JadeWisc
Well-Known Member
jem...I see your point. I understand where you are coming from
Ok ..I am just going to SAY IT "Only in America"
- Thread starter JadeWisc
- Start date
JadeWisc
Well-Known Member
wanted to add to above. As I said I truly understand where you are coming from jem. But Gt's and Tia are from The UK. I suppose they have a right to discuss an opinion of theirs based on a place they have lived. .Although I truly understand how your experience could be far different then they describe my problem is with people who make assumptions or opinions on places they know little about or have never been to.It would be far different if say "I" had made comments about Yob's. I would have been very ignorant to even attempt to profess I know anything about life in the UK
Very good points you have made though.
Very good points you have made though.
0
Guest
I understand the point that you are making and therefore am not questioning Tia or Gts entitlement to an opinion on the UK, I am simply pointing out that this will not help to make the point, that you are trying to make. I personally do not care if the point is well received or not as firstly I am not an American so although I wouldn't make sweeping comments about the place, it doesn't particularly bother me when others do and secondly, in my case, it is preaching to the converted anyway!!
Tia, obviously loads threads do go off the original topic and it doesn't matter but in this case, the off topic points being made will probably result in people ignoring the original point (as it did for you guys in the "Only in America" posts).
Tia, obviously loads threads do go off the original topic and it doesn't matter but in this case, the off topic points being made will probably result in people ignoring the original point (as it did for you guys in the "Only in America" posts).
Tia
Well-Known Member
God you're a sensible person. Well said.
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
This has been interesting reading but I don't intend to go in too deep as I don't know enough about your subjects, however I do have to take issue with this.....
[ QUOTE ]
.....you don't go into the well known rowdy areas.
[/ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately, some people here just do not have that choice because it has sprung up everywhere to a certain degree. Even our village has not been immune to it; sometimes having crowds of teenagers hanging about either around the Cross or the paper shop. A lot of the time, these are harmless, having a laugh, after all, there's nowhere else to go, no youth clubs or some such; but it can be intimidating, even for me!
I had heard about the gangs and honestly didn't give them a thought as it doesn't affect us where we live, but one night I went to the shop late (to pick up H & H and some milk!) they were all gathered around there and it was eerie walking through them for me; I can imagine how intimidating it could have been for old people. Sadly, the village does, like a lot of other places here, have a drug problem which doesn't seem to be anywhere near being sorted out - all of our police are too busy catching speeding motorist to bother about what is happening on their patch I'm afraid, whereas before human rights and that lot of tosh came in, the village bobby would have nipped it all in the bud by giving them a clip around the ear and telling their parents - many of which, even worse in my eyes, don't give a damn what little Johnny has been up to! In a lot of areas, not just big towns and cities, the word RESPECT is well and truely dead which is horrific to me; and guess what, in many instances, it is the newcommers (from the towns and cities
) that are the instigaters of the problems; how that gets sorted out, Lord alone knows. It's not a new thing either; my stepmother, back in the '80s in Croydon, would not dream of going out at night, even in company, it was starting even then and the diminishment of the police force along with the ability to give them some clout (literally!
) has done an awful lot to allow it to continue.
I love England; there is nowhere else I would rather be and in spite of its size, there are still places relatively untouched by yobs and drugs so it is still a great place to visit but I am very sad that it has been allowed to become a shambles due in the main, to bad, ineffectual policing which has got to fall at the feet of governments and the human rights brigades by tying their hands behind their backs and taking bobbies off the beat but that's another story! Like you (Jade, Tia, GTS etc) I can see the good and bad of my country, nowhere is perfect.
But, I can't be alone in wanting my old safe England back surely?
[ QUOTE ]
.....you don't go into the well known rowdy areas.
[/ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately, some people here just do not have that choice because it has sprung up everywhere to a certain degree. Even our village has not been immune to it; sometimes having crowds of teenagers hanging about either around the Cross or the paper shop. A lot of the time, these are harmless, having a laugh, after all, there's nowhere else to go, no youth clubs or some such; but it can be intimidating, even for me!
