Opinions on these feet? Pictures!

Q

QueenDee_

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Hoping some of you more knowledgeable barefooters could offer your opinion on the progress of this horses feet, 12 year old Thoroughbred who has always been shod. Currently still has front shoes on so just the backs at the moment. Shoes were taken off about 8/9 weeks ago, I apologise if pictures come out huge!

Off hind:









Near hind: (flare recently chipped off)









And when the shoes first came off for reference:

 
Is that crack getting better or worse, it's hard to see from those pics if it's been through the coronary band or is heading that way. They look quite bull nosed but that could be due to excessive rasping. I think time will tell.

Is she sound?

Pics would be better if the camera was on the ground and side on or front on instead of at slight angles. It's not easy to get perfect pics but ground level is a better start.

ETS I just realised you've put the most recent pics before the first pics. That confused me. The crack appears to be improving but hard to say for sure on that pic.
 
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I'm no expert but the thing that jumped out at me was significant event (grass) rings recently - has the horse presented with any "footiness" or laziness, is he in any way over weight? Could be subclinical laminitis and a real risk for acute lammi unless treated accordingly. Speaking from experience here!
 
JillA said:
I'm no expert but the thing that jumped out at me was significant event (grass) rings recently - has the horse presented with any "footiness" or laziness, is he in any way over weight? Could be subclinical laminitis and a real risk for acute lammi unless treated accordingly. Speaking from experience here!
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An event like taking the shoes off perhaps.
 
I don't see any lines that would worry me, I see new growth from where the shoes came off, and a horse that has been getting jammed up in it's quarters although it seems to have relieved the latter by taking a chunk off the bottom of the hoof wall at that point :p
 
Thanks everyone, will take some better photos tomorrow and post them on here.

FfionWinnie said:
Is that crack getting better or worse, it's hard to see from those pics if it's been through the coronary band or is heading that way. They look quite bull nosed but that could be due to excessive rasping. I think time will tell.

Is she sound?

Pics would be better if the camera was on the ground and side on or front on instead of at slight angles. It's not easy to get perfect pics but ground level is a better start.
Click to expand...
Yes he is sound, slightly weaker through the right hind which we're currently working on in schooling.

JillA said:
I'm no expert but the thing that jumped out at me was significant event (grass) rings recently - has the horse presented with any "footiness" or laziness, is he in any way over weight? Could be subclinical laminitis and a real risk for acute lammi unless treated accordingly. Speaking from experience here!
Click to expand...
Was moved to a new (temporary) yard a couple of weeks after shoes were taken off (so from today, about 6 weeks ago) and consequently grass intake was reduced and hay increased as he went from living out 24/7 to living in and out a few hours a day. Also suffered a very mild bout of colic the night following moving (suspected due to stress from travelling, was a 3 hour journey). Horse is not overweight and has been worked predominantly on a surface since moving due to hacking surrounding the yard being minimal. He is moving back home next week and hacking will increase.

ester said:
can you take some pics of the sole straight on?
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Straight on as in an 'aerial' shot?

ester said:
I don't see any lines that would worry me, I see new growth from where the shoes came off, and a horse that has been getting jammed up in it's quarters although it seems to have relieved the latter by taking a chunk off the bottom of the hoof wall at that point :p
Click to expand...
The quarter cracks/flares were the predominant reason for taking the shoes off. A similar chunk chipped off from the other hoof a few weeks earlier. Would you interpret this well, i.e. the hoof is becoming more balanced?/ is there something you'd be doing to address it?
 
How long have you had him? Pic of the whole horse too would be useful. From all angles. I'd keep doing as you are doing if the crack is improving/not worsening and he is sound.
 
like this

P1050386.jpg
 
Queenie_ said:
The quarter cracks/flares were the predominant reason for taking the shoes off. A similar chunk chipped off from the other hoof a few weeks earlier. Would you interpret this well, i.e. the hoof is becoming more balanced?/ is there something you'd be doing to address it?
Click to expand...

Nope, just patience and walking.
 
Some people would 'scoop' the hoof at the quarters to relieve the pressure, your horse has already done that himself ;).
Some horses seem to naturally go for a hoof with a slight arch at the quarters, and get those wavy growth lines if it isn't there, others don't seem to need it like that.
 
FfionWinnie said:
How long have you had him? Pic of the whole horse too would be useful. From all angles. I'd keep doing as you are doing if the crack is improving/not worsening and he is sound.
Click to expand...

My mother actually bred him, though he has only been 'mine' for the past 2 years. 12 years old and typical TB never had the best of feet. He did actually have some issues with tight hamstrings last year, whether this was as a result of poor hoof conformation though i'm not sure though, obviously there are benefits of improving his feet regardless.

ester said:
like this
Click to expand...
Thought that was what you meant! Will take more tomorrow and will also take some showing his overall/limb conformation.

ester said:
Some people would 'scoop' the hoof at the quarters to relieve the pressure, your horse has already done that himself ;).
Some horses seem to naturally go for a hoof with a slight arch at the quarters, and get those wavy growth lines if it isn't there, others don't seem to need it like that.
Click to expand...
When researching I did come across people who favoured rasping the flares off, however decided to opt with the view that if they needed to chip off they would do so in their own time!
 
