"No martingale and a simple snaffle bridle"

Grumpy Herbert

Grumpy Herbert

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Am watching the showjumping from Olympia at the moment. Luca Maria Moneta was riding earlier, and the commentator made the observation that Luca was unusual in that he rode his horse with no martingale and in a simple snaffle bridle. I couldn't help thinking that really this should be the norm, not the exception, but maybe I'm just a dinosaur. What do you all think? (About the tack, not whether or not I'm a dinosaur, lol!!) :lol:
 
The sign of a horse that has not been messed up. That he has been mouthed and schooled properly. Many a horse we've had in all sorts of iron wear and leather work. Time, patience, correct fitting tack and a dental checkup and they were in a snaffle and no martingale.
 
I use as little tack as is necessary. I own a lot of horses and only one is ridden in a running martingale. No other gadgets on any of my other horses. All of mine are ridden in Sprenger lozenge snaffles except one, who is ridden in a gag bit. It's the same with all of my liveries; less is best. I have to say in shows over here pretty much every horse is ridden in a simple snaffle bit and the only other gadget I see are standing martingales (but they are for show!)
 
Grumpy Herbert said:
I couldn't help thinking that really this should be the norm, not the exception.
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I fully agree! I love the way Luca rides too, he's such a soft and quiet rider. Shame there aren't more like him in showjumping.

Unfortunately, kids are being taught that they 'need' martingales and strong bits at all levels. I was told by a PC instructor that my 4-yo needed to go in a martingale as she'd thrown her head up when she spooked, and that I'd need to put her in a stronger bit if I ever wanted to get her in an outline (I hate that word with a fiery passion) :(.

The tack obsession really needs to be addressed at the bottom level imo.
 
Grumpy Herbert said:
Am watching the showjumping from Olympia at the moment. Luca Maria Moneta was riding earlier, and the commentator made the observation that Luca was unusual in that he rode his horse with no martingale and in a simple snaffle bridle. I couldn't help thinking that really this should be the norm, not the exception, but maybe I'm just a dinosaur. What do you all think? (About the tack, not whether or not I'm a dinosaur, lol!!) :lol:
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Watched the puissance and he rode in the same tack - snaffle bridle and saddle and that was it! I'm watching the world cup jumping behind the rest of you I think.

Saw him in Dublin too and it was much the same, simple tack, he has such a lovely attitude when it comes to his horses. Always seems to have a big pat, a smile and a treat for them.
 
There's such huge variation (especially in puissance) amongst showjumpers though. In conformation, approach, and jumping technique. Some of them are very toe first landing in canter, and look a bit over at the knee. Likewise, a lot of slightly ewe necks. Not to take anything away from their ability but perhaps the shapes that can be emphasised by the muscling associated with jumpers could lead to more evasion etc. *

I though the puissance had some nice riding, happy horses, and some very good attitudes whether win or lose. I didn't feel the stronger tack was misused, though I've seen a lot of jumping classes where it was, especially this year.
What a horse feels most comfortable in isn't necessarily what we see as simple (for example snaffles can be quite harsh and head/ mouth structure counts for a lot).

I would like to see GP dressage be allowed to be ridden in a snaffle/ single bridle. So many choose to school in one.

*Richi Rich is of course a big beautiful horse with a classic shape.
 
Ahh, I love seeing horses with less tack!
Ned actually goes much better with less.
When I started riding him, he had a flash or drop, a 3 rings gag, a martingale and a breast plate. Now he has a snaffle, sometimes no noseband (depends if I use my endurance bridle, or a normal one) and a breastplate (more as a neckstrap than for anything)
 
I don't have any competition photos to use as they are all pro shots and not allowed on HHO, but mine was de-gadgeted about 2 years ago and has not looked back since.
Here is a schooling photo...
1K9A6708_edited-1_zps1fddb3de.jpg


It is not that he is not a sharp horse, he came as a problem horse who would rear and spin, and when I tried him he was in a long shank combination bridle, rope nose band, elastic standing martingale, drop noseband, running martingale and draw reins over the top.

I am only competing him up to BE100 and 1.05 SJ, but that is because of my back not because of him. He is generally very steady and obliging now. He is in a snaffle, loose cavasson because we have to, no martingale, just a neck strap.

If he ever does get a bit of a flashback to his previous behaviour then I go to the neckstrap to ride, as I find this does not lead to rearing. I find that with Jay less is more.
 
Absolutely love to see this rider and his lovely horses go in the basic tack; why can't more people do this? Here (in Ireland) 99.9% of horses go in running martingales from day one, most people wouldn't even think of riding without. Bizarre.
 
