Owner unwilling to take loan horse back

[Jambarissa]

My friend was looking to buy a horse for her daughter, found the perfect one but vetting suggested age around 17 not the 12 they were told (I assume no passport).

They couldnt find anything else they liked so ended up taking this horse on loan instead.

3 years on he's been good to have but the daughter is wanting to do more and the horse feels like he wants to do less so they've said they want to end the loan.

Contract says 2 months notice, owner was originally fine about it but then said she couldn't find a stable for him nearby so they waited longer and now says she can't afford him and is guilt tripping them.

They already feel bad, he's a lovely horse but they wouldn't have bought a 17 year old.

This can't be that uncommon a scenario. Anyone know what can be done? They can't just wash their hands of him and leave the yo to sort out.

 

[musk]

Can owner look for new loaner while still with your friend? Might be an idea just to get ball rolling and stop them dragging their feet. Loads of people are looking for loans so if the horse is still fit and healthy it will find a new home quickly I am sure

 

[Annagain]

How big is he? I got the impression he was a first pony but you call him a horse? If a pony, I think I'd ask her to sign him over to them and then find him a new little person to show the ropes to either on loan or if it's a perfect home, sell him. For a lead rein / first pony 20 isn't horrifically old. If a horse I'd help the owner to find another loaner who is looking for a horse who needs a quieter life.

 

[ihatework]

I’d assist in finding the horse a quieter loan home (with owners permission) and insist the owner pays the horses costs in the interim.

If the horse isn’t fit to be reloaned then I’d advise the owner to arrange PTS.

 

[webble]

I’d assist in finding the horse a quieter loan home (with owners permission) and insist the owner pays the horses costs in the interim.

If the horse isn’t fit to be reloaned then I’d advise the owner to arrange PTS.

This

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I would offer to try and find him a new loan home I'm sure if his sound and a nice easy horse to do you shouldn't have trouble finding someone.

 

[ycbm]

You can issue an abandonment notice and in days the horse becomes yours and you can sell him.
.

 

[Polos Mum]

Tricky as abandonment claim and then sale of a now 20 y/o might not be as easy as it sounds (I'm assuming he was 17 at pre purchase vetting and they've had him on loan for 3 years so 20 now)

I would tell the owners that as from XX date all bills will be their responsibility and you will charge time at £10 an hour for care not provided by the livery yard.
Does she have any tack that might be worth anything to cover bills if the owner doesn't get nudged into action by the threat of bills mounting up.

Does she know where the owner lives / keeps other horses? If so I would do a recky and see if there was anyway to take him back and leave him safely at the owners yard. Not the mad "leave him in her garden" stuff but if there was somewhere safe that might work.

 

[ycbm]

Everything sells at a price and £1 is £1 more than he cost. My concern would be to stop paying livery bills and potential vet bills for a horse the owner won't take back.


Always assuming the horse is currently fit and well, but still difficult if you're fond of the horse, of course.

 

[Barton Bounty]

Dont put a healthy horse to sleep please.. someone will be looking for what you have. I am sure you will find a home quickly

 

[sollimum]

After 3 years, I would be helping the owner to find him a new loan home. I am sure the owner loves him, the loaner loves him - work together as a team to find the best outcome. If he is a pony, people will be queuing up I am sure - if he is a horse then lots of people are looking for a kind hack (if that is what he is). Surely it is not about who is in the right, it is about finding him a safe home?

 

[PurBee]

Dont put a healthy horse to sleep please.. someone will be looking for what you have. I am sure you will find a home quickly

I agree - if he’s a safe plod hack, even for serene walk hacks once or twice a week, i’d loan that type, ambling around quiet forestry tracks. I see loads of adverts for ‘safe, sane hacking loan’. If i was taking horse-ownership into the slow lane but still wanted involvement with horses, just not high energy experience, an older, safe plod would be perfect. Age 20 shows experience, not complete exhaustion. My mare is high octane at 20! Im sure this horse will be snapped-up.

 

[Jellymoon]

Are you a BHS member? If so, I would call their legal helpline and ask them what you are legally allowed to do in this situation. You don’t want to get yourself into a troublesome situation.
Ideally, I would be offering to find a home for him myself, esp after he’s given the daughter 3 yrs of good service and presumably they have some feelings for him. It’s not his fault his owner lied about his age and they no longer want him. I would prefer to do this myself as clearly his owner doesn’t want him either.
Poor chap.

 

[jules9203]

Jambarisssa can you pm me with details of pony and where you are. I may be interested in him xx

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Jambarisssa can you pm me with details of pony and where you are. I may be interested in him xx

I hope they get in touch and his suitable please keep us updated

 

[Melody Grey]

If the owner isn’t in a position to take back, buy the horse for a token fee so you have a receipt and then sell on/ loan out. That way you know where he’s going and can give an honest, up to date picture of him.

 

[adamntitch]

How would that work tho when it says they don't think he has a passport ??

 

[asmp]

As on another thread - a local RDA group may be interested in taking the horse on loan if sensible. Our group is struggling to find a suitable horse and I gather other groups are in the same situation.

