Opinionated Cob - help for sis please?

[Pidge]

Went for a hack today with Sis and Joanna, Sunny sis cob decided that it would be highly entertaining to not go the way we wanted to and proceeded to go through his whole range of NO'S - rears (only small), bucks, striking out with one back leg, scraping with front leg and generally being a total pain in the ass! In the end sis had had enough so I got on and made him go in the direction we wanted to. sis then got back on him and he was fine. Trouble is she isn't the best confidence wise and when he plays up tends to let him get away with a bit, so he then gets worse and her confidence saps away. I don't always want to have to get on him as this defeats the object and I don't think my thighs can take it as his back is like a table

How can I get her to be more confident on him when he is playing up? She really doesn't like it when he goes backwards especially when he goes in the ditch or hedge and then looks the way Sunny is going. I tell her to look the way she wants to go and boot or hit him to get him going forward. any advice much appreciated

 

[Fairynuff]

I dont think there is a way to help your sister apart from changing ride. Could she ride a confidence giver for a while ? Theres nothing worse than having a horse suss out your lack of confidence and then play on it. Maybe if she could gain more confidence from another horse she would feel more in control of her own after a while. You may find that a good thumping from her would gain more respect from her cob and boost her confidence at the same time. He is def taking the Michael imo. Good luck. Mairi.

 

[Theresa_F]

Cobs can be bloody minded - does she carry a crop - a couple of sharp smacks would probably make him respect her and get on with it.

I have ridden quite a few of these bolshy buggers - buck and spin with the kids. If you can ride them firmly and give a couple of good smacks when they pee about they soon stop.

One assumes this is what you do when he starts to play up?

It is better to give one good hard smack the minute they start then try gently asking - most of them will just keep on.

Even Cairo, who is wonderful, will take the pee from time to time - one smack and he is good as gold.

Alternatively is there something she can ride to her get confidence on for a while.

 

[Pidge]

Hi Mairi, oh yes he is definately taking the pee! I know I'll get slated for this but you really have to whack him one before he takes any notice, if you tap him he's just like "whatever". trouble is sis taps him to start with so he gets away with it and then he gets a bit worse so takes more sorting out. I've told her she needs to put him in 'boot camp' for a bit and the slightest downing pace or stopping to crack him and get him moving as the next stage is spinning round etc etc. It is difficult to explain on here. She is fine on Pidge, but like today where she was wound up and stressed this then passed on to Pidge (TBxID) who got a little unsettled, however once I'd got her to relax Pidge was fine.

 

[Pidge]

Bolshie is an understatement! She tends to tap him first before cracking him one which IMO is part of the problem. Think it might be worth swapping horses for the next hack, getting it through to Sunny he can't misbehave and then ensuring that Chris stamps out this behaviour at the first sign. God don't you just love cobs

 

[maisie]

Hi - I had (still have sometimes) the same prob with my cob - he basically thinks he knows everything and just gets it into his head sometimes to be a git! - I find that when he's not playing up, if I talk to him in as soothing a voice as possible - telling him all the time he is being good and brave and doing great steady walking/trotting/whatever, all the time making sure he is listening to me - then when I get in a situation where he's being a pig, I use the same technique and he now associates the talking with being calm and walking on quietly - he used to soin round and leg it if he didn't want to go past someting, now I can 'talk' him past it - I always focus further along than the 'monster' and not on it and we seem to get past most things! I have also taken all sugar and starch out of his diet, and am feeding him brewers yeast as a calmer - I can now reason with him much better in these situations. - I probably look like the local loony cos I jabber at him all the time but quite frankly I don't care if it stops him legging it with me!!!!

good luck!

