Numpty Question(s) - RE Head Tossing

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hula

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Sorry this might be a silly novice question!

Mr Cob is thoroughly enjoying the delights of spring and is full of himself and quite excitable at present, with him having 2 prefered speeds out hacking; an irritating jog (even on the buckle) or bouncy canter, with a few excited little bucks in between. He will walk sensibly on occaision, but it would be nice if this happened more often. I love the fact that he is feeling spirited and full of life but I am concerned when he starts this on the roads and would like it to stop. When I try and make him walk from a jog he starts head tossing, even though I am very light handed with him. I have tried to say "No" and have patted him and told him he's a good boy when he walks nice. When I try and push him into a trot from the jog, we get the springy canter and he gets worked up and excited and getting him back to trot or a walk is a stuggle, and the head tossing becomes even worse, for the entirity of the hack and in the end I do end up becoming quite tense about it which probably does not help. I keep thinking I should give him a little tap with the whip and say no, but I have a feeling this will just put on the accelerator :o

He hates and always has hated any presure on his mouth, and you have to be very very light handed with him otherwise the ground beckons. He has taught me an awful lot about riding from your seat and usually has a good set of brakes either from the seat or a light pull on the reins. His teeth are regularly checked and have been so in the last month and all was fine, he also has a clean bill of health from the vet. He is in a loose ring snaffle. He is a good doer, living out at the moment and has a scoop of chaff with a vit/min supplement mixed in.

Is this just naughtiness? Excitedness (do not mind this in the slightest but the road is not the place nor the time). Is he just taking the mick? What should I do next?

Am I doing something wrong?

Sorry about the longness!
 
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Sounds like excitement really. Best advice I can give you is keep your leg on to push him forward into a proper pace. Also lots of transitions to keep his attention on you, & lots of half halts. I'd guess its the spring fever a lot have right now, he just needs to learn jogging etc are bad manners.
 
im having exactly the same problem with my boy, steming from my (ex) sharer cantering him everywhere and walking suddenly becoming far too exciting for him. Iv struggled with finding any solution as well but you def have my sympathies!
 
My coblet does this too, due to excitement/anxiousness! To the point of socking me one on the nose! I have had to use a standing martingale for hacking, and It's really helped! Didn't want to as I hate gadgets, but as I have said its helped to the point of almost removing it! Try one, hope this helps?
Kate
 
I think I'll try a standing martingale when I take him out tomorrow after work (sure I can find a spare lying about to try)... I think I'll ride him round the field first to see how he takes it... he hates anything round his head or pressure on his mouth, so fingers crossed.

He's the same when we have a little jump now and again, charges full pelt toward fences and has a paddy of sorts when you try and correct him :o
 
Sounds just like tom, hates any pressure on his mouth, and gets excited jumping too, I haven't put the martingale on when jumping as not sure if u can jump in a standing or not? Good luck, let us know how he goes in it?
Kate
 
He will do when he's concentrating... I've never tried when out and about, but will give in a go and pray he's listening.

He is lovely! Just being a bit of a pain at the moment as a whole... and has barged out of the stable today straight down the yard... into another horses stable (door open, horse getting collected from field) and tried to eat its dinner. He's also been trying to replicate the "wall of death" around the edge field early this morning...
 
If it's the spring grass, I think this can be deficient in magnesium, so perhaps a magnesium supplement might help?
I think they are all feeling well at the minute!
 
My old arab mare would do this , so i started to do half halts and full halts, where as soon as she stopped throwing her head around i would allow her to walk on , she soon realized that hacking would take twice as long if she faffed with her head , and being an intelligent soul , soon stopped.
 
Yup, he's known simply as "the hoover" down the yard, anything edible disappears if left within reaching distance of him, he's broken his stable door barging it down before... after food (good job YO found it funny and OH managed to fix it very swiftly), untied himself during the day whilst waiting his turn for the farrier and was found eating performance feed.

Love him to bits though, he loves cuddles, he loves people, loves dogs, loves children, is traffic proof, but when he's good he's saintly and when he's bad... you don't half know about it.

