Overhorsed

Every person is different though personally I enjoy the challenge plus the wealth of knowledge I have gained from having my mare for the past 10months. It's only small progress but we have made progress. Plus she is young so we have all the time in the world. Mine would wind up on the meat wagon haha with the amount physical issues she has had (wouldn't pass a vetting and no one would be able to insure her) people have openly told me they would of put her to sleep and got a new one if she was theirs. What they don't understand though is that she is my horse for life and when we do have good days it makes all the **** days worth it!
People need to help this girl as said before she already knows she is not a good enough rider for this horse AT THE MOMENT but she can get better she needs good support not the type that doesn't think it's worth it to school the horse for a PAYING customer because they don't think she is good enough for the horse.
 
This woman probably doesn't know that she is over horsed and i can almost certainly say it was by accident. In her eyes she will have bought herself a good horse that will make her a better rider. You posting online and probably bitching about her at the yard is NOT going to help. If she doesn't ask / want your help then stay out IMO. :)
 
teamsarazara said:
This woman probably doesn't know that she is over horsed and i can almost certainly say it was by accident. In her eyes she will have bought herself a good horse that will make her a better rider. You posting online and probably bitching about her at the yard is NOT going to help. If she doesn't ask / want your help then stay out IMO. :)
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I have not been bitching about her at the yard. I posted this because I found her in tears in the car park! OH and I got her calmed down to the point we felt she was safe to drive home but we don't know what else we can do if she won't accept the advice of the three professionals she has said she wants help from. Do we sit back and wait for her to be seriously injured while the horse goes from bad to worse?
 
AmiRobertson said:
People need to help this girl as said before she already knows she is not a good enough rider for this horse AT THE MOMENT but she can get better she needs good support not the type that doesn't think it's worth it to school the horse for a PAYING customer because they don't think she is good enough for the horse.
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YM has decided to give up schooling horse as the horse is not the problem and any work she does is undone by nervous unbalanced owner. Yard does not normally offer exercise but YM will occasionally help out if someone is having a problem or is short of time. Horse goes OK for YM and instructor, although it is taking longer and longer to get the horse calm enough to listen. Owner is not going to improve on this horse as horse is getting to the point of being unrideable by its owner as it rears every time she leads it to the mounting block. This is why she is so upset.

I think she has totally lost sight of the fact that this is a hobby that she and the horse are meant to enjoy.
 
I am sorry but the rearing sounds a very extreme behaviour just because an unbalanced rider is getting on her back. It sounds like she needs a new instructor and new physio. Horses don't behave like that for no reason I have learnt that lesson many times with my mare.
 
AmiRobertson said:
I am sorry but the rearing sounds a very extreme behaviour just because an unbalanced rider is getting on her back. It sounds like she needs a new instructor and new physio. Horses don't behave like that for no reason I have learnt that lesson many times with my mare.
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I agree that horse don't behave like that for no reason and the reason sadly is the owner. Horse doesn't behave like this with instructor or YM or physio. It does it with owner as a) owner is giving off panic vibes all the time she is handling the horse and b) horse now thinks that being ridden by the owner will be a scarey unpleasant experience.

I am not trying to badmouth the owner as I think she needs help but she won't accept it
 
AmiRobertson said:
I am sorry but the rearing sounds a very extreme behaviour just because an unbalanced rider is getting on her back. It sounds like she needs a new instructor and new physio. Horses don't behave like that for no reason I have learnt that lesson many times with my mare.
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This - every day.
 
I know you just want to help but I really think she should get the vet out. My own horse is four and we are both unbalanced I also get nervous but she would never not let me on her UNLESS she was in pain. When I first got her she was the most horrific napper in the school plunging and spinning its a miracle I never came off. Everyone told Me i wasn't a good enough rider for her and if someone didnt take charge of my mare she would be ruined. I knew it was pain. First physio recommended to me was rubbish my mare was still napping. Found another one who was fantastic she spent two hours on dizzy she had twisted her back from a fall prior to me getting her. She had physio and 3 weeks off and never napped in the school again. This a very extreme behaviour from a horse who as you said came from a highly recommended dressage yard so she must be well schooled plus she is 7 that is young but not that young unless this girl is doing something truly horrific to this horse when she is riding her I would bet money there is more to this.
 
I was overhorsed with my last horse.It was horrible and affected my confidence at every level in my riding.I never want to go through that again.I have never felt that my horses were DISPOSSABLE and I took great care and in this case a fair amount of money to make sure he went to a good and much more suitable home than he had with me.I am sure he is much happier there and my current horse is much happier with me than his last home.I know you can't tell an adult what to do with their own money, you just have to butt out but an older man in our yard bought a totally unsuitable horse.He had three serious falls, the last one very serious.He has since sold this horse who was lovely but very sharp and sensitive and totally unsuitable for the novice that he is.Some partnerships are just not meant to be.
 