 

[Barton Bounty]

I agree - if he’s a safe plod hack, even for serene walk hacks once or twice a week, i’d loan that type, ambling around quiet forestry tracks. I see loads of adverts for ‘safe, sane hacking loan’. If i was taking horse-ownership into the slow lane but still wanted involvement with horses, just not high energy experience, an older, safe plod would be perfect. Age 20 shows experience, not complete exhaustion. My mare is high octane at 20! Im sure this horse will be snapped-up.

Depends the details, I would be interested

 

[hock]

Legally your friend has the law on her side etc etc. Morally I think they have a responsibility to rehome the horse. The owner sounds like a waste of time so unfortunately they need to step up and facilitate finding a new home with the agreement of the old owner.

 

[black and brown]

Whatever the outcome for the loaner and owner, I hope it is in the best interest of the horse. I feel sad that the horse appears to be stuck in the middle with nobody really wanting it.

 

[Jambarissa]

Thank you all for your replies. To answer a few questions he's a 15hh ex jumper used for RC activities, he's still very keen but was sore after comps even with danilon and vet advised an easier life. He's a very spooky hack unfortunately, would be ideal for someone who wanted to train in a bit of everything without competing.

The old owner had at least 4 when he was loaned out but now she 'is out of horses'. She lives about an hour away.

The consensus seems to be that she agrees with the owner to try to find another loan home. This does sound ideal and I'll suggest it although it does feel like landing someone else in it if/when they want to return him.

Friend has no intention of abandoning him but is now in a bit of a bind because was hoping to get the daughter her new horse by summer hols. She gave notice in early March.

We're northwest if anyone above is still interested in hearing about him, altho obviously he's not mine but I did tell my friend I'd see about getting her advice.

I'm a bhs member so might call them and ask for advice there too.

 

[Bonnie Allie]

After 3 years, I would be helping the owner to find him a new loan home. I am sure the owner loves him, the loaner loves him - work together as a team to find the best outcome. If he is a pony, people will be queuing up I am sure - if he is a horse then lots of people are looking for a kind hack (if that is what he is). Surely it is not about who is in the right, it is about finding him a safe home?

This.

These situations make me so angry. We loaned our wonderful ponies out to great families. What really gave me the s**ts though was the moment the horse/pony couldn’t keep their child moving up the grades they wanted to deliver it back to us.

They supposedly loved our ponies, but have never bothered to follow up and find out how they are doing in retirement or pop in and see them. Damned parents just wanted to offload the financial responsibility to me in the fastest possible manner once the pony was no longer aligned with the hopes and dreams for competition achievement.

These are the same folk who sucked up to me to ensure their kids got the pony as soon as it was available 3 years before.

Sometimes I hate horse people. These are sentient beings who serve us without complaint. If the pony has delivered for you, then you owe a bit of responsibility in finding it a great outcome even if the owner may not be able to take it back.

and the talk of “don’t pay the livery” - why would you do that to a business owner just because you can’t be arsed taking some responsibility yourself for the situation.

 

[ycbm]

This.

These situations make me so angry. We loaned our wonderful ponies out to great families. What really gave me the s**ts though was the moment the horse/pony couldn’t keep their child moving up the grades they wanted to deliver it back to us.

They supposedly loved our ponies, but have never bothered to follow up and find out how they are doing in retirement or pop in and see them. Damned parents just wanted to offload the financial responsibility to me in the fastest possible manner once the pony was no longer aligned with the hopes and dreams for competition achievement.

Isn't that the point of a loan and contracted notice periods?

 

[Art Nouveau]

Isn't that the point of a loan and contracted notice periods?

I was about to say the same! Particularly for a child who is likely to be frequently outgrowing ponies either in size or ability.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Isn't that the point of a loan and contracted notice periods?

The problem is that people's circumstances change, so if OP friend can help to find the horse a new home that would be the ideal solution imho. It's a shame that neither party thought of that at the beginning of the notice period.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Isn't that the point of a loan and contracted notice periods?

Indeed. As long as they look after the pony correctly when it is in their care and observe the notice period when terminating the loan, then that is the point of a loan.

You, as owner, could whip the pony out from underneath them at any time even if they wanted it to continue. A loan is temporary.

ETA Why does he need danilon after comps? What has the vet diagnosed as the reason for him needing an easier life?

 

[ycbm]

if OP friend can help to find the horse a new home that would be the ideal solution imho

Of course it would.

But to be honest I would be disinclined to get involved with finding another home for a horse which is spooky to hack and sore after Riding Club competitions even when given danilon. He sounds more like a retirement prospect.


ETA to explain. Spooky to hack often goes with pain as the horse is on high alert. Even if it's not a associated with pain "spooky to hack" is very few people's idea of a nice ride, especially not people who are prepared to take on a horse which is light hack only. And since the horse is sore if he does too much work he presumably shouldn't be spending hours doing circles in an arena either. The only home I'd be looking for on behalf of the owner would be as a companion, and that's fraught with risk. The loaner is between a rock and a hard place with this one, sadly.
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