I'm a simple snaffle gal although admit to a running martingale right now which I'm using as a neck strap for my benefit. That and a handful of mane for "spirited moments". Bitting up? Surely I'd just be drawing all that power down into his haunches and he'd launch me fifty feet!? ;)

I too noticed a lot of ewe necks - not sure how I feel about that as there were a small handful who were more rounded.
 
gmw said:
The sign of a horse that has not been messed up. That he has been mouthed and schooled properly. Many a horse we've had in all sorts of iron wear and leather work. Time, patience, correct fitting tack and a dental checkup and they were in a snaffle and no martingale.
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Surely that is only true if he brings all of his horses on from youngsters, yet he rides everything in the same tack and presumably he has acquired some of them 'second-hand'?
 
To be fair, he's a nice rider but I wouldnt use the words soft and quiet to describe it- his hands are high, elbows up and he's quite physical. The horses run and jump, he doesn't necessarily have much precision or control!
Watch Marcus Ehning to see quiet and soft!
All my horses go in a snaffle and no martingale
 
SpringArising said:
I don't understand how a flash or grackle makes for an ounce of difference anyway. If a horse wants to p-off, it's going to!
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Well all I know is I loosened the flash thinking oh we don't need that on this pony and it did indeed p-off with her, daughter didn't know I had done it, only I and the pony know this and neither of us has done either thing before or since so I think it tells me something!
 
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TheMule said:
To be fair, he's a nice rider but I wouldnt use the words soft and quiet to describe it- his hands are high, elbows up and he's quite physical. The horses run and jump, he doesn't necessarily have much precision or control!
Watch Marcus Ehning to see quiet and soft!
All my horses go in a snaffle and no martingale
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I agree. And whilst he's lovely to watch and has a great big smile the horse today had his mouth wide open and the other night his horse looked fairly stiff in my opinion. He jumped a fab round today tho. I also like Malin, she rode in a soft forward way.
 
I went shopping for a bridle a couple of weeks ago, cranks & flashes were standard. When I asked about a caveson, I really did feel like a dinosaur.
 
I agree OP, I think so many horses are totally over-bitted and over-gadgeted. Just because they are top class horses, doesn't mean they can't be schooled to go just as well in a snaffle (and no martingale - hate them!!). It's funny how you'll quite often see an eventer going XC in a snaffle yet very rarely a showjumper.
 
I am not a big fan of flash nosebands and the vast majority of my clients who started their lessons in one commented on an almost immediate improvement without it. They have a place for some horses, though a drop is preferable for me as they don't squash the cheek against the pre-molars.

I once heard Tim Stockdale say of martingales 'It's like a seat belt in a car - you don't put it on because you're GOING to crash, you put it on IN CASE you crash'. A running martingale should do nothing until a horse raises its head above the angle of control, as such it should only work when needed. I suppose when you're coming to a 1.60m oxer, if your horse suddenly decides to raise its head, a bit of help is appreciated! I'm not suggesting everyone puts one on, but if correctly adjusted, there are far worse things!!
 
MagicMelon said:
I agree OP, I think so many horses are totally over-bitted and over-gadgeted. Just because they are top class horses, doesn't mean they can't be schooled to go just as well in a snaffle (and no martingale - hate them!!). It's funny how you'll quite often see an eventer going XC in a snaffle yet very rarely a showjumper.
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So do most racehorses, I think you are rather comparing apples and oranges there though, eventers don't do jump offs for a start and having watched eventers show jump, well :p
 
I haven't been able to find a reasonably priced cavesson bridle for my girl. I use a flash without the flash strap and I have a martingale for a neck strap when jumping, I'm just too lazy to remove it! Less tack the less to clean ;)

As an aside I always think pius schwizer rides beautifully, but he seems to have a lot of gadgetry too!
 
Who cares what tack is on others horses, as long as horse and rider are happy and comfy then nothing else matters!
 
I love Luca's style ! It's great it works for his horses but each to their own! Professionals are going to do what it takes to enable their horses to perform at their best. I do however, think a lot of tack is a fashion statement :D
 
Well I guess the interest in tack on others' horses is all about whether the horse IS comfortable? :S

I'm not a fan of a jointed bit meself - most seem to see a snaffle as the kindest bit but I think a straight one with a bit of room for the tongue like a mullen is kindest, without any kind of shank obvs. That joint digging into the roof of your mouth and the squeezing action doesn't strike me as particularly kind.

But, I am a massive fan of Luca because he is making a start on cutting down on the gadgetry and concentrating on training and controlling the *brain* of the animal IMO. Most of his horses I believe are 2nd hand 'problem horses' so it's great to see them competing in just a snaffle and saddle regardless!
 
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