I love England; there is nowhere else I would rather be and in spite of its size, there are still places relatively untouched by yobs and drugs so it is still a great place to visit but I am very sad that it has been allowed to become a shambles due in the main, to bad, ineffectual policing which has got to fall at the feet of governments and the human rights brigades by tying their hands behind their backs and taking bobbies off the beat but that's another story! Like you (Jade, Tia, GTS etc) I can see the good and bad of my country, nowhere is perfect.
But, I can't be alone in wanting my old safe England back surely?
the watcher
Well-Known Member
There are groups of youths hanging about, and en masse they do appear intimidating..the vast majority of them are ordinary kids, they could be yours or mine and totally harmless..in fact if you dropped your shopping they would help you pick it up sooner than run away with it, in my experience. Having said that I do make a point of at least saying hello to those that hang about in my village.
Lack of visible policing may be a contributary factor, lack of facilities is another, attitudes are another thing altogether!
I can recall when TV series like Home and Away started on British TV, full of teenagers with attitude, and I could see that behaviour spilling in to real life. The kids who learned from programmes like that are now parents themselves and the manners and respect are diminished with each generation. Add to that the ladette culture and role models who engage in drugs, excessive alcohol and publicly lax sex lives and I give up all hope of there being a positive change any time soon.
Daytime TV programming even seems to celebrate this lifestyle with horrendous individuals parading their lifestyle choices (I understand in the States they would fit into the 'trailer trash' catagory which is probably the closest match for yobs and chavs here)
Stepping off my soapbox and to keep this in the boundaries of New Lounge - I also like riding nice ponies
Lack of visible policing may be a contributary factor, lack of facilities is another, attitudes are another thing altogether!
I can recall when TV series like Home and Away started on British TV, full of teenagers with attitude, and I could see that behaviour spilling in to real life. The kids who learned from programmes like that are now parents themselves and the manners and respect are diminished with each generation. Add to that the ladette culture and role models who engage in drugs, excessive alcohol and publicly lax sex lives and I give up all hope of there being a positive change any time soon.
Daytime TV programming even seems to celebrate this lifestyle with horrendous individuals parading their lifestyle choices (I understand in the States they would fit into the 'trailer trash' catagory which is probably the closest match for yobs and chavs here)
Stepping off my soapbox and to keep this in the boundaries of New Lounge - I also like riding nice ponies
Sooty
Well-Known Member
I have said 'only in America', but usually in relation to things that do seem to be exclusive to a certain part of the US culture, not horse related. I think as a nation, the UK is slowly inheriting a great deal of US culture, and sadly not the best bits. We have a lots of disaffected black youths getting into gangs and knife crime, heavily influenced by a situation that has existed in the US for some time. There is increased gun crime, and a vast increase in consumerism that didn't exist in my youth. Politically, America is unpopular over here, and as a result Americans tend all to be tarred with the same brush. We are being penalised for driving uneconomical cars, which in Texas you get a tax break for buying a Hummer (8mpg on a good day). I have American relatives, and when they visit the UK they are amazed at how much more like the States it becomes with every visit. Most shopping centres (or malls, as they are becoming known - see?) have a McDonalds, a Burger King, Starbucks, Krispy Kreme etc etc - you lot are taking over the world! Wal-Mart owns one of the UK's largest supermarket chains. What people really used to mean with the 'only in America' phrase was the ludicrous practice of political correctness and the sheer amount of litigation, but that too has made its way across the Atlantic and is happily settled in here and breeding at a very successful rate. Sadly a country is judged on its politics and its extremes, not its individuals. At least you are not seen as a vast vat of unlimited money free for anyone who can hang on to a lorry axle long enough! Oh, and we now seem to have proms instead of 6th form balls, tuxedoes instead of dinner jackets and people saying 'can I get a...' when ordering a sandwich. I think there is a huge influence on young people from American television and cinema, which is nothing new. As far as I understand it, America is a country with many factions. Some are truly living the American Dream, many are not.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Home and Away is really one of the most moral programmes on television, and any teenagers with attitude don't keep it for long. A lot of imported American soaps portrayed things like teenagers routinely borrowing a parent's car, or having one of their own, or a telephone in their bedroom - things bound to cause friction in the average UK household!
