Opinions on this horse please

My opinion.......

lovely horse, but would be lot lovelier if he wasn't in hyperflexion for 90% of the vid.

ETA: just read comments above& agree he does look like a carriage horse....is he a gelderlander or similar?
 
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Bless him. I really like him in the pics. The video is awful and all I can think of is what a good horse to put up with being yanked in so much, it is almost painful to watch yet there he is pottering around trying his best.
I like him. The only reason his back looks long in the vid is because his head is cranked in and up so much his neck looks an inch long.
 
Really don't like him - looks strong, very long in the back and not tracking up at all. No point having a horse that does all the 'tricks' if the basic schooling isn't there.
 
At his age I would expect him to be nearly the finished article. His stage of training & way of going are that of a much younger horse. May have very ingrained habits (given his age) that are hard to chane / improve. Personally I don't think you can change an older horse, just modify what they do (having had older horses with bad habits that improved but could resurface easily if allowed). Money well off the mark, at least double what I would pay, not like he has any breed value being gelding. Personally don't like his shape, especially front end. How much is him & how much his overbent training I'm not sure, but again at 10 will be hard to change. If your friend has that kind of money I would look elsewhere personally. Hope this guy finds a nice home, but don't think he is a competition horse.
 
JanetGeorge said:
Strong as a bull, basic training (to Elementary) is *****! Not worth the money. Run a mile!
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This was my second thought.

AdorableAlice said:
Carriage horse, look good in a four in hand.
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This was my first, instantaneous one. Gelderlander. Nooooo! Not for ridden work.

His basics are all wrong, which you can tell from his muscles (or lack of). He's a pretty colour and his lateral work and changes etc may fool an inexperienced person (no offence meant to anyone who likes him, jmho :)) into thinking he's well schooled, but he won't fool a judge.
I wouldn't touch him tbh, at half the price.
 
I would like to see what he looks like if he was allowed to go forward properly. He is not tracking up (well, not in the 2 minutes of the vid I watched before I got neck strain myself) and is behind the vertical.
 
To all those really slamming this horse (don't get me wrong, I don't like him either) but say you wanted to go out and buy the correct version of him, e.g.

10yo gelding, correct basics, mid-high 60's BD record at Elementary and schooling med/adv med at home, sound and with the temprement to take an amateur - what price tag and how easy to find?

I say this as a person with a strong interest in this very type, who has probably spent the last 2 years scanning classifieds in this genre.

I've seen one very recently advertised that looks to be potentially a good buy @ 8K, but still not perfection at all
 
I agree IHW.
Whilst the poor creature has been totally ruined by an appalling training system, he remains obedient, sweet off the leg and sound
I tried to buy an elem/ medium horse for a friend last year with more money. It was impossible- they were either lame, badly trained, nutcases or with dodgy histories.
This horse does not look out of place in the market, I believe he is fairly priced and will do a nice job for someone
 
I don't really know regarding horses worth and obviously he doesn't the correct basics but from looking at him I agree he looks like a Gelderlander and has so much in front but nothing behind him. Having said that he looks like a nice chap so as others have said it depends what your friend would like to do with him.
 
ihatework said:
To all those really slamming this horse (don't get me wrong, I don't like him either) but say you wanted to go out and buy the correct version of him, e.g.

10yo gelding, correct basics, mid-high 60's BD record at Elementary and schooling med/adv med at home, sound and with the temprement to take an amateur - what price tag and how easy to find?

I say this as a person with a strong interest in this very type, who has probably spent the last 2 years scanning classifieds in this genre.

I've seen one very recently advertised that looks to be potentially a good buy @ 8K, but still not perfection at all
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That's roughly what she is after too. A hard search! Good luck with finding something.

We've agreed he is overpriced so she's been put off! Not sure where you are located but we are in Manchester - I know prices vary quite a bit, but this is still too much.
 
MsChops said:
That's roughly what she is after too. A hard search! Good luck with finding something.

We've agreed he is overpriced so she's been put off! Not sure where you are located but we are in Manchester - I know prices vary quite a bit, but this is still too much.
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If she wants a truely competitive horse then this is not the one - I see this horse more geared the the middle aged RC rider who might need something capable of carrying a bit of weight, to go out at unaff and to enjoy lessons on at home and play with sideways stuff. If he is utterly safe & genuine & sound then down south he may achieve that pricetag (although I'd be advertising with a completely different video).

If your friend wants to be competing BD Elem/Med then there are a few floating around down here in the 8-10K bracket, but they aren't massively inspiring. Once you are in the 12-15K bracket you start to get more realistic.

There is a dark bay mare, 13yo, just advertsied on BD site, down in Devon for 8K. I like the look of her and her record is consistent. But again from the video there is still elements to work on, the contact being one. If I was looking I would be interested in viewing her.
 
ihatework said:
If she wants a truely competitive horse then this is not the one - I see this horse more geared the the middle aged RC rider who might need something capable of carrying a bit of weight, to go out at unaff and to enjoy lessons on at home and play with sideways stuff. If he is utterly safe & genuine & sound then down south he may achieve that pricetag (although I'd be advertising with a completely different video).

If your friend wants to be competing BD Elem/Med then there are a few floating around down here in the 8-10K bracket, but they aren't massively inspiring. Once you are in the 12-15K bracket you start to get more realistic.