IME it is best not to assume what they do and don't need. We trimmed Frank's bars back once, we didn't do it again ;) :p
 
Sorry for the delay but some more (hopefully better?) photos. Bruising coming out from a short hack a few weeks ago where we went on a stony track, been ridden a surface since. Felt very guilty when bruising started to show - lesson learned and boots will be ordered before future hacking commences!

Off hind:






Near hind:









 
Aha!

look at his little quarter arches, what a clever chap ;) :).

I definitely think they will come good, definitely some nice frogs to work with - I would just be giving them a squirt (I use red horse sole cleanse) just to stave off any thrush even if they don't look/smell too bad. They look pretty flat, which will have not helped with the bruising. Particularly as I suspect he has now lowered the hoof wall around them too.

I think the off hind looks better on him than it does in isolation if that makes sense, it will be interesting to see how that shapes up as it grows down.
 
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ester said:
Aha!

look at his little quarter arches, what a clever chap ;) :).

I definitely think they will come good, definitely some nice frogs to work with - I would just be giving them a squirt (I use red horse sole cleanse) just to stave off any thrush even if they don't look/smell too bad. They look pretty flat, which will have not helped with the bruising. Particularly as I suspect he has now lowered the hoof wall around them too.

I think the off hind looks better on him than it does in isolation if that makes sense, it will be interesting to see how that shapes up as it grows down.
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Would you mind explaining the quarter arches? I admit to being very novice to the barefoot life! (/hoof conformation in general)

Will spray for thrush. Would you expect the hoof concavity to increase in its own time?

Also, have you any suggestions for hoof boots that would stand up to fast work on hacks?

P.s Thank you for the information!
 
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Love the horse .
Those feet need time and the amount of exercise they will tolerate. Can you do regular small amounts of work on Tarmac and gradually increase it .
Do you give him a supplement ?
 
I'm no great shakes at the arches as we don't actually have any!
Yes with use/feeding I would expect concavity to increase with time. Frank's fronts were pretty flat (he had reverse rotated/flat pedal bones), they still aren't amazing and likely constricted by whatever the position of his P3 is now but certainly masses better than they used to be.
Re boots. Sorry I am going to suggest you take more pics! This time of sole with tape measure length and width and send them some of the nice hoof boot sellers these days who are familiar with all the shapes and styles (hinds can be a little trickier than fronts I have spoken to several and they have all been very helpful and some you can hire/try first.

Suggested contacts- equine podiatry supplies, hoofbootique, trelawn equine, cannock chase, the saddlery shop :).
 
Goldenstar said:
Love the horse .
Those feet need time and the amount of exercise they will tolerate. Can you do regular small amounts of work on Tarmac and gradually increase it .
Do you give him a supplement ?
Click to expand...

Thank you! He is being worked 6/7 days a week on a surface for 40mins-1hour. Starting hacking again next week as we are moving from current yard back to home where hacking is safer. Will increase gradually and see about boots.
He is on Suppleaze and super codlivine for joints but no 'hoof' supplement as of yet. Was considering the ProEarth one on ebay - what would you suggest?

ester said:
I'm no great shakes at the arches as we don't actually have any!
Yes with use/feeding I would expect concavity to increase with time. Frank's fronts were pretty flat (he had reverse rotated/flat pedal bones), they still aren't amazing and likely constricted by whatever the position of his P3 is now but certainly masses better than they used to be.
.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the boot advice, will do as you say and get some photos/measurements sent off.

What would you advise re: feeding? Currently just on a few nuts/chaff to carry his joint supplements, along with daily turnout and ad lib hay over night. Will hopefully be transitioning to our 24/7 within the next few weeks.
 
Personally I feed equimins advanced complete, it is pretty good spec, well priced and most importantly my fussy ****** eats it. I know quite a few barefooters who feed it with good results :). Otherwise I would say pro-earth or forageplus and I think there is an equivita one that people on the barefoot groups feed quite a bit too. Some horses don't need anything but I think it feet are less than optimal it isnt a bad thing and good for the rest of them too.

Which chaff? They arent all created equal ;) and micronised linseed is always a good addition.
 
If he's stabled a fair part of the time I would feed him the forage plus performance winter balancer my TB did not get going growing his new feet until I started feeding this .
 
ester said:
Personally I feed equimins advanced complete, it is pretty good spec, well priced and most importantly my fussy ****** eats it. I know quite a few barefooters who feed it with good results :).

Which chaff? They arent all created equal ;) and micronised linseed is always a good addition.
Click to expand...

Is the Equimins a better spec than the ProEarth? (will have a sit down and a research when I get the time!). And hi-fi chaff. Was fed micronised linseed throughout winter (1/2 mugs), bag ran out and debating whether to order a new one because I don't want him gaining weight. Can enough be fed to reap benefits without impacting weight?

Goldenstar said:
If he's stabled a fair part of the time I would feed him the forage plus performance winter balancer my TB did not get going growing his new feet until I started feeding this .
Click to expand...

Hoping to transition him to out 24/7 within the next few weeks but will keep this in mind for winter.
 
I can feed a mug a day to my welshie without weight gain, I up to two mugs in winter when I do want him to keep condition (he is 23).
I bet I have a spreadsheet somewhere for equimins/forageplus/pro earth and think the equimins worked out cheaper- would be 4 years old now though. I also used to feed the pellets as he would eat those just from hand (then he went off them).
Prior to using the equimins I mixed my own minerals based on forage analysis and didn't see any reduction in hoof quality since changing (he does still get some extra mag as we have massive calcium then.)
 
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