Ordinary horses in Online dressage training videos?!

[Hollyanna]

I am looking for online videos to help with my dressage training - exercises, tips etc. I signed up for the one where you pay monthly to watch the training videos, but have found them pretty unhelpful to be honest - they show professionals on their own horses who naturally really move or for the most part are "built the right way" and have been trained by said professional from when they were backed. They show an exercise to help say - engage the hind quarters and develop a more expressive trot and then hey presto the horse is suddenly trotting around with this magnificent trot - which of course it will because it's been trained to do this from the start.

I go off and try the exercise and my lovely beast dreams up some sort of evasion or other interesting answer! It would be great to see a professional training an ordinary horse, working through the problems that might arise and how to deal with them - possibly sitting on a clients horse or something similar. There was a brilliant video of Charlotte riding a young pupils horse in a demo and I found this really inspiring watching her figuring the horse out and how to improve it - why aren't there more videos like this?

My own story - I have a homebred horse that I am just starting to compete at advanced medium - we've figured our way along and worked up the levels, having to undo bad habits and things we've learnt wrong along the way. I have regular lessons but it would be brilliant to watch some training videos like this. We're never going to set the world on fire (happy if I get over 60% at this level!) and in my tests I always get "needs to sit more" or "to take more weight behind" (usually followed by an eye roll when I read my sheets - same old - same old!) - I'm pretty sure her front legs are a few inches shorter than her back legs - she's certainly croup high so feel like I am fighting a loosing battle before I start - but I adore her and just want to be the best we can be! If I could have millions of lessons i would, but time / money llimit me to one or two a month (particularly at £60 a shot, plus entries etc it soon ads up!) we will get there one day but need all the help I can get!

Does anyone know where I can find videos like this? TIA!

 

[silv]

I totally agree with you about the videos, will be following this with interest.

 

[wish upon a star]

I'd recommend having a look at Heather Moffett's Online classical riding academy. There's a project horse Altivo, whose progress is being shown starting out schooling and also the progress of me, a green rider, and my green horse but we've made a lot of progress in the short time we've been here. There's more advanced stuff too. Think you can have a free 14 day trial to see if it suits. Would share some photos but I don't know now photobucket has gone!

 

[nikkimariet]

The theory of training is the same regardless of the quality of the horse.

Not sure I get your point? A big trot won't cover up basic training flaws? Don't let yourself be too impressed by a flashy front leg; I know plenty of people that get crap results despite spending a good whack on top level training on well bred horses. An 8 for a medium trot doesn't equal 70%....

For what it's worth I post plenty of videos on my page and youtube channel of Fig. Very ordinary moving exracer at Inter 1. The same training process is being implemented right from the start on my 3yo WB.

 

[Batgirl]

The theory of training is the same regardless of the quality of the horse.

Not sure I get your point? A big trot won't cover up basic training flaws? Don't let yourself be too impressed by a flashy front leg; I know plenty of people that get crap results despite spending a good whack on top level training on well bred horses. An 8 for a medium trot doesn't equal 70%....

For what it's worth I post plenty of videos on my page and youtube channel of Fig. Very ordinary moving exracer at Inter 1. The same training process is being implemented right from the start on my 3yo WB.

I think the point is that 'training' videos are more often demos of how well the horse is already trained and don't often show the steps to get there. i.e. if you put your legs here and here and shift weight look what magically happens and not hmm, horse hasn't responded to that so I am going to do this instead, or if you get this reaction correct doing this until ....

 

[HufflyPuffly]

I get where OP is coming from, I'd bet there are a fair number of us amateurs that turn to dressage later in a horses career than it being training for dressage from the start (not many of us actually buy an unbacked youngster either).

Using the exercises will help and improve, but if the vid's only ever show the built and started correctly horse then it probably won't show how to teach a 10 year old, stumpy, slightly obstinate, with a poor mouth from years jumping in a pelham (for example ) how to achieve a forward contact, with a soft swinging back that the correctly brought up horse has already.

To illustrate this we have struggled for years to get Topaz to understand lengthening her paces, we have taught her gear changes, shouldered-in to our hearts content, used gear changes in the SI, engaged the hind end and been patient waiting for her strength and balance to improve, now using the passage type trot to develop the gear change ideas, but sadly a Hackney knee action is still there.