Oh and he's coming up 21 lol!
 
A standing martingale has its uses. One of them is NOT on a horse that gets a little silly on a hack. I also find it slightly bizzare that another post recommending one obviously has no idea what action it has (if you do know what it does then you'd know they can be jumped in). Gadgets have uses, but are not there to be used as replacements for correct riding.
Op- this is not aimed at you, just some of the replies.
 
Littlelegs why do you say that? A standing martingale obviously won't help with the jogging but will help if the head tossing is becoming an issue and it will do so with out acting on the horse's mouth.
 
Kal (aka the GreyDonk) also does this . . . I've found the only way to stop him is to send him forward into a proper trot, give him a really loose rein and ride from my seat. With him, it's his way of expressing impatience. I do hack him in a running martingale - but that's more so I have an extra strap to grab if he does one of his trademark mahoosive spooks and it doesn't seem to have much affect on his head carriage.

I also agree with whoever suggested getting him thinking by doing some "work" . . . this is also something I do with Kal. If I get him doing something that engages his brain (leg yield, a little shoulder in, or just some flexion to the left/right) then he's less likely to become impatient/jig joggy.

P

P.S. I don't put a stronger bit in his mouth when we hack - he goes in his french link snaffle - and I don't use a flash . . . if he really wants to GO he will, no matter what equipment he is wearing - he is much, much bigger and stronger than I am . . . the best way for me to control him is to engage his brain rather than force his body - he may be bigger and stronger, but I have a bigger brain ;)
 
Same advice really as I gave in my original reply, & as others have said too, just ride him through it.
The reason I say this is because I hate seeing gadgets misused. The first port of call should alway
 
Sorry phone. Should always be to ride a horse through a problem, even if a standing martingale is needed, you still need to ride forwards.
A standing won't help a bit of head tossing, only works when the head reaches a certain height.
 
littlelegs said:
Same advice really as I gave in my original reply, & as others have said too, just ride him through it.
The reason I say this is because I hate seeing gadgets misused. The first port of call should alway
Click to expand...

littlelegs said:
Sorry phone. Should always be to ride a horse through a problem, even if a standing martingale is needed, you still need to ride forwards.
A standing won't help a bit of head tossing, only works when the head reaches a certain height.
Click to expand...

Why on earth do you think the OP would misuse a gadget?

Of course the ideal solution is to retrain but often there is a need for something to keep people safe in the interim. Using a standing martingale will not do any harm if it is correctly fitted so why put the OP off it?

A correctly fitted standing martingale will only come into play when the horse throws its head a certain height, when it comes into play it acts on the nose rather than the mouth. If the head tossing does not go high enough or if the horse doesn't toss its head the martingale does nothing. I hardly see what harm putting one on for hacking will do, whereas it could prevent the OP getting a black eye, a broken nose or losing a few teeth. It also gives the OP a neck strap to hold onto.

We aren't talking about Rolkur here, its a standing martingale.

The OP knows she needs to ride through it and she has been given good advice about doing transitions and lateral work to keep her horse focused. Adding a standing martingale will simply help keep her safe.
 
I don't have any reason to believe the op will misuse it & I apologise if that's the impression I gave. However one reply in particular implied a standing martingale was the solution which its not imo. Mis-use to me doesn't necessarily imply cruelty, in the same way if someone had recommended a pair of over reach boots, I think it is just a waste of the ops time. The harm comes from leading the op to believe tack is her answer to a horse that is doing more than just head tossing.
I also quite strongly believe that no-one should be using any training aid or gadget that they don't already understand the use of, even if an instructor recommends one to a client, I would expect them to explain why & how to use it.
 
littlelegs said:
I don't have any reason to believe the op will misuse it & I apologise if that's the impression I gave. However one reply in particular implied a standing martingale was the solution which its not imo. Mis-use to me doesn't necessarily imply cruelty, in the same way if someone had recommended a pair of over reach boots, I think it is just a waste of the ops time. The harm comes from leading the op to believe tack is her answer to a horse that is doing more than just head tossing.
I also quite strongly believe that no-one should be using any training aid or gadget that they don't already understand the use of, even if an instructor recommends one to a client, I would expect them to explain why & how to use it.
Click to expand...

