Opinions-Video attached

[karen.close]

Ok so here is a vid of me and my boy 2 weeks before his bone scan, anyone reading my posts lately will already know whats been going on. He had just returned from x-rays on his hock from local vets and advised there was a small arthretic change in his right hock but nothing major for them to be concerned about and to continue working as normal hence... however I thought he wasn't right and continued pushing for bone scan as he just looked stiff from behind.

The reason I am posting this is like I said this is how he looked before he has had all his treatment of late and still is working pretty much the same, my question is given what I know now after extensive scans and xrays do I retire him or continue pushing with treatments.

For those just looking now, he was diagnoised with low grade mild arthritis in his right hock, arthritis in his neck, arthritis in his right fore and KS T15,T16,T17 although this is believed to be very old and now fused and not showing any hotspot on scan or extreme discomfort. He has had 2 tildren, cortisone in hock, is on cortaflex, am putting him onto linseed and equitop myoplast as he has very bad muscle wastage across the back, hind quarters and shoulders. He is having weekly physio and mctimoney and this week he will have a tens machine to be used daily on his hind quarters as the physio believes he is so tense and tight across these areas.

She has suggested if this doesn't work I may have to look at retiring so can I please please have your thoughts.

He is 1/10 lame at present and am restricted to walking out incorparating 10secs spurts of trot.

Am I fighting a losing battle here, I'm sorry the vid is of me riding I have none of him on the lunge.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mao3cZUHx8

 

[Circe]

I dont know if you are fighting a loosing battle...
he certainly doesn't look happy in his rear end, yes the off hind looks worse, but hes not stepping through with the near hind either.
If the physio can feel that he is extremely tight, then treatments to loosen him up, would benefit. TEN's machine is fantastic for that.
Hopefully he will then maintain any improvements made.
Does the vet think the arthritis in the hock will stablise at any point?
Can he "retire" from arena work and be a happy hacker (for a while at least )
Kx

 

[be positive]

I dont know how you are riding him at the moment but my physio always get me to work long ,low and slow for a while. Your horse seems to struggle at times with his balance as he obviously cannot carry enough weight on his hocks and they are probably still uncomfortable. He will have been using himself incorrectly for some time and his muscles are built to compensate. I would go back to basics and only ask for more when he is truely ready.
A lot do come back to full work but I think the key is to not rush.

 

[karen.close]

Thanks for you responses, he hasn't done any arena work since April when I initally thought something wasn't quite right, he loves hacking out although not hopping lame he kind of skips a beat in walk when his pace quickens up and I think he is getting a little bored of late. I used to be able to feel him being off balance in the school and used to think it was me.

The prob we are having at the min is the physio is doing everything to loosen those muscles up on the hind and its worrying her just how quickly its all tightening up. By the end of a hour session you can really see how lose it all is but then a week later its back again.

The vet has told me he has had everything they can possibly give him now and the last resort will be to bute him up but I just can't get my head around putting him on it in order for me to have a good time which of course I want to enjoy him as much as possible but to bute him just makes me feel like I'm masking everything.

If he could be a happy hacker I'd be happy with this, he was doing so so well in his ridden classes as well

I have a friend via these forums and I will be speaking with her shortly about accupucture.

 

[loopylucifer]

Was this taken before or after all the treatment and diagnosis?
He doesn't look that bad I have seen many lamer sound horses if you know what I mean.
I would have no problem working a horse on one or even two bute a day as long as you know your horse and can read them. At the end of the day as we all get older sometimes we take painkillers to help us get going doesn't mean we are ready for the scrap heap! And sometimes a period on bute helps as they can get moving again and then develop more muscle for support and then in time come off the bute.
The key when on bute is to know your horse bute is not a strong pain killer when its one a day anything more than a mild niggly will show though it and your horse will let you know if its not happy

 

[karen.close]

This was taken 2 weeks before he was diagnoised back in end of April/early may if I recall, he works pretty much the same now prob a little loser, the vets actually put him at 3-4/10ths lame now he is 1/10 and its so so difficult to see. The only reason I sent him for the scan was because my instinct was telling me something wasn't right, he looked stiff and he felt slightly off balance was disuniting, but I must emphasise not all the time and most of my yard thought I was nuts persuing it because they all thought he looked fine. He would give a little head flick in the air when his saddle was put on but nothing nasty like biting or rearing and certainly not cold backed.

Like I said he's shown little improvements but not much if I'm honest, I just hate the thought of retiring him or last resort pts when ok he's not perfect and has lots going on but he just keeps going and pleasing he's so genuine.

 

[splashgirl45]

yes he isnt right behind, but he looks very happy to be working(lovely horse BTW) and it would be IMO,a shame to retire him . a low dose of bute would just make him feel a bit more comfortable and you could continue to ride him..how many of us who are a little older or have an old injury take painkillers every day to improve our quality of life? good luck with whatever you decide...

 

[be positive]

You are doing all you can for him.
Have you had the saddle checked since treatment?
Does your physio give you exercises on the ground to do with him.

Could you do some long reining or lunging,I know its not ideal for the hocks,but he has other issues too and it may help.

As above, bute could help make him more comfortable so that he can regain his muscle tone and confidence.