the watcher
Well-Known Member
Sooty - you may be right, I haven't watched it for years (I seem to remember an unkempt character with a collection of flip-flops?) but at the time it was noticably different to the usual type of soap/children's viewing..it might be tame by comparison these days. Wouldn't know, I rarely watch any other than the news, documentaries and films
pixie
Well-Known Member
This is why I want to move overseas to Aus/Nz!
dieseldog
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Canada is like the UK was 20 or 30 years ago when people still had respect for others.
[/ QUOTE ]
At least you know what you have to look forward to....
Canada is like the UK was 20 or 30 years ago when people still had respect for others.
[/ QUOTE ]
At least you know what you have to look forward to....
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
Sooty, slightly off tangent but you reminded me of something that happened to a client of ours and possibly could happen 'only in America!
He travels to America several times a year as he's the English manager for a large motor company (no way am I going to call it an auto........!
) going through the corridors one day over there, a secretary walks past him to go through a door. Typically English, he rushes to open the door for her, she gave him a very haughty look and barged through not saying anything.
The American he was with said and I quote - "I cannot believe you just did that".
He replied, "why on earth not, I was only being polite?"
USA: "You were so stupid"
Eng: "What do you mean, I only opened the door; it's what we do in England?"
USA: "Don't ever do it again over here, ever. You were lucky not to have been done for sexual harassment"
He couldn't believe that plain old good manners would be treated like that. Are American women really that thick and can't see behind a harmless polite gesture? Do we really want that type of attitude to come over here? I personally, still want youngsters to give up their seat on the bus and open doors for older people and I think, singly, the majority of British youngsters would; it's when they all get together that problems start, when they start bouncing off each other.
I also agree that tv has an awful lot to answer for, particularly these stupid big brother type things where the more outragous behaviour is rewarded. That really does teach good manners doesn't it?!
He travels to America several times a year as he's the English manager for a large motor company (no way am I going to call it an auto........!
The American he was with said and I quote - "I cannot believe you just did that".
He replied, "why on earth not, I was only being polite?"
USA: "You were so stupid"
Eng: "What do you mean, I only opened the door; it's what we do in England?"
USA: "Don't ever do it again over here, ever. You were lucky not to have been done for sexual harassment"
He couldn't believe that plain old good manners would be treated like that. Are American women really that thick and can't see behind a harmless polite gesture? Do we really want that type of attitude to come over here? I personally, still want youngsters to give up their seat on the bus and open doors for older people and I think, singly, the majority of British youngsters would; it's when they all get together that problems start, when they start bouncing off each other.
I also agree that tv has an awful lot to answer for, particularly these stupid big brother type things where the more outragous behaviour is rewarded. That really does teach good manners doesn't it?!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Blimey, that is just odd! I seem to remember some 'wimmin' being a bit like that a few years ago, but thought things had got back to normal-ish. Big Brother is more tied up in the cult of celebrity, which is a weird thing which I am myself well and truly sucked into! As for television, there is no doubt that some of the American dramas and comedies are streets ahead of stuff we are producing. There is the odd stroke of genius like The Office, but far too much stuff like My Hero.
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
Unless it's simple - like Vicar of Dibley, Dad's Army, Fawlty Towers, that type of thing, it doesn't ever get watched in our house! Shudder the thought at cr**py rubbish like Little Britain and the ilk!
I know, I'm sad, you don't have to tell me, just can't see what's funny in people acting like louts for laughs!
Agree with you re imports though. Now give me something like NCIS, Hill Street Blues, I can happily watch all night - just love Mark Harmon but must remember to pull my tongue back in off the floor else the dustman will think I'm doolally!
I know, I'm sad, you don't have to tell me, just can't see what's funny in people acting like louts for laughs!
Agree with you re imports though. Now give me something like NCIS, Hill Street Blues, I can happily watch all night - just love Mark Harmon but must remember to pull my tongue back in off the floor else the dustman will think I'm doolally!