 

[Pidge]

Oh yes I think they are far too intelligent for their own good! ~He is only on a handful of happy hoof and some topspec leisuretime at the moment as he is a good doer. I wish we could talk him round as opposed to hitting him but the people who had him before sis basically let him do what he wanted to. Hence he is one of the few horses I know who will pee off with you at a walk. Plus he needs 2 chains on his box as he will just walk through one of them. Hopefully sis will be doing some more groundwork with him as she wants to show him in hand this year, if we can stop him peeing off when he wants to, bit or no bit if he wants to go he does

 

[Clodagh]

I think what you're saying about ground work is a good point. Make sure he respects your sister when shes in his stable, too. I carry a proddy stick if necessary! (Hoofpicks are good) *sits back and prepares to be shot sown in flames*. He MUST move back from the door for her, stand nicely, move over as soon as asked and so on, it will all help with her authority on his back, and may help her confidence a little if she is in charge when not on him.

 

[Pidge]

I won't shoot you down in flames as the only sensitive part to Sunny is his nose! When he's been bad he knows it and holds his head up out of reach. If you slap him elsewhere it is like he has the skin of a rhino. I don't care what people think, if they came and dealt with him then they would realise you have to be a bit tough with him or get trampled on by 555kg of cob going HIS way

His groundwork 95% is vastly improved so much so that you can leave the stable door open to get something and he won't come out, whereas when she first got him you couldn't get out of the stable without him barging her out of the way.
Do you think he's trying it on as he has never been this bad before but they have been on hols since 31.12 and we only picked them up on Wednesday and this is the first hack we've done since picking them up? He does sometimes play up but today was far far worse than anything he's done before. Normally once sis has told him to go on he does and that's the end of it, but today he would go 5 yards and spin again etc etc. It's just ridden when he goes backwards that she really doesn't like and then she stops telling him off or just taps him and he has won IMO.

 

[Law]

I've got one of these cobs who knows it all too- pain in the bum sometimes!

I was going to suggest long reining him on the hacks that you do, if this is practical. If it is quiet enough that she can go out and long rein him with a helper in case something goes wrong then I would say this should boost her and his confidence (although I doubt he needs confidence by all accounts!) Definitely lunging or free schooling should help too. Maybe they could play together?

I also totally agree with some of comments about 'proddy sticks' ie hoofpicks and being firm with him. He needs to respect her space on the ground, move away when asked and just listen generally

Good Luck

 

[Law]

I think you've hit the nail on the head- most of ours at the yard think Spring is well and truely sprung and they've ALL been playing up this weekend. It could be like you say that this is the first hack since coming back into work from their break- probably excited by that prospect!!

 

[pottamus]

I second Clodagh on the ground work...if that is not in place and there is the slightest lack of respect..he will play up when ridden too. I have a Welsh D who can be a pain at times...I did loads of groundwork with him and have to evn now...keep on top of it or he quickly becomes bolshy again. You have to have a lot of nerve with these types and be prepared to ride them through things. My boy would spin and run so I would circle him several times tightly and then ask for forward...if he went forward he was rewarded, if he did not, he was circled again. If he went backwards I would keep him going backwards and then ask forwards until he obliged. If he napped through the shoulder he would be pulled round tight and made to go in the direction I wanted...sounds harsh but it worked and he worked out that he needed to do as he was told.
Sounds like your sister needs someone to ride him through these things and take the edge off his naughtiness...but she must then be prepared to follow it up with a zero tolerence attitude...perhaps she would feel safer with something to hold onto like a neck strap and wearing a body protector...good ways to boost confidence in my opinion!

 

[Pidge]

I'm glad its not just sis that has an opinionated cob, it can sometimes get a bit dispiriting

He has loads of cofidence, is boss of the field, has a warped sense of humour in that if we loose school them he finds it hilarious to gallop towards you - not a pretty site with mane tail and feathers flying everywhere and skim past you at the last minute. We both love him to bits its just sometimes....................
Ok so how about this for a plan of action?
1. stricter on the floor with him, no leniency at all - boot camp

2. I hack him next time to try to nip this in the bud
3. sis then gets on him and doesn't give him an inch if he misbehaves, complete with breastplate
Oh and to make you smile for giving me lots of helpful advise, you should have seen me trying to get off Sunny it was hilarious I looked like a total beginner as I am used to getting off Pidge who is 16.3 and sliding down sort of gracefully, well it took me 3 attempts to get off Sunny 14.3 and in the end I slid off holding on to the reins and breastplate to stop me ending up on my bum on the floor

 

[Jellicle]

My first hack after a month off at Christmas was like this! We are (touch wood) back into a routine now, but he was ever so naughty after his break! I think what you suggest is a good idea - swap horses for one hack, then get your sister to be tough with him (and reward good behaviour) for a while.