I have watched every video, read every article (figuratively speaking ) and put the time and effort in, but I had a lesson with a new trainer this weekend who suggested something totally different to try and blow me down it 'might' just do the trick :lol: (tap on the shoulder a la spanish walk type aid) to get her to understand the front leg can go forwards!

All the articles, vids, discussions I had seen had been about engaging the hind end and developing the push off the floor and not letting them speed up, this was fine but did nothing to teach the horse or rider how to get the front legs to also reach forward for the extension.

I will be following this thread with interest as I'd love to see more training videos for the more difficult horse, (ie difficult conformation, attitude, etc).

 

[ester]

Yes I would agree that these videos often miss out a few steps about how to get there, sometimes that is why I prefer watching people's lesson videos on here etc as you see more of the process. Importantly when to stop with a young horse learning ie how much of the new thing you want them to do before you stop and save the rest of the next session. OR what the usual pitfalls a horse will throw at you and what you can do about them.

 

[Hollyanna]

The theory of training is the same regardless of the quality of the horse.

Not sure I get your point? A big trot won't cover up basic training flaws? Don't let yourself be too impressed by a flashy front leg; I know plenty of people that get crap results despite spending a good whack on top level training on well bred horses. An 8 for a medium trot doesn't equal 70%....

For what it's worth I post plenty of videos on my page and youtube channel of Fig. Very ordinary moving exracer at Inter 1. The same training process is being implemented right from the start on my 3yo WB.

Hi Nik, I actually already follow your page on Facebook! 😬 Love reading your posts!

I definitely agree the basics should be the same. I suppose what I'm saying is when you've had a horse that's been beautifully produced from the start by a professional and they have already trained the horse to do the exercise they are showing it doesn't really show how to deal with problems that might occur along the way....Obviously big paces and a horse that's naturally able helps - but I would really love to see what happens when things go wrong. Maybe even showing a green horse who's just learning would be better- but even then a lot of the time these horses are more naturally able Having been bred to do the job... my horse's first instinct is to fall on her nose and charge off with me - never see that in one of the educational videos! 😂 She also gets tense and tight if learning something new (sewing machine trot returns!) - sometimes I feel like the blind leading the blind, but hopefully we will figure it out

It might be just me but dressage often leaves me feeling inadequate (particularly if I've had a bashing off a judge at a show) and I am left feeling deflated, but I pick myself up and dust myself off and carry on - because I love it! Neither me nor my horse are built for dressage (I have too many wobbly bits and not an elegant bone in my body!) - it would just be great if I could relate to these videos a bit more ...

There's a video on Facebook of a lady who is doing a prelim test - it's wobbly and green and they both look like a normal horse and rider and then it runs along side her doing a Grand Prix test on the same horse - such an inspiration! I also love the before and after of you and Fig!

 

[Hollyanna]

I get where OP is coming from, I'd bet there are a fair number of us amateurs that turn to dressage later in a horses career than it being training for dressage from the start (not many of us actually buy an unbacked youngster either).

Using the exercises will help and improve, but if the vid's only ever show the built and started correctly horse then it probably won't show how to teach a 10 year old, stumpy, slightly obstinate, with a poor mouth from years jumping in a pelham (for example ) how to achieve a forward contact, with a soft swinging back that the correctly brought up horse has already.

To illustrate this we have struggled for years to get Topaz to understand lengthening her paces, we have taught her gear changes, shouldered-in to our hearts content, used gear changes in the SI, engaged the hind end and been patient waiting for her strength and balance to improve, now using the passage type trot to develop the gear change ideas, but sadly a Hackney knee action is still there.

I have watched every video, read every article (figuratively speaking ) and put the time and effort in, but I had a lesson with a new trainer this weekend who suggested something totally different to try and blow me down it 'might' just do the trick :lol: (tap on the shoulder a la spanish walk type aid) to get her to understand the front leg can go forwards!

All the articles, vids, discussions I had seen had been about engaging the hind end and developing the push off the floor and not letting them speed up, this was fine but did nothing to teach the horse or rider how to get the front legs to also reach forward for the extension.

I will be following this thread with interest as I'd love to see more training videos for the more difficult horse, (ie difficult conformation, attitude, etc).

Yes, 100% agree with you - would love to see more!

 

[wish upon a star]

Mine hasn't been well produced from the start because I didn't have a clue! We were just happy hackers slopping about on a long rein and as soon as I took a contact, she would do a fab giraffe impression! It's definitely the blind leading the blind for me and a lot of our mistakes will be shown!