TrecPeter
Well-Known Member
I love the last 2 lines of your post at the top !!
That made me
Seriously, I fully agree with you Jade that you should never never never ever assume anything you read see or hear on the Media, or even what other people claim to be true....
Re YOBS - I have some fairly raw pictures of some NON-UK Yobs busy in Geneva during the last G8. The images are quite shocking (for Switzerland) but I braved the tear-gas and crowds of rioters to take them, & I can guarentee it happened.
Will post them on Soapbox when I get a mo someday. I think you can find agitated people all over this planet if you look.
cheers
Peter
Seriously, I fully agree with you Jade that you should never never never ever assume anything you read see or hear on the Media, or even what other people claim to be true....
Re YOBS - I have some fairly raw pictures of some NON-UK Yobs busy in Geneva during the last G8. The images are quite shocking (for Switzerland) but I braved the tear-gas and crowds of rioters to take them, & I can guarentee it happened.
Will post them on Soapbox when I get a mo someday. I think you can find agitated people all over this planet if you look.
cheers
Peter
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Oh I love Little Britain!
Maesfen
Extremely Old Nag!
You are not alone I know, just don't ask me to watch!
Sooty
Well-Known Member
Ok, as long as I don't have to watch Dad's Army. It seemed funny when it was on first time round but needs to be pensioned off. Porridge is still funny.
Chex
Well-Known Member
I thought a post like this might appear, it was annoying me and I don't even live in America!
[ QUOTE ]
In America you can easily avoid trouble - there are very very few random acts of violence or crime. It is thug on thug crime, but in England that is not the case, many totally innocent people are victims of crime everyday - muggings, burglary, car theft, vandalism, etc. You can just be the wrong person, in the wrong place at the wrong time. It is not just you and I that are targeted these people have no boundaries. I remember when I was in England a 90 year old lady was punched in the face - for what? Her fish and chips!!! I know many people in England who have been victims, I even know of Americans in England who have been victims, however I know no one in the US who has been a victim of such a crime. Here in Boston I never worry about someone walking behind me, or meeting a group of youths - it was the same in LA - I feel totally safe!
[/ QUOTE ]
So in America you'll only get your house/car broken into if you're some sort of thug? There are very very few random acts of violence or crime? I'm genuinely asking, I thought things like burglarys were common all over the world! If so, I'm living in the wrong country! Not that I've even been burglers, mugged, had my car stolen etc
[ QUOTE ]
In America you can easily avoid trouble - there are very very few random acts of violence or crime. It is thug on thug crime, but in England that is not the case, many totally innocent people are victims of crime everyday - muggings, burglary, car theft, vandalism, etc. You can just be the wrong person, in the wrong place at the wrong time. It is not just you and I that are targeted these people have no boundaries. I remember when I was in England a 90 year old lady was punched in the face - for what? Her fish and chips!!! I know many people in England who have been victims, I even know of Americans in England who have been victims, however I know no one in the US who has been a victim of such a crime. Here in Boston I never worry about someone walking behind me, or meeting a group of youths - it was the same in LA - I feel totally safe!
[/ QUOTE ]
So in America you'll only get your house/car broken into if you're some sort of thug? There are very very few random acts of violence or crime? I'm genuinely asking, I thought things like burglarys were common all over the world! If so, I'm living in the wrong country! Not that I've even been burglers, mugged, had my car stolen etc
GTs
Well-Known Member
In California we do not even lock our house and the neighbours are the same - I have not heard of one person in the neighborhood being broken into in the 12 years we lived there. When I am washing the car I do not think twice about dashing in to get something while leaving the keys in the ignition.
No one I know has been broken into, or had their car stolen. In my small village in England I remember 6-8 bulgaries in a matter of a couple years.
It really is very different, and much safer.
No one I know has been broken into, or had their car stolen. In my small village in England I remember 6-8 bulgaries in a matter of a couple years.
It really is very different, and much safer.
