No rug am I being cruel

[putasocinit]

Cob by is not clipped, turned out during the morning brought in t lunch time, fed 1 scoop happy hoof for brekkie for his meds, gets 1 scoop at lunch time of dengue good doer with a handful of hay then at 6pm gets a medium haynet for the night, I would prefer to give him a bit more hay at night as it is to last him for 14 hrs, could I take his medium t/out rug off and leave him bare so he uses up some of his fat supplies. Poor boy

 

[Enfys]

No rug am I being cruel? .... only if he is cold/losing weight/would benefit from one for any reason

Why is he rugged now, for any of the above reasons?

If you are going to take his rug off do it early in the day when it is warmish and dry rather than choosing a cold, windy, rainy evening to whip it off.

 

[katie_southwest]

My cob isnt clipped this year yet, she just has a rain sheet on if its really heavy rain, naked in anything else.
People have already commented that she has lost some weight which is great. She seems quite chilled out to be au naturel this winter

 

[Irishbabygirl]

I wouldn't be worrying about the rug, if he's unclipped he should be fine if you want to take it off, I would be more concerned about the hay. Can you not give him more or in a trickle net or similar? That's a long time to go on one medium sized net...

 

[edgedem]

my fattie cob isnt clipped, out 24/7 with 2 medium hay nets a day (between her and shettie) and nothing else..

no rugs.

am i being cruel yours sounds ok! shes awfully hairy though!

 

[putasocinit]

It is a cob size elim-a-net, but he is an expert at eating as quickly as possible. I could double net it again but do wonder what damage it does to their teeth.

 

[Irishbabygirl]

My WB can polish off an overnight net in an hour, so I'm always worried about this. I double small net

 

[putasocinit]

He is rugged because it helps keep him clean, poo stains, his mother spoils him, he was in work which helped with the weight but I have got lazy with the weather, going to start lunging him again, I can't abide riding in the rain and wind.

Will take it off in the morning and only put on if it is raining and he is going out. How's that

 

[applecart14]

Cob by is not clipped, turned out during the morning brought in t lunch time, fed 1 scoop happy hoof for brekkie for his meds, gets 1 scoop at lunch time of dengue good doer with a handful of hay then at 6pm gets a medium haynet for the night, I would prefer to give him a bit more hay at night as it is to last him for 14 hrs, could I take his medium t/out rug off and leave him bare so he uses up some of his fat supplies. Poor boy

I hate to say it (and this is not a dig at the OP as such) but it really riles me how people think its okay to let horses get cold so they lose some of their fat. Its along the lines of "I'm not going to feed my horse tonight as he was naughty when I rode".

How would you like it if you were overweight and someone took your duvet off in bed so you could lose weight, or decided you had to walk around in shorts and a tee shirt when its only plus six outside to lose some fat from around your middle???"

Your horse should be eating 1.5% of his bodyweight in fibre and it is clear that he is way below what he should be eating, which is dangerous and phychologically damaging for him if left alone with nothing to chew in his stable for many hours. If he's putting on weight either exercise him more, or soak his hay.

This is what I've had to do with my horse and its made quite a difference. Don't worry too much about his weight, but put all your efforts into ensuring he has more fibre in his diet.

 

[Ninfapaola]

My cob is unclipped and just has a lightweight rug on in the wet weather. The only time I'll rug him up indoors if it drops below zero for several days and the forecast is for the same and when the east wind blow into his stable in winter.

 

[Christsam]

My WB can polish off an overnight net in an hour, so I'm always worried about this. I double small net

Mines the same. Especially in the cold with the WBs the weight can drop off so quick (and mines only about to turn 4). I put 3 stuffed full haylage nets up He never eats it all but if i only put two up its all gone.

 

[PandorasJar]

How would you like it if you were overweight and someone took your duvet off in bed so you could lose weight, or decided you had to walk around in shorts and a tee shirt when its only plus six outside to lose some fat from around your middle???"

If on starvation and being supplemented with soaked hay I'd prefer this to laminitus...

As an aside all mine are unrugged all year. I've only ever once felt them and considered rugging (for a period of an hour or so) apart from this they never shiver and are always plenty warm (including the tbs). I allow them the food, shelter and lack of rugging to build up a nice winter coat. Compared to the HW rugged natives who were shivering away in March, mine were all grazing oblivious and nice and toasty.
The only exception is oldies for a couple of days briefly.

All are felt to judge rugging rather than decided on a pre-set temperature or because others are. I also had a problem explaining to liveries last year that although their ears felt cold in the torrential rain we had... don't just up the rugs, feel your horse and many although looking cold were sweating up under MWs as all they needed was the rain off their coat/wind cut out, rather than actually warming up.