There is a dark bay mare, 13yo, just advertsied on BD site, down in Devon for 8K. I like the look of her and her record is consistent. But again from the video there is still elements to work on, the contact being one. If I was looking I would be interested in viewing her.
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He will be safe and genuine - he's currently used in a riding school so will have to be. I will ask whether she considers herself a middle aged RC rider who needs a weight carrier ;) Honestly though, she is after something she can compete on (and doesn't need to be a weight carrier!) at elem level, but they are seemingly few and far between. Not prepared to travel miles for more expensive similar horses down south either. Difficult hunt, but it will come right in the end I'm sure.
 
not my cup of tea - would take a lot of schooling to retrain correctly as neck is over muscled and back end looks quite weak in comparison which suggests front end is pulling horse along, instead of back end pushing forwards.

Back end does not appear to be connected to the front in the vid and I wouldn't call him an elem horse personally. Your friend might be better off with a 4/5 year old who has done a few prelims/novices that is on the correct training as would work out as better value :)

Or an eventer that is limited in jump or won't go further than novice or won't stand up to 3 day eventing might be worth a look at if your friend wants to do elem dressage :)

what about horsequest ref: 83392 or 88061
 
Can I say I am totally ignorant about what sort of talent a horse needs to compete at varying levels of dressage.I didn't like the video, the photos look a lot better.However, if he is sound, with a good willing even temperament, nice to handle on the ground, will pop a smallish fence willingly and could do a nice riding club/lower end dressage test is 6000 too much? Most amateurs look for temperament and want a bit of an alrounder and he would be perfect for that.Not for the OPs friend though maybe.I wouldn't think having a look would hurt though.
 
As a Gelderlander owner and therefore totally biased, I think he looks kind and genuine. Yes, he's massively cranked in but his conformation doesn't help to paint a good picture. That sort of choppy movement can be incredibly uncomfortable to ride though, you need a strong core to not look like a bouncing sack of potatoes.
 
A friend had a Polish warmblood that looked very similar to that (huge short neck and not a generally pretty horse). She turned out to be a great allrounder. Jumped anything, did lower level dressage and was super hunting and XC. A very intelligent, sensible type of horse, also very forward! She was sold to a keen PC child for a similar price tag as that a couple of years ago. That was in the Manchester area.
 
I'll just throw in here what I know of the horse's breeding. He has no Gelderlander in him, he is a polish WB of the Wielkopolski type, with a heavy influence of Trakehner and TB on dam side. Having said that, other than the fashionable Caletto's Son randomly thrown in there (Holsteiner), the breeding is at best average. Interesting that he is definitely Polish bred, rather average, yet he has been exported to Lithuania (was it?) and then to UK.

ETS the sire has been bred and obviously graded by one of the best regarded national studs in Poland, the grading is fairly stringent, so obviously it must have something going for it, maybe temperament?
 
Me too and they are as rare as hen's teeth! I've been in touch about the mare in Devon and she seems quite nice but I'm not that keen on having a mare, generally go for Geldings
ihatework said:
To all those really slamming this horse (don't get me wrong, I don't like him either) but say you wanted to go out and buy the correct version of him, e.g.

10yo gelding, correct basics, mid-high 60's BD record at Elementary and schooling med/adv med at home, sound and with the temprement to take an amateur - what price tag and how easy to find?

I say this as a person with a strong interest in this very type, who has probably spent the last 2 years scanning classifieds in this genre.

I've seen one very recently advertised that looks to be potentially a good buy @ 8K, but still not perfection at all
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martlin said:
I'll just throw in here what I know of the horse's breeding. He has no Gelderlander in him, he is a polish WB of the Wielkopolski type, with a heavy influence of Trakehner and TB on dam side. Having said that, other than the fashionable Caletto's Son randomly thrown in there (Holsteiner), the breeding is at best average. Interesting that he is definitely Polish bred, rather average, yet he has been exported to Lithuania (was it?) and then to UK.

ETS the sire has been bred and obviously graded by one of the best regarded national studs in Poland, the grading is fairly stringent, so obviously it must have something going for it, maybe temperament?
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I have one of these . . . Kal's breeder has produced some wonderful horses (who have gone to the Polish National Stud . . . exported to Australia and here to the UK) . . . but he also produced Kal who, as much as I love him, is decidedly average . . . he has a short neck, short back, long legs, quite upright conformation . . . but he has the most amazing temperament once you get him on side . . . he's sweet and kind on the ground and, once he trusts the rider will turn himself inside out to do the right thing.

I guess my point is that just because he's from decent stock (i.e., sire), doesn't mean he'll necessary be special . . . those darned genetics ;).

P

P.S. Oh, and as much as I think Trakehners are gorgeous to look at (I'm in love with Holme Grove Prokoviev), they are tricky, tricky beasts
 
Auslander said:
Whilst I agree with pretty much all the above, I have to admit that i rather like him. He's not a competition horse, and he isn't worth the money, but there is something about him that appeals to me. He looks very willing to work, and although limited by his type and conformation (and the stranglehold he's being ridden in), he has a good go at doing what's asked of him. I could be completely wrong, but i think he looks like a nice, biddable sort, who could prove to be worth his weight in gold as a safe, fun horse once the wrinkles are ironed out of the basic schooling. i suspect there's a fair bit of Gelderlander in his ancestry, which would explain the conformation a bit.
I wouldn't pay 6k for him, but I wouldn't be at all unhappy if he turned up on my doorstep looking for a home.
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I was thinking the same :)
 
There was a thread some time back where people were saying they would expect to pay 6k for a bombproof cob. Personally I wouldn't pay 6k for any horse.... ever.
But I do like this stamp of horse just not the price :)
 
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