Opinions please - Behaviour?

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domane

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I wonder if I can pick your brains....

I have a 15yo TB (Roo) who is very gentle, he's been bullied in the past and is not malicious or violent. He does get excited and playful but is not a dominant horse by any means. A fortnight ago I bought a colt cob yearling (Albi) who has been living out with 2 x rising 3yo chunky geldings of around 14hh for the past 6 months.

I would like to have my boys in together because I feel it's important for the Albi to learn manners and how to behave, I feel that he's probably not had the best examples set for him by a pair of bolshy "teenagers"! The boys were stabled together for the first 3 hours of meeting, then in adjacent for paddocks for a while, then turned out together. On day two, a friend witnessed Roo charging at Albi with his ears flat back, causing Albi to panic and try to jump over post and rail fencing... he broke the top rail scrambling over and cut his side. Then Albi was gelded so they have been kept in adjacent fields again whilst he heals, I don't want him being too energetic at the moment. My feeling is that he must have REALLY pushed his luck with Roo to provoke such an extreme reaction with Roo as I've never seen his be that brave with another horse. I had a 17.2 WB on loan for 3m recently and initially Roo was a very gentlemanly "leader" but then Buzz took over and Roo was the submissive one again.

So, yesterday, day 10 post-gelding, I tried them in together again, figuring they've had quite a while to acquaint and "scritch" over the fence. Initially all was fine then Roo squealed and started leaping around, rearing and cantering about and driving Albi. I'm sure he's not being malicious, possibly just acting the Big I Am, asserting his size, etc, because he never actually touches, Albi but I'm also not sure that Albi knows how to behave and is being frightened. The other thing is that I fell off Roo a couple of weeks ago and have currently got a bruised back, so he's not being ridden and he is a lot calmer when he has a job to do so he may just be bored. Incidentally, whilst not videoing them yesterday, Albi did kick out and caught Roo a corker on his chest which seemed to cause Roo to keep his distance a little more.

I've separated them AGAIN to give Albi a few more days to heal before I try a third time. I'm just frightened that Albi will try to escape over the fence again and injure himself badly. If I kept them side-by-side, do you think there is a danger that Albi will never learn how to behave when in with another horse.

Could you have a look at these vids and let me know what you think, please? They have the run of 3 inter-connected paddocks, so they are not just confined to the one you can see in the vids....

Thanks



 
whilst you are unable to ride, would it be possible to lunge Roo, to get some energy out of him?

I put my mares in together a couple of weeks back and my elder mare acted very similar to Roo. She was chasing my youngster and if the youngster didn't move, she went to kick. She was asserting herself. The youngster however, did kick back although she moved out of the way as well so they are now settled and have their pecking order sorted. It took about 10 minutes for the girls to settle and graze near one another contentedly.

It may be worth getting some energy out of Roo before putting them together (that's what I did with Tilly).
 
I am the not so proud owner of a bit of a bully in the field, he will bully others occasionally and so I really feel for you. I think that you have 3 choices: either let them sort it out, it is difficult but it may work, are both shod? It maybe worth removing their back shoes if they are. It could be they just need to get their pecking order sorted and will settle down happily, especially if Albi learns his manners and does not challenge Roo. If he has never lived with older geldings it maybe he is treating Roo like a peer, which may well p*ss Roo off.

Another choice is to put him back into the other field and let them really get used to each other over the fence, however I think you are likely to have the same problem when you try later to reintroduce.

Finally you could pop him back in the other field and try to find another gelding to teach him some manners but without too much physical contact. Cappy is used on our yard to teach the 2 and 3 year olds their manners, because whilst he will chase them, and he chased one out of the field the other day, he doesn't *touch wood* ever actually kick or bite them. Cappy just doesn't get on very well with other more dominant horses who try to boss him about.

Good luck whatever you decide to do, keep us updated on Albi and Roo's friendship won't you? :)
 
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I watched the videos, and it seems to me that they are still establishing dominance, and are naturally quite close in status. Normally it is the larger, mature horse who would be clearly dominant, but in this case Albi being entire may complicate the picture (I know he's been gelded but he still has testosterone at the moment).
I think you just have to let them get on with it, and perhaps try to make the field as safe as possible; eventually they will decide who is boss and things will settle down.
Your Tb looks as though he is behaving properly to me, it is Albi who is being insufficiently respectful, and threatening him back, who is raising the fight levels.
S :D
 
I watched the videos and I have to say it just looked like normal behaviour to me. Incidentally I am a cob fan. I agree that there is little you can do to influence what happens in the field BUT you could try ; 1, removing back shoes, 2, keeping them both in a stable for a few hours with nothing to eat (not something I would normally advocate but needs must...) and 3,them putting them to gether in a field with loads of lovely lush grass, so that they concentrate on eating rather than pushing each other around.
 
It looks to me (and I haven't read the other replies) like Roo wants to play and lark about to me. Even if he is being dominant, then as long as he isn't being nasty then I wouldn't worry. the little lad doesn't seem too worried by it, so maybe they just need to sort it out between themselves.

If you really are worried then I would keep turning them out together for short periods (maybe a couple of hours) and block off the corners for the field using jumps or electric tape so that he can't get cornered by Roo. Keep an eye and let them sort it out.

Both lovely looking horses BTW!
 
Thank you for your replies! Albi is only just one (on Fri, actually) so not shod, obviously. Roo has just spent a year barefoot rehabilitating and has only just had shoes put back on 4 weeks ago... oh, the irony *rolls eyes* But yes, it's something that I worry about..... all those flailing hooves scare me somewhat near my baby coblet!! lol I did also wonder about the subsiding testosterone thing too... Think I'll give it another week of healing (and subsiding) and then hopefully I'll be riding again, take Roo for a nice long hack first and then try again!
 
Whilst they have had time to 'get acquainted' they have not really been together very long in order to establish dominance. It all looks fairly routine and not malicious to me, and I would suggest you just give them time to sort themselves out. Just keep an eye on them for any reall aggression.

You can see Albi is not really worried, as he instantly goes back to Roo.
 
It all looks fairly normal to me. Roo wants to play and assert his dominance over coblet who is a bit uncertain.

I was worried when Bella went out into the main herd after she was weaned and apart from being chased about for 10 minutes she was fine. Has since moved up the pecking order :rolleyes:


I would just let them sort it out between themselves to be honest
 
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