 

[Farma]

I agree with what you are saying, for a lot of riders it would be more helpful to see the training on a more average horse, perhaps showing more the pitfalls that are found along the way, building the basics to progress, and what they do to improve the way of going over a period of time. I think a lot of people would love to see more training videos like that!

 

[nikkimariet]

Hi Nik, I actually already follow your page on Facebook! 😬 Love reading your posts!

I definitely agree the basics should be the same. I suppose what I'm saying is when you've had a horse that's been beautifully produced from the start by a professional and they have already trained the horse to do the exercise they are showing it doesn't really show how to deal with problems that might occur along the way....Obviously big paces and a horse that's naturally able helps - but I would really love to see what happens when things go wrong. Maybe even showing a green horse who's just learning would be better- but even then a lot of the time these horses are more naturally able Having been bred to do the job... my horse's first instinct is to fall on her nose and charge off with me - never see that in one of the educational videos! 😂 She also gets tense and tight if learning something new (sewing machine trot returns!) - sometimes I feel like the blind leading the blind, but hopefully we will figure it out

It might be just me but dressage often leaves me feeling inadequate (particularly if I've had a bashing off a judge at a show) and I am left feeling deflated, but I pick myself up and dust myself off and carry on - because I love it! Neither me nor my horse are built for dressage (I have too many wobbly bits and not an elegant bone in my body!) - it would just be great if I could relate to these videos a bit more ...

There's a video on Facebook of a lady who is doing a prelim test - it's wobbly and green and they both look like a normal horse and rider and then it runs along side her doing a Grand Prix test on the same horse - such an inspiration! I also love the before and after of you and Fig!

*waves*

Ah ok - I see what angle you're coming from more now

I get to as many demo's and clinics as possible. Even though the riders and horses are pros oozing with natural talent, watching a combination from start to finish is totally different to watching a 5/10 minute video where it's clipped to show start-middle-end. It's a real shame that Horse Hero has closed as I found that a wealth of info. Also, research research research. Read everything you can. There have been a few online articles that have given me a brain wave and pushed me to try a different approach/exercise.

Have you got an instructor that can give you a couple of longer sessions close together? So you can pick up where you left off from each one over the course of a few weeks etc?

And yes, I love that video. Really inspiring!

 

[madamebonnie]

Try equestrain pro tv. I subscribe for a couple of months at a time. Rinse the videos, then cancel subscription as I find they don't update *that* regularly. Plus only training up to novice level it does mean quite a lot of the videos are lovely to watch but not actually that useful for me, but probably a lot more for you being at the giddy heights of AM.

They not only have professionals riding but also their students who can be more relate-able.

Sometime I do think amateurs have a harder job than *pros*. Retraining a horse has got to be harder than putting in the basics from a 4yo right!? This is what I will keep telling myself anyway But after watching a Demo with the Hughes the other day Gareth did say he can spend up to two year 'reinstalling' the basics on horses he does not receive as youngsters.

 

[Hollyanna]

*waves*

Ah ok - I see what angle you're coming from more now

I get to as many demo's and clinics as possible. Even though the riders and horses are pros oozing with natural talent, watching a combination from start to finish is totally different to watching a 5/10 minute video where it's clipped to show start-middle-end. It's a real shame that Horse Hero has closed as I found that a wealth of info. Also, research research research. Read everything you can. There have been a few online articles that have given me a brain wave and pushed me to try a different approach/exercise.

Have you got an instructor that can give you a couple of longer sessions close together? So you can pick up where you left off from each one over the course of a few weeks etc?

And yes, I love that video. Really inspiring!

Hey Nikki,

I have lessons with a list one judge who has really inspired me, and encouraged me to take the step up from elementary to medium - had gotten stuck thinking I should be getting over a certain percentage before moving up to the next level - which in reality is never going to happen - would've been stuck there for a lifetime!

The problem is that where I live is really remote (not many local instructors) so tend to grab lessons when I can at clinics etc i.e. One each day on a clinic but they tend to be quite random, or loads at the same time - so deffo would like be getting new ideas / videos in between. Keep saying I'm going to try and go to a camp or a holiday training week /weekend or something but never get round to looking into it ��

Thanks for your advice - much appreciated!

 

[Hollyanna]

Try equestrain pro tv. I subscribe for a couple of months at a time. Rinse the videos, then cancel subscription as I find they don't update *that* regularly. Plus only training up to novice level it does mean quite a lot of the videos are lovely to watch but not actually that useful for me, but probably a lot more for you being at the giddy heights of AM.