 

[putasocinit]

Applecart14 I absolutely agree with you and I admitted I had got lazy, and said I would stet lunging again, he actually gets more hay than he needs e.g. A big trug overfilled is what he gets as this is whit took out of his haynet for comparison amounts, he is in a big field with 5inch long grass for 5 hours, I think that is more than 1.5 of his body weight. If I could go to the stables at 0pm t night to top up his hay I would.

However re your post what about horses turned out 24/7 no rugs very little if none at all grass and only hay twice a day, think you need to aim your comment towards those owners.

 

[amandap]

None of mine are rugged even the TB. None are clipped though. Horses get most heat from digesting forage in their hind gut (when not actually working) so feeding enough forage is important. Getting the 'enough forage v weight balance' is the difficult one. I soak hay and use small holed nets to slow them down. I've tried various other ways of feeding and this seems to work best for mine.

ps. Just a point of interest... I've only seen my TB shivering twice in three years when it was cold, raining and windy. I haven't seen any of the others shivering, ever and they're all outside my back door.

 

[AshTay]

I hate to say it (and this is not a dig at the OP as such) but it really riles me how people think its okay to let horses get cold so they lose some of their fat. Its along the lines of "I'm not going to feed my horse tonight as he was naughty when I rode".
.

I leave my mares off so she will lose weight but not by shivering it off - if they're feeling slightly cold, they move around more which burns more energy and encourages weight loss. It's about keeping them warm enough that they're not miserable but not so warm that any calories they take in are stored as fat.

 

[lachlanandmarcus]

I hate to say it (and this is not a dig at the OP as such) but it really riles me how people think its okay to let horses get cold so they lose some of their fat. QUOTE]

I disagree, tho I do think all the other things should also be done eg soaking hay, exercise etc : they may not be enough.

Horses suffer FAR more by sweating under rugs put on by well meaning owners than not being rugged at all, esp if they are consistently not rugged as their coat develops to match it -and it will be more waterproof too. In addition they get approx 80% of warmth from feed and not their rug, so I would up forage before I would consider rugging.

And laminitis is far crueller than slightly chilly horse...... I learned this lesson the hard way believing I HAD to provide ad lib forage for my pony - only soaked hay but her weight increased until she suffered a lami attack.

In addition while no horse should be fed less than 1.5% body weight of forage (when losing weight) or 2% (to maintain or lose a little) under any circumstances, many perhaps most horses in the UK are overweight and giving large amounts of any feed esp ad lib for horses not in medium or hard work can lead to weight gain, they must have small amounts regularly if overweight, not ad lib.

Horses are not people, we do not have a built in fur coat!! The comparison is not a valid one. We should not anthropomorphise horses.

And horses rely on us to ensure that they are kept at a healthy weight. Rugging and ad lib feeding horses makes the owner feel better but will shorten the life of many a good doer. Unrugged and with limited but regular (soaked hay and oat straw) forage and exercise I still struggle to keep my ex-lami pony's weight down - and we are in the Scottish mountains, so down south I cant imagine why many ponys need to be rugged other than to keep them clean.

 

[amandap]

Another point to think about is how much does rugging mess with the horses natural thermoregulatory system? I don't know the answer but I suspect it does greatly. Rugs also squash the hair down so horses cannot fluff up if they feel cold.

 

[putasocinit]

Thank you for the replies which we on my way of thinking, what I meant to say was that by taking off the rug I could feed more hay to last the night and hopefully get a healthy balance rather than feeding more and the rugging up is storing the fat.

So I will take off his rugs and put in another haynet at night to keep the gut working.

 

[lachlanandmarcus]

Thank you for the replies which we on my way of thinking, what I meant to say was that by taking off the rug I could feed more hay to last the night and hopefully get a healthy balance rather than feeding more and the rugging up is storing the fat.

So I will take off his rugs and put in another haynet at night to keep the gut working.

Hurrah, horsie will be warmer and happier !! (but apologies if they wriggle in the mud all night and look like Dreadlock Desmond by the morning.....) :-DDDD

 

[PandorasJar]

However re your post what about horses turned out 24/7 no rugs very little if none at all grass and only hay twice a day, think you need to aim your comment towards those owners.

Mine are turned out like this. It's not for convenience. I check them all individually and only rug if actually required. They are also on 35acres of grass and maintain their weight, warmth and activity fine. They are hayed to ensure that they are never a length of time without food going through their system - I wouldn't dream of stabling a horse and finding an empty hay net in the morning. Read my previous post on that.

I actually think stabling without a rug is far worse than turnout as you've taken away their option to herd together/shelter out of cross winds/move around/forage for additional feed etc.

Rug a horse too young or early and you do more damage messing up their natural protection to changing temperatures than good. Over rugging is far worse than under. However any rugging should be looking at the individual and not guesswork due to temperature, what you feel like, or others rugging.

Mine are checked frequently and I've always ensured that I check at the coldest/wettest point of the day too.

