away stuff', invariably you're giving the horse away if on permenant loan? Perhaps sell the horse instead.

 

[MagicMelon]

Just how many times have we read on here when a loaner reappears to reclaim a horse that the loaneehas invested good time and money on improving?

Just for instance and purely a metaphorical question OP but if suddenly the horse your looking to loan amazed everyone and started to win big, could you honestly swear hand on heart that you wouldn't take him back?

The horse has been competed successfully his whole life, he is now older and I want him to have a quieter life hence hes purely going as a hack now. I don't want him competed again but I don't like hacking hence the rehoming. So no, there is no possibility of "improving" or starting to "win big" with him.

 

[TandD]

To be honest, what a ridiculous thing to say. I care for this horse extremely well (and have gone through a lot with him) and am extremely fond of him which is why I will be picky about the home he goes to. I trust that any new home would be decent enough to do the most basic things of horse ownership such as getting a saddle fitted etc. I mean how difficult is that?! But hey, you apparently expect some freebie rugs with a horse when you buy one... do you expect a nice box of chocolates or some nice clothes in the back seat of a new car too?

I have not said send your saddle.... I would not expect that, or your bridle, grooming kit, or his buckets. I wouldn't want someones full wardrobe for a loan horse, part of the fun is buying it yourself. I would be fully prepared to get a saddle fitted for a loan horse (I have in the past before done this) as I can always resell the saddle. However to send a horse with nothing, especially in winter when the majority are in rugs 24/7 I think needs to be rethought. Even if the horse came with an old turnout rug would be acceptable.

I do not expect freebies with my horses...... A largish (to me anyway) sum of money has changed hands and built into that sale is the fact the horse comes with a rug or two so I don't have to panic that when my new horses comes off the lorry it has nothing to its name.

I've never bought a brand new car. However I don't think you can compare a box of chocolates to the rug worn by a horse. If you really don't want to just giveaway the rug, then let the loaner buy the rug off you, the horse will then have something to live in while the loaner finds things to fit the horse!

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

OP, I understand where you are coming from, but for the sake of your old trouper, can you not pick up a set of useful tack that will fit, sort out a couple of rugs & a headcollar so he can at least go with a basic wardrobe?

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

My oldie went with full wardrobe listed and catalogued and secrely marked with his name, my name and my postcode. It was in the loan that he was returned with his full wardrobe or the loaner was forfeit for replacements which was signed and witnessed by both parties and was fully understood and plainly laid out. Your basically wanting someone to take your elderly horse and buy it a full wardrobe when the horse isn't theirs and I for one would balk at this if asked.

Permanent loan is still a loan, if you don't want not need him anymore and have no time for him then maybe do the honourable thing by him and PTS. Not being nasty but my older horse is on a loan right now and he went with a full wardrobe including feed and water buckets feed bins and feed. I wouldn't have just handed the person a naked horse and expected them to but him stuff. I would rather he was comfortable in his own fitting rack and rugs personally.

 

[MagicMelon]

Basic tack would still cost a few hundred pounds. So I now have to SPEND money to basically give a horse away for free. I might just give up on all this and keep him at this rate. The only reason I'm rehoming him is that he is no longer fit for competing and because he's such a great hack, I figured someone else would get the enjoyment out of him still for years to come, since I myself am a keen competitor and don't like hacking. He's a damn good horse and whoever got him would be extremely lucky, but hey ho I guess it might not be to be.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Basic tack would still cost a few hundred pounds. So I now have to SPEND money to basically give a horse away for free. I might just give up on all this and keep him at this rate. The only reason I'm rehoming him is that he is no longer fit for competing and because he's such a great hack, I figured someone else would get the enjoyment out of him still for years to come, since I myself am a keen competitor and don't like hacking. He's a damn good horse and whoever got him would be extremely lucky, but hey ho I guess it might not be to be.

I'm confused is it a permanent loan or are you rehoming him free to good home??

 

[PollyP99]

Basic tack would still cost a few hundred pounds. So I now have to SPEND money to basically give a horse away for free. I might just give up on all this and keep him at this rate. The only reason I'm rehoming him is that he is no longer fit for competing and because he's such a great hack, I figured someone else would get the enjoyment out of him still for years to come, since I myself am a keen competitor and don't like hacking. He's a damn good horse and whoever got him would be extremely lucky, but hey ho I guess it might not be to be.

You do seem to have a strange attitude to all of this. From the loaners point of view, I would be really peed off if I'd spent hundreds/more on tack and (as happened to me) the owner decides they need him back with 2 weeks notice despite him being on an open ended permenant loan. You have zero rights as a Loaner so I am not in the least surprised that people asked you this.

If you love the horse and want the best for him, send him with familiar tack and rugs and find a wonderful home for him, not that difficult surely?

 

[babymare]

Ok he maybe a damn good horse but and this is the but you are loaning. to any poss loanee you could terminate and surely if he has rugs send some for his comfort. Sorry i really am struggling with your arguement having loaned a pony out before. for horses comfort send stuff with him and then you open up more chances of a forever home for him.

 

[MadBlackLab]

You do seem to have a strange attitude to all of this. From the loaners point of view, I would be really peed off if I'd spent hundreds/more on tack and (as happened to me) the owner decides they need him back with 2 weeks notice despite him being on an open ended permenant loan. You have zero rights as a Loaner so I am not in the least surprised that people asked you this.

If you love the horse and want the best for him, send him with familiar tack and rugs and find a wonderful home for him, not that difficult surely?