They not only have professionals riding but also their students who can be more relate-able.

Sometime I do think amateurs have a harder job than *pros*. Retraining a horse has got to be harder than putting in the basics from a 4yo right!? This is what I will keep telling myself anyway But after watching a Demo with the Hughes the other day Gareth did say he can spend up to two year 'reinstalling' the basics on horses he does not receive as youngsters.

Thank you - going to look into this!

 

[ajn1610]

Not exactly relevant to your question but I've found really improving my ground work has helped develop my horses way of going. I follow the Valenca method which is based in classical dressage, there is also straightness training which is a similar programme but a bit more natural horsemanship-y. Probably there are other things too. I've got 3 very bog standard horses and I've seen a lot of benefits from establishing things on the ground first, makes it a lot easier than trying to get it from the saddle immediately. As I'm trying to teach work that is new to me it's beneficial because I can see what's happening and the horse can build muscle memory without having to contend with my useless riding at the same time! 😜It is also super helpful as a working rider because you can give them a really thorough work out in a relatively short space of time.

 

[alexomahony]

Hi,

Not dressage, or a 'training video' as such but I LOVE this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njj39Wpl28I

it's shows an OTTT develop into a 4* eventer with narration from Doug Payne. It's brilliant and shows how horses perceived to be 'normal' can become something really special. (I say 'perceived', as, although perceptions are changing really quickly, ex racers, even those with spectacular racing careers) are generally cheap to pick up and very 'normal' horses) - no hate, I love them <3

 

[NZJenny]

This has been one of things that has bugged me too, and why I never buy them. I sometimes think they are designed to make the clinician look good - rather than being particularly useful to us mere mortals.

Being the rider of a not particularly forward thinking Clydie/TB cross (AKA Kiwi Sporthorse), watching something being demo'd on a forward moving 17 hh Warmblood isn't particularly relevant. I don't have any tips, but finding an instructor who "got" me and my horse was the key for us. It took a few trials before I found someone who got that a bigger whip and longer spurs was not the answer I was looking for.

 

[Farma]

This has been one of things that has bugged me too, and why I never buy them. I sometimes think they are designed to make the clinician look good - rather than being particularly useful to us mere mortals.

Being the rider of a not particularly forward thinking Clydie/TB cross (AKA Kiwi Sporthorse), watching something being demo'd on a forward moving 17 hh Warmblood isn't particularly relevant. I don't have any tips, but finding an instructor who "got" me and my horse was the key for us. It took a few trials before I found someone who got that a bigger whip and longer spurs was not the answer I was looking for.

Exactly this, I think if a top rider was willing to take on a horse like yours and show over a number of weeks / months what they do and the improvements it made it would be hugely helpful and inspiring to a lot of people, I think there's a gap in the market here for someone brave enough and doesn't mind showing the bits that aren't very pretty!

 

[Greyponies]

I just came across this thread and would recommend www.dressagetraining.tv - there is a biweekly updated series of videos called "Real Life Riders" which does exactly this. It follows the training of amateur riders on ordinary horses (including not only green youngsters or green not so youngsters!) but also older horses being retrained.

 

[oldie48]

It's really worth watching as many lessons that you can, book a clinic with a good trainer and hang around to watch others. The BD test riding clinics are good as there is usually a range of different levels and sorts of horses. I've done lots of this and the one thing that I have learned is the same issues arise regardless of the level and the natural ability of the horse ie not in front of the leg, varying rhythm, not straight, not proper bend, not through, not using the corners etc FWIW the horses that have the big paces are often so much harder to ride well than the ones that are less extravagant and they are all not forward thinking and co-operative either but the exercises are just as useful for "ordinary" horses like most of us ride.

 

[LEC]

I really liked Hayley Watson Greaves videos as showed basic movements really well and how you develop into something more complicated. I have used them on everything from a very green 5yo to a fairly established medium level horse. It doesn't show what you quite want which is the warts and all in training but they are useful.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCSxS8yatwdXiXC8_buivbcw

 

[Muddywellies]

I totally get where you're coming from. Trying to teach dressage to a beach donkey is waaaaaay harder than to a horse that was born piaffing. But pretty much all online training videos are done either on horses who can already do it, or youngsters who were bred to do it and by pretty skilled riders. If me and my horse were used for a training demo it would be a VERY long and boring video ?