JadeWisc
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Sooty, slightly off tangent but you reminded me of something that happened to a client of ours and possibly could happen 'only in America!
He travels to America several times a year as he's the English manager for a large motor company (no way am I going to call it an auto........!
) going through the corridors one day over there, a secretary walks past him to go through a door. Typically English, he rushes to open the door for her, she gave him a very haughty look and barged through not saying anything.
The American he was with said and I quote - "I cannot believe you just did that".
He replied, "why on earth not, I was only being polite?"
USA: "You were so stupid"
Eng: "What do you mean, I only opened the door; it's what we do in England?"
USA: "Don't ever do it again over here, ever. You were lucky not to have been done for sexual harassment"
He couldn't believe that plain old good manners would be treated like that. Are American women really that thick and can't see behind a harmless polite gesture? Do we really want that type of attitude to come over here? I personally, still want youngsters to give up their seat on the bus and open doors for older people and I think, singly, the majority of British youngsters would; it's when they all get together that problems start, when they start bouncing off each other.
I also agree that tv has an awful lot to answer for, particularly these stupid big brother type things where the more outragous behaviour is rewarded. That really does teach good manners doesn't it?!
[/ QUOTE ]
Thank you so much for driving my point home so well.....
this is making me laugh so hard!!!!!!
people open doors for me all the thime and I them. This is just the type of situation that I am talking about. A person hears a story and runs wild with it making assumptions about an entire place. RIDICULOUS!
One thing I can tell you is that in the southern states A woman can barely get out of a car on her own without a kind gentleman rushing to open her door ...or pull out her chair before she sits. I loved living in the south for that very reason. I felt like a queen.
Have you ever been here and had the experience that you describe that you feel the pressing urge to save your youth from!?
Sooty, slightly off tangent but you reminded me of something that happened to a client of ours and possibly could happen 'only in America!
He travels to America several times a year as he's the English manager for a large motor company (no way am I going to call it an auto........!
The American he was with said and I quote - "I cannot believe you just did that".
He replied, "why on earth not, I was only being polite?"
USA: "You were so stupid"
Eng: "What do you mean, I only opened the door; it's what we do in England?"
USA: "Don't ever do it again over here, ever. You were lucky not to have been done for sexual harassment"
He couldn't believe that plain old good manners would be treated like that. Are American women really that thick and can't see behind a harmless polite gesture? Do we really want that type of attitude to come over here? I personally, still want youngsters to give up their seat on the bus and open doors for older people and I think, singly, the majority of British youngsters would; it's when they all get together that problems start, when they start bouncing off each other.
I also agree that tv has an awful lot to answer for, particularly these stupid big brother type things where the more outragous behaviour is rewarded. That really does teach good manners doesn't it?!
[/ QUOTE ]
Thank you so much for driving my point home so well.....
this is making me laugh so hard!!!!!!
people open doors for me all the thime and I them. This is just the type of situation that I am talking about. A person hears a story and runs wild with it making assumptions about an entire place. RIDICULOUS!
Have you ever been here and had the experience that you describe that you feel the pressing urge to save your youth from!?
JadeWisc
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Oh I love Little Britain!
[/ QUOTE ]
me too!!!!!!
"I am the only gay in the Village!"
Oh I love Little Britain!
[/ QUOTE ]
me too!!!!!!
Tia
Well-Known Member
Where I live, and no it isn't out in the back of beyond; we are less than 1 mile from the town centre.
We don't lock our house and we leave keys in the ignition of all of our vehicles, regardless of whether we are at home or not. Everyone I know over here, is exactly the same as us.
Gentlemen ALWAYS open doors for ladies here.
Children loitering around the streets are sent off with a flea in their ear and they NEVER answer the adult back.
We don't have vandalism where I live. There are no gangs of youths. Where I live, the crime-rate is the lowest in the whole of Ontario (7 times the size of the UK) and it is VERY noticable in the laid-back way in which people here deal with day to day living.
I really hope that this part of Canada never catches up with the UK, in this respect. It is nice here, where people look after one-another, where the policeman gives you a friendly nod to say, you were driving too fast......please don't do it again.