Sounds to me like this owner has everyone around her judging her every move, pecking her head about the matter and sucking their teeth every time either her or the horse puts a foot wrong. Maybe out of jealousy that she bought a competition-ready warmblood & the rest of the yardies don't thinks he deserves one? If she wants to improve and is given a chance to, she can. She's obviously got the money to chuck at it, she just needs some help! If it was me I'd be changing yards and vetting instructors for ones who have a positive attitude.
 
Rollin said:
Buy a Cleveland Bay, a well handled 3 year old if you can find one. get it professionally backed, as you will not pay a fortune for the horse, you can afford to do that.

You will have a quiet hack and a talented riding club horse who won't cost you an arm and a leg in vet bills, won't need lots of expensive feed and will give you years of happy hacking.
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Persephone said:
Bit of a generalisation!
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Indeed.....the one I know is a spooky, bolshy, bad tempered, git of a horse....:eek:
 
DanceswithCows said:
Sounds to me like this owner has everyone around her judging her every move, pecking her head about the matter and sucking their teeth every time either her or the horse puts a foot wrong. Maybe out of jealousy that she bought a competition-ready warmblood & the rest of the yardies don't thinks he deserves one? If she wants to improve and is given a chance to, she can. She's obviously got the money to chuck at it, she just needs some help! If it was me I'd be changing yards and vetting instructors for ones who have a positive attitude.
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Whilst I think you are maybe going a little too far I get what you are saying. I certainly know I am a lot more nervous when a lot of people are watching at our yard and my boy definately picks up on it...he doesn't go as far as rearing or anything like what has been described though so perhaps the horse is in some pain

It's impossible to judge as an outsider
 
Smogul said:
I agree that horse don't behave like that for no reason and the reason sadly is the owner. Horse doesn't behave like this with instructor or YM or physio. It does it with owner as a) owner is giving off panic vibes all the time she is handling the horse and b) horse now thinks that being ridden by the owner will be a scarey unpleasant experience.
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Yes of course an unbalanced and nervous rider can have a horse react unfavourably towards them when being mounted or when being ridden. Not sure why some people think that doesn't happen because it sure does.

I am not trying to badmouth the owner as I think she needs help but she won't accept it
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There is nothing you can do. And it's not your place to do so either. It's up to the owner to come to the conclusion that the horse and she are incompatible. Just enjoy your own horse and don't concern yourself about others who choose a different route from the one you might.
 
Spring Feather said:
There is nothing you can do. And it's not your place to do so either. It's up to the owner to come to the conclusion that the horse and she are incompatible. Just enjoy your own horse and don't concern yourself about others who choose a different route from the one you might.
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have to agree with this. If owner doesn't want your help, there is nothing you can do and you're wasting your time worrying about it.
 
Sory I've not read all the replies but... Let the owner get on with it. Or if she asks you maybe suggest she has some lessons with someone who can also school the horse. Sometimes when you start overhorsed, you can end up with something lovely. I tried a 16.3hh 5yr old IDx that was just backed and had only been gelded 6 months when I was 13. He put me in hospital 5 times in the 2 weeks I had him on trial. Funnily enough I still have him and enjoy every minute with him. I was over horsed for a few years, but I felt sory for him (6 dealers by the time you're 5 can't be fun.), I got lessons a lot and had my mum who knows her stuff telling me what to do every time I had trouble. I'd say I now have a pretty well rounded 14 year old. Hacks nicely, jumps nicely, schools nicely and is an absolute lamb out XC and mock hunting. If you've clicked with a horse there's no point anyone telling you to sell them.
 
I really don't think that there is anything you can do except provide an ear and be supportive.

Look at it from this lady's point of view

She gets her dream (first) horse - and it's all gone wrong. She's losing her confidence and she must be aware that it's affecting the horse. But she loves him and feels that she has to try everything before she gives up on him and her dream. She's probably not experienced enough to realise how much damage she may be doing and all she's getting is lots of people telling her to get rid. If she's talking to non horsey people they may have a 'pet' mentality i.e. 'I'd never give up on my cat/dog/rabbit/small furry of choice' and so she is throwing time, money and effort into trying to make the dream work for her.

It's a horrible position to be in - yes, I've been overhorsed before too - and she needs to make her decisions herself, IIWY I would let her talk, try whatever (I wouldn't be surprised if NH comes up next, yes cynical I know :o) as he is her horse and as an adult, the choices are hers.

Admittedly I'd struggle to hold my tongue in these circumstances but the mantra of MYOB comes into play...;)
 
budley95 said:
Sory I've not read all the replies but... Let the owner get on with it. Or if she asks you maybe suggest she has some lessons with someone who can also school the horse. Sometimes when you start overhorsed, you can end up with something lovely. I tried a 16.3hh 5yr old IDx that was just backed and had only been gelded 6 months when I was 13. He put me in hospital 5 times in the 2 weeks I had him on trial. Funnily enough I still have him and enjoy every minute with him. I was over horsed for a few years, but I felt sory for him (6 dealers by the time you're 5 can't be fun.), I got lessons a lot and had my mum who knows her stuff telling me what to do every time I had trouble. I'd say I now have a pretty well rounded 14 year old. Hacks nicely, jumps nicely, schools nicely and is an absolute lamb out XC and mock hunting. If you've clicked with a horse there's no point anyone telling you to sell them.
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That's all very well, but if you'd had a more appropriate horse no doubt you would have progressed in a less haphazard (not to say safer!) fashion.
 