 

[runaway]

Just wanted to make a point here. It seems from what you're saying is that your sis's horse is ok when you get on as you are confident and make him do as he is told. My point is that these neddies aren't silly

they know who's riding them, do you feel that you're sis will have the confidence to ride her horse as you do?

My man started taking the p big time when approached by cauli carts and I would look for the nearest gateway etc. He got to the point he would spot them coming and act up! So my dad rode him a couple of times and told me I was being silly and to make him walk on etc. So dad hacked out with me a couple of times talking me through things and proving that it was Storm taking the p. Can you tutor your sis while hacking so that it is her making the horse do as he's told. This would mean your sis agreeing to give him a sharp smack when you told her etc. Just think that you riding him will in the long run prove to be of no benefit as he will probably revert to being stubborn even if he does initially behave.

Just some more thoughts on the issue hope something is of help

 

[Pidge]

I wish it was that easy, unfortunately sis does not always take kindly to advice given when Sunny is playing up. My advice to her today as normal was to look where you want to go regardless of the direction of Sunny and to turn him the way forward not the way he wants to etc etc but she doesn't do it as she stresses when he goes backwards into a hedge or ditch and just wants to get him out of it even if it means letting him go the way he wants to.
Today he didn't mess around as much for me because I was more confident and just got on him with the attitude of THAT is where we are going regardless of what you want. Luckily today it was on a disused railway line, but if we are on the roads and he does this, albeit nowhere near as bad as today, then she just gives up and I have to go in the front. I did win one day and made her do it, I positioned Pidge in the middle of the road (we had our flourescent exercise sheet on so stood out a mile) while she sorted Sunny out but it was hard work as sis was stressing about the traffic! If she just took my advice and trusted me then he would give up quicker and his tantrum wouldn't be so bad. Hopefully after today she will see that what I have been telling her to do works and will do it from the start next time, if not I really don't know what to do...................

 

[Jellicle]

I must admit I probably wouldn't take advice from my sister very well - it's just a problem with family I think! Is there anyone else who could ride out with her - an instructor or someone who she would accept advice from?

 

[Pidge]

the girl we ride out with doesn't really know how to deal with situations like this, and the other people on the yard don't hack out much, so unfortuantely not. Methinks I will just have to persevere even if I do tend to get my head bitten off!

 

[runaway]

Ok I appreciate the family issue - I can't teach my dad and he can't teach me, we just don't listen to each other

well my dad started to once he realised what I was suggesting worked

.

You seem to have a bit of a burden on your shoulders then! Has your sis asked for your help or have you posted here of your own free will?

If she isn't asking for your help then I'd be inclined to keep stum. As you say she doesn't listen. At some point she will feel the need for help and when she does you will have to be firm with her too and say that you will help but only if she is really willing to do as you suggest. I would try to aviod trying to sort Sunny out for her as if he behaves for you and then starts again with her she'll probably take that the wrong way too.

If you can bring him up in conversation when you are both relaxing and try to suggest to her that she takes your advice it may get through, eventually

 

[Pidge]

just spoken to sis on the phone as didn't want to talk about this at the yard and she can't understand why Sunny didn't misbehave as much for me as he did for her! Did tactfully mention that I didn't let him win even an inch and that if she did what I did then he would give up a lot quicker. She responded that if she tells me to shut up then I should do it and not give her advice on how to deal with Sunny as I just make matters worse. GRRRRRR family! So really don't know what to do now! Do I just sit there in silence watching her struggle with Sunny. Feeling a bit down now.