Having said all of this.......I have to admit that the small village in Hampshire where I lived, was infact very similar, and the nearby town was a little behind the times thankfully. I also left my house unlocked and we also left our keys in the ignition of all the vehicles.......so I know this sort of thing does not go on everywhere in England.
MFH - the comment of mine which you highlighted, was in respect to the US not the UK.
Peter - as I say, yobs do seem to be filtering into other countries, however the term is derived from England and was initially used to describe undesirable English youths.
What a good discussion this is.....even if it did slip away from the original point.
We don't lock our house and we leave keys in the ignition of all of our vehicles, regardless of whether we are at home or not. Everyone I know over here, is exactly the same as us.
Gentlemen ALWAYS open doors for ladies here.
Children loitering around the streets are sent off with a flea in their ear and they NEVER answer the adult back.
We don't have vandalism where I live. There are no gangs of youths. Where I live, the crime-rate is the lowest in the whole of Ontario (7 times the size of the UK) and it is VERY noticable in the laid-back way in which people here deal with day to day living.
I really hope that this part of Canada never catches up with the UK, in this respect. It is nice here, where people look after one-another, where the policeman gives you a friendly nod to say, you were driving too fast......please don't do it again.
Having said all of this.......I have to admit that the small village in Hampshire where I lived, was infact very similar, and the nearby town was a little behind the times thankfully. I also left my house unlocked and we also left our keys in the ignition of all the vehicles.......so I know this sort of thing does not go on everywhere in England.
MFH - the comment of mine which you highlighted, was in respect to the US not the UK.
Peter - as I say, yobs do seem to be filtering into other countries, however the term is derived from England and was initially used to describe undesirable English youths.
What a good discussion this is.....even if it did slip away from the original point.
Tia
Well-Known Member
Sooty - I have a BIG apology to make to you......when you first started to talk about Little Britain, I despaired
.
When husband moved over here, he kept wanting to watch it........I despaired again.
However having watched it most nights for the past 8 months........I really like it!! Especially "the only gay in the village".......it really does make me chuckle.
When husband moved over here, he kept wanting to watch it........I despaired again.
However having watched it most nights for the past 8 months........I really like it!! Especially "the only gay in the village".......it really does make me chuckle.
anniedoherty
Well-Known Member
I think there are probably plenty of parts of England where yob culture hasn't infiltrated. I live in a rather "backward" part of the country and everyone seems really nice here. I think it is because the pace of life is slower as it is primarily an agricultural area, there aren't that many people around and everyone knows each other so it would be stupid to "step out of line". Yob culture certainly thrives in English towns and cities in some parts though and it makes me so sad to see youths who respect no-one, not even themselves. I can't speak for the States but I would imagine that it is pretty much the same i.e. large towns and cities have more crime than more rural places?
Tia
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
large towns and cities have more crime than more rural places?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes that seems to be a worldwide phenomenon. Thankfully I have spent the whole of my life in rural areas and could never imagine living in a town, so I guess I should stay safer for longer.
large towns and cities have more crime than more rural places?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes that seems to be a worldwide phenomenon. Thankfully I have spent the whole of my life in rural areas and could never imagine living in a town, so I guess I should stay safer for longer.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
LOL! There is a lot more to that programme than meets the eye. I would type more, but computer says no.
Sooty
Well-Known Member
It is a fact, fair or not, that every country is perceived a certain way. The French are not all cheese eating, garlic munching surrender monkeys, and not all the Australians wear string vests and go round clutching a tinnie all day long. Brits do wash, and we eat food other than suet pudding and roast beef. Irish people do not generaly dress in green and carry a pig under one arm whilst drawing shamrocks in the foam on a Guinness, and Italians do not really have five reverse gears on their military vehicles. Obviously individuals vary in every country, and every country is blessed with its share of intelligant citizens (or subjects, as we are in the UK) as well as its bad apples. Vive la difference!
Tia
Well-Known Member
Tia
Well-Known Member
Oooh how are Canadians perceived by the rest of the world??