Agree with this fully

 

[EventingMum]

To be honest, what a ridiculous thing to say. I care for this horse extremely well (and have gone through a lot with him) and am extremely fond of him which is why I will be picky about the home he goes to. I trust that any new home would be decent enough to do the most basic things of horse ownership such as getting a saddle fitted etc. I mean how difficult is that?! But hey, you apparently expect some freebie rugs with a horse when you buy one... do you expect a nice box of chocolates or some nice clothes in the back seat of a new car too?

Actually a couple of times when I've bought a new car I've also been given a huge bouquet!

I'm tempted to say given the circumstances you'd be better to sell for a nominal sum and ask the purchaser to sell him back to you for the same amount if they can no longer keep him. I know it's not the same as having control over his welfare but if you vet the new home carefully it could well be the best solution.

 

[babymare]

Spot on Handleycross spot on .

 

[khalswitz]

I'm confused is it a permanent loan or are you rehoming him free to good home??

I'm also a bit confused MM. You seem like your attitude is you are giving away - you don't expect to see horse, tack or rugs again. By loaning you are keeping ownership - therefore he is still yours, your responsibility, and no matter if someone else is enjoying him, that fact remains. For the right to still own him, you have the responsibilities - and the loaner's responsibilities in most cases do not include buying a whole wardrobe for a horse that they don't have control over how long it will be with them.

But if he is on permanent loan, you could have them start to buy things like rugs and slowly return yours as loan goes on and is working. You could have them buy another saddle once they've had time with him and you know it is working for both parties. Ultimately a loaner is looking to pay for your horse's keep, vets bills etc so that you can still own him but without the time and expense - so not surprised a lot of them don't want to buy everything for him outright as well.

A loan is very different from selling, and please don't take this the wrong way, because I've read a lot of your posts and really respect you, but I think you have the two mindsets blurred a bit, and you need to differentiate. A permanent loan is still a loan, not giving a horse away - he's still yours. And therefore loaners will expect more than someone who buys a cheap horse - because ultimately they haven't bought him, and ultimate control is still yours.

 

[Tiddlypom]

OP you're being very chippy about this. It would cost less to kit him out with a decent second hand wardrobe to go with him on loan than it will be for you to keep him on as a long term retiree.

You've a had a lot of helpful advice on her. Time to stop raging and accept some of it IMHO.

Eta I know you have the horse's welfare at heart in wanting to loan rather than sell, and I admire you for that.

 

[EllenJay]

What the h**l is a "Permanent Loan". - its either a loan or its a "give". Don't believe you can "permanent loan" anything. A loan, by any meaning, is temporary!

 

[Marydoll]

You do seem to have a strange attitude to all of this. From the loaners point of view, I would be really peed off if I'd spent hundreds/more on tack and (as happened to me) the owner decides they need him back with 2 weeks notice despite him being on an open ended permenant loan. You have zero rights as a Loaner so I am not in the least surprised that people asked you this.

If you love the horse and want the best for him, send him with familiar tack and rugs and find a wonderful home for him, not that difficult surely?

I agree with the above, the loan horse i took, his lovely owner even brought bags of his own shavings to help him settle, he did quite literally come with an inventory of all of his stuff, to help him in his transition of homes, that said, i still bought him some goodies and im now buying him as although she loves him, she feels her circumstances have changed and she cant give him the same time, so she knows hes well loved and cared for by me and it makes the sale easier.

 

[Woody2013]

Our horse came to us like that. A bit complicated. Is ours but if we decide that is no longer needed, they will want her back. Like first refusal. They won't take it from us. As she is ours, but they want to know where the pony is going if it comes to that. It is an agreement of trust. We will never pass her on. And there was no money exchanged. However, she was not advertised and we were contacted directly.

As it stands, she is with us for the long run unless something dramatic changes our circumstances. I hope not. And she came to us naked ... however they loaned us the tack until we got ours sorted. She has no rugs anyways.

Maybe is worth considering getting her some tack and rugs that you can see go with her before advertising it and perhaps you can get the right home for your horse. At least she will go with a good fitted wardrobe. Good luck, hope you find your horse a good permanent home.

 

[Polos Mum]

hay, hard feed, triming, vacs dentist of a retiree will soon add up to a few £hundred.

 

[Kat]

Buy him a cheap bridle, a well fitting saddle (secondhand or synthetic) a cheap headcollar, leadrope and either let a couple of your older rugs go with him or buy a couple of cheap unbranded ones. It will make him easier to loan and give you peace of mind. You can get all of the above for under £500 even if you buy it all rather than use your own old stuff. You can list it in the loan agreement and security mark it so it comes back. You can even take a deposit for it all.

 

[dogatemysalad]

I agree with the OP. She is offering a good horse on permenant loan to a non competitive home. I certainly wouldn't be sending a £1500 saddle and expensive kit with no time line for the end of the loan.
If the potential loaners were too mean or too poor to buy the essentials for the horse, they wouldn't be offering the right home.
I would however, send tack and kit for the first few weeks so they could be sure the horse was right for them and could sort out a saddler.
With a short term loan for a year or so, I would send tack and a few essential rugs.

 

[ester]

I might hesitate to send the wow out tbf but would send everything else with him and acquire a 2nd hand saddle that fitted (small cost for the peace of mind IMO).

A permanent loan is still a loan - they may have a life disaster and decide to return or you may ask for him back. Permanent means that the intention is that it is open ended from both sides but the reality isn' t always that.

 

[ImmyS]

If this is all an issue and you love the horse so dearly why don't you just keep him and get a part loaner to come and hack him out a few times a week? Seems to be the most obvious compromise to me? Or am I missing the point?