 

[edgedem]

However re your post what about horses turned out 24/7 no rugs very little if none at all grass and only hay twice a day, think you need to aim your comment towards those owners.

im sorry but whats wrong with this? my horse has a huge field shelter to get out of the rain and wind, she is so hairy she could survive in the arctic, and she
is still fat despite being on rations & it getting colder. She gets all the food she needs in the day with a morning hey net and an evening hey net, two when the grass really goes, and it very happy.

i think rugging her would be dam right cruel and a waste of my time and money!

 

[Morgan123]

OMG - my welshie is out with no rugs and no hay and no stable, sounds like someone should call the RSPCA.

n.b. there is plenty of grass and natural shelter in the field.

I think people might be worrying too much, we all know our own horses and what does/doesn't work for them.

 

[edgedem]

OMG - my welshie is out with no rugs and no hay and no stable, sounds like someone should call the RSPCA.

n.b. there is plenty of grass and natural shelter in the field.

I think people might be worrying too much, we all know our own horses and what does/doesn't work for them.

very true.

 

[PandorasJar]

im sorry but whats wrong with this? my horse has a huge field shelter to get out of the rain and wind, she is so hairy she could survive in the arctic, and she
is still fat despite being on rations & it getting colder. She gets all the food she needs in the day with a morning hey net and an evening hey net, two when the grass really goes, and it very happy.

i think rugging her would be dam right cruel and a waste of my time and money!

If she isn't sweating she's obviously frozen solid

 

[3BayGeldings]

My unclipped tb x dales is out naked. I put a 100g on him one night last week as I felt guilty, went back to check on him an hour later and he had broken a sweat. So don't worry, I'm sure yours will be fine unrugged. Especially if it means he can have more forage

 

[mcnaughty]

I hate to say it (and this is not a dig at the OP as such) but it really riles me how people think its okay to let horses get cold so they lose some of their fat. QUOTE]

I disagree, tho I do think all the other things should also be done eg soaking hay, exercise etc : they may not be enough.

Horses suffer FAR more by sweating under rugs put on by well meaning owners than not being rugged at all, esp if they are consistently not rugged as their coat develops to match it -and it will be more waterproof too. In addition they get approx 80% of warmth from feed and not their rug, so I would up forage before I would consider rugging.

And laminitis is far crueller than slightly chilly horse...... I learned this lesson the hard way believing I HAD to provide ad lib forage for my pony - only soaked hay but her weight increased until she suffered a lami attack.

In addition while no horse should be fed less than 1.5% body weight of forage (when losing weight) or 2% (to maintain or lose a little) under any circumstances, many perhaps most horses in the UK are overweight and giving large amounts of any feed esp ad lib for horses not in medium or hard work can lead to weight gain, they must have small amounts regularly if overweight, not ad lib.

Horses are not people, we do not have a built in fur coat!! The comparison is not a valid one. We should not anthropomorphise horses.

And horses rely on us to ensure that they are kept at a healthy weight. Rugging and ad lib feeding horses makes the owner feel better but will shorten the life of many a good doer. Unrugged and with limited but regular (soaked hay and oat straw) forage and exercise I still struggle to keep my ex-lami pony's weight down - and we are in the Scottish mountains, so down south I cant imagine why many ponys need to be rugged other than to keep them clean.

Totally agree with this! My welshie is out without any rug, feed or hay and will stay this way throughout the winter, even it it snows! If he shivers, he will cope just as he would have done if he was still on the mountains.

 

[putasocinit]

The remark I made about horses turned out with little or bare grass I was referring to those that are neglected and you know that some are (if it isnt one of you then why worry) not those that are checked regularly so don't go getting high with your emotions, and there is nothing wrong with it, it's grand and hey ho wouldn't we all like to turn our horses out 24/7 in herds but it can't be done as not all yards allow it, also we don't all keep our horses at home so can't just pop outside to check the hay.

I was asking a simple question to see if what I was wanting to do would be fair as opposed to what I am having to do now.

Thanks for your enlightening replies.

 

[Littlelegs]

I'd leave out all day, walking round looking for grass will burn off more calories than standing in. Give only a tiny handful of breakfast for the meds & skip the lunch time feed. And ad lib mixed hay & straw overnight.
Regarding rugs, I don't have a problem with them burning calories to maintain temperature. But not to burn calories through being cold. Not only cos its miserable, but its counter productive. If you get too cold, the body slows down to conserve energy for vital processes.

 

[putasocinit]

So in other words more hay at night, no rug, he can't be out all day yard rules, hence the dengie 1 scoop chaff good doer and haylage because he has been on 5 hrs grass all morning, good grass.

 

[Wagtail]

If it is dry then you could leave him un rugged in the stable and out. If wet I would always put a rain sheet or medium/light turnout on. But for the length of time he's out, he would probably be fine.