I quite agree that no one should use a piece of equipment without understanding its action or how to fit it. However I don't think that using a standing martingale is a waste of time, and neither is advising overreach boots. Both can be used as safety precautions, put on to prevent injury if something happens, just like your riding hat or a seatbelt.

My horse is booted up whenever she is ridden. Most of the time her boots are just a waste of time, I faff about putting them on a fidgetty horse, then I faff around taking them off again, then I have to clean the bloody things. But it is worth it for the very odd occasion when she catches herself, trips, or gets trodden on.

If the OP puts on a standing martingale it may just be one more thing to clean but it won't cause problems if it isn't needed. It won't solve all her problems. However if the head tossing gets extreme she has a safety precaution and can be reassured that she won't end up with a face full of her horses neck and potentially a nasty injury.

I have seen someone get their nose broken and lose a tooth when their face came into contact with the horse's neck.
 
Kat- I didn't make the point about the boots very clearly. I too use boots & have no problem with anyone else doing so, I simply meant in the case of the op, if someone had suggested over reach boots as a solution to her problem, I would also have classed it as misuse. I too have seen broken noses etc, i've also seen a very frustrated horse snap a martingale that had been fitted too tight by an owner who didn't understand its correct use & therefore how to fit it.
 
You seem to be contradicting yourself.....

littlelegs said:
A standing martingale has its uses. One of them is NOT on a horse that gets a little silly on a hack.
Click to expand...

In light of what you have said since would it not have been better to say that the martingale will only help if the head tossing gets to a certain level and that schooling/riding through is needed too. You could also have offered a little advice on how to fit a standing martingale rather than talking about misuse of "gadgets".

Not very helpful to the OP.
 
Plus the horse is twenty one!I don't think he will be reschooled in a hurry! If the horse is tossing its head and being daft then where is the harm in using a correctly fitting martingale to help stop the behaviour and more importantly , assist the rider with gaining control. In an ideal world all horses would be perfect but they are not. Therefore, an artificial aid, such as a martingale might just help.
Goodness, if we all think that by using a martingale is proof of lack of schooling all the top riders in the world better really think their training methods as its very rare to see any jumping horse without one!
 
As I read the first post from the op, general bouncing about was her issue. The head tossing only appeared to come into play when asking him to come back to walk. I therefore offered advice on how to prevent the misbehaving in the first place. Without knowing the ops level of ability or her horse, I am certainly not going to tell her how to fit tack over an internet forum. In fact, if I had read that the ops main problem was the horse lifting his head to a height to a point I felt she needed a standing martingale, given she has said she is a novice I would have suggested a riding instructors help.
 
So why rubbish someone else's perfectly valid and helpful suggestion?

Why not say, "if you are going to use a standing martingale make sure you know how to fit it correctly" or "you are aware that a standing martingale will only stop the pony throwing his head above a certain height, and won't affect the jogging and bouncing".

Fitting a standing martingale isn't rocket science, it isn't beyond the ability of fairly inexperienced riders. I remember it being tested when I did my BHS progressive tests, it might be in the pony club D test too....... if someone doesn't know how to fit one they could have an instructor or experienced friend do it for them the first time. A standing martingale is pretty difficult to misuse even for a novice, it isn't like draw reins or spurs that require a level of riding skill.
 
Charlie 76- i'm assuming that's aimed at me? I don't recall saying its proof of lack of schooling? I just stand by the fact if a horse is jogging & generally bouncing round, I think its unfair to lead the op to believe a martingale is the solution to her problems.
 
Kat- I agree a novice can learn to fit one, however like I said if I thought she required one I think it is best she fits it under the eye of someone who can explain both the use & fit to her. Like I say, to me mis-use is anything being used for a purpose it was not intended for, whether that's a martingale to stop jogging or anything else, not whether its cruel.
Also I will phrase my responses however I please, I would not tell you how to phrase yours, please extend the same courtesy to me.
 
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