 

[karen.close]

Thank You be positive...His Saddle is fitted by a specialist who comes out 6 monthly, she is due her back out in sept along with his 6 monthly dentistry. When I had him over 12 months ago now he had muscle wastage mainly around his withers and back hence getting in a specialist to fit him and charter him 6 monthly, he has had massive improvements on his charter and each time she comes out he has expanded some more. So I think it is unlikely that.

As of yet no she hasn't, she has agreed for me to use a tens machine now which she is giving me tomorrow, also just some stretches I can do with him, we were meant to start pessoa work with him but due to this stiffness, tightness of muscles across the hind area she hasn't want to push him.

Today he has been fitted with extensions on his hind legs to help him have a bit of a lift.

I'm warming to the idea of maybe bute, I just don't want to hurt him x

 

[be positive]

He wont "break" if worked while he is on bute
It is anti inflammatory so will relieve some discomfort not mask real pain, you know him well so would not push him too much anyway.
It is worth a try if vet/physio think it is ok.

 

[karen.close]

So do you think I should carry on with him put him on bute, continue with his physio and hope he gets some muscle build up?? is this what you would do

 

[be positive]

Its worth trying if vet/physio agree must be worth a go before you have to consider retirement.In other words yes.
Hope it works out and you get your horse back.

 

[karen.close]

Thank you yes your 100% right, its so reasuring to get other peoples perspectives on things. I wasn't going to give up on him just yet, I know in reality he will never be the same horse but if we can have our happy hacks out I'll be happy with that, don't get me wrong I loved our showing class's and jumping but would never put him through anything he couldn't handle.

I'll speak to physio tomorrow although I know her opinion is bute.

 

[karen.close]

yes he isnt right behind, but he looks very happy to be working(lovely horse BTW) and it would be IMO,a shame to retire him . a low dose of bute would just make him feel a bit more comfortable and you could continue to ride him..how many of us who are a little older or have an old injury take painkillers every day to improve our quality of life? good luck with whatever you decide...

Thank you he is beautiful and so so genuine

 

[karen.close]

I dont know if you are fighting a loosing battle...
he certainly doesn't look happy in his rear end, yes the off hind looks worse, but hes not stepping through with the near hind either.
If the physio can feel that he is extremely tight, then treatments to loosen him up, would benefit. TEN's machine is fantastic for that.
Hopefully he will then maintain any improvements made.
Does the vet think the arthritis in the hock will stablise at any point?
Can he "retire" from arena work and be a happy hacker (for a while at least )
Kx

Well this is the confussing thing because you read about arthritis in the hock which on here its all about bone spavin, when I asked the vet when we looked at the xrays in depth and the changes in his hock are so very very mild he said he's not even close to bone spavin. When I ask will it get worse or stablise he can't say because it could go either way thats where the tildren comes in I do believe.

 

[Circe]

Well, fingers crossed that he has a good result from the tildren.
When i watched his video, i thought what a nice, honest horse he looked, so i hope you find some relief for him.
I certainly wouldnt worry about giving him a small dose of bute & still doing some work with him. 1 daily or everyother day might just be enough to get him comfortable, and help the muscles relax.
Im sure that you will still be able to enjoy riding him.
Kx

 

[muff747]

am putting him onto linseed and equitop myoplast as he has very bad muscle wastage across the back, hind quarters and shoulders. He is having weekly physio and mctimoney and this week he will have a tens machine to be used daily on his hind quarters as the physio believes he is so tense and tight across these areas.

She has suggested if this doesn't work I may have to look at retiring so can I please please have your thoughts.

Did the physio say anything about holding off riding him if he has very bad muscle wastage and is in treatment? I once had my gelding checked out by a physio and she recommended no riding for at least a few days after treatment.

 

[karen.close]

Did the physio say anything about holding off riding him if he has very bad muscle wastage and is in treatment? I once had my gelding checked out by a physio and she recommended no riding for at least a few days after treatment.[/QUOTE]

yes she has been out now 5 times and is due again, the first he had to have a full week and the other 2 occasions there was to be no riding for a few days, she is however working closely with the vet and the last 2 occasions I have to continue just walking him out, last week I was to incorporate 10 sec spurts of trot but must admit I haven't stuck to this and only done it once.

 

[karen.close]

Just a little update on my lad.. Vet came out for a 6 month check on him and couldn't believe the difference in him, his muscle around his neck and hindquarters has improved massively. There's no lameness or toe drag and although moody still at times is loving his little hacks out. He's now on micronised linseed, equimins flexi joint, turmeric, and yes occasionally over these cold winter months he has had an occasional bute if I felt he needed it! If he gets a good 20 mins warm up then he feels just great at the min... Will he revert back I don't know but in my heart I know I'll have done everything I could and at the min I'm really enjoying him, not galloping about like a hoon enjoyment but just hacking and schooling avoiding the tight circles! The other day someone in the school had a jump up I had no intention of going over it but he felt so good i thought I'd just see how he was in general and boy did he fly nearly pulled my arms out to get to it! I've no intention of doing anything or making no plans I'm just taking everyday as it comes but he's happy, full of beans and excitement to be out and about (it's all he's ever known) that retirement just wouldn't of suited ... I'm glad I stuck with it, I'm not saying he's cured but he's comfortable and that was my goal x