I think that as much as anything, many people don't know how truly difficult or sharp a horse can be. If you've never dealt with a truly difficult horse it is easy to think 'what's the worst that could happen'
 
Cortez said:
That's all very well, but if you'd had a more appropriate horse no doubt you would have progressed in a less haphazard (not to say safer!) fashion.
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More than likely yes! But it's all part of the fun when you're young (apparently). He was deemed an appropriate horse for what I was looking for (despite being over the 15.2hh I was looking for!) by my instructor, who also happened to be the YO and the dealer that sold me him. Think she may of wanted rid somehow... Touch wood I've only fallen off 3 times since then, and they were all completely my fault for fluffing up something or other! I was moving up from my 14.2hh that I'd broken in and had taken eventing a lot but just got too tall for, as she was a very fine Connie X a bit of everything thrown in! Completely agree about it being haphazard though!


My point was that it's up to the owner to decide. If she can put the work in, along with the tears and the spitting dirt, she might find she has her horse of a lifetime. The OP can only be there to listen to her and calm her down when she's upset. She may just want a schoolmaster or a nice safe ploddy horse to have a lesson or enjoy a hack on every now ang again to let her maintain some shred of confidence though!
 
You can tell people they are over horsed, they wont hear you, speaking personally here, people just don't understand the bond that this person had with their 'too much horse'

6 weeks out from the inevitable wreck today, and wishing I had never bought him......also wishing for a full nights sleep and a pain free day, but that's another story.
 
I am totally overhorsed by my TB - he is sharp, sensitive, easily distracted and gets ridiculously overexcited at shows... Plus when he decides he's ha enough, I just can't sit more than two or tree of his HUGE bucks. However, I am going to try and find a way to manage it, and to make it work - keeping him a little lean, working him daily in short bursts, not taking him in a collecting ring, picking ny battles in general... And hopefully in a few years he might settle down a bit!!! And despite it all hes a great, talented horse I'm learning a lot from and having fun with, so does it matter if I'm overhorsed?? (Although if I get a second horse I'm getting a nice laid back highland I think lol)
 
khalswitz said:
I'm learning a lot from and having fun with, so does it matter if I'm overhorsed??
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So long as you are having fun! Point I was trying to make is that this woman isn't.

Text update this morning for owner's OH. Horse reared and barged past owner as she was trying to lead the horse out of the stable. She has a broken wrist and bruises but is otherwise OK. She has decided to sell the horse and give up riding. YM has offered to school the horse and show it off to potential buyers. OH thanked us for taking the time with her the other night and said it had helped her to talk to someone else who had gone throught this. (I had 4 months of misery with a pony that behaved beautifully with my instructors but turned into a napping rearing monster with me, simply because he knew he could. Fortunately I took their advice before I was injured).
I suggested he doesn't pressurise her into riding again but maybe wait six months and offer her to buy her a course of lessons with a good riding school. So sad and could have been avoided.
 
Aww... that's a shame about her wanting to give up riding. Hopefully the break will do her good and she will get back into it and find something more forgiving that she enjoys!

I had a conversation with someone the other week about overhorsing. They are pros and have a more "business-like" view of horses than some of us "pet" owners and were wondering why overhorsed owners who have had numerous scary incidents and are losing confidence don't just sell it on and buy something friendlier. I pointed out that people get attached to a horse and they can love the creature even if it regularly tries to kill them. The former can put you in some degree of denial about the latter.

I would like to think that I have been around enough and am cynical enough that when it comes time to buy a new horse, I won't fall in love with the first pretty horsey I see and will buy something with a brain that I will enjoy.
 
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khalswitz said:
I am totally overhorsed by my TB - he is sharp, sensitive, easily distracted and gets ridiculously overexcited at shows... Plus when he decides he's ha enough, I just can't sit more than two or tree of his HUGE bucks. However, I am going to try and find a way to manage it, and to make it work - keeping him a little lean, working him daily in short bursts, not taking him in a collecting ring, picking ny battles in general... And hopefully in a few years he might settle down a bit!!! And despite it all hes a great, talented horse I'm learning a lot from and having fun with, so does it matter if I'm overhorsed?? (Although if I get a second horse I'm getting a nice laid back highland I think lol)
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You may indeed be having fun (you might just possibly have even more fun with a different, more amenable horse?), but it doesn't sound as if your horse is. What happens if "in a few years" he hasn't settled down? Actually I do think it matters that you are overhorsed, you don't have to be, you know.
 
Over the many years of horse ownership I have encountered many people that have ended up being over-horsed and failing to enjoy riding their horses.

My solution to this is to let them ride my horse who will behave at all times. They can ride said horse by themselves around my fields and they will always come back with a big smile on their face.

The problem with horses these days is that they are not given enough basic groundwork and hacking skills when started and they are not allowed to become established in these skills.
 
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