Parelli are only filling a need for a quick fix

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antagonist

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Parelli are a commercial organiastion who along with several others have identified equine owners desire for a quick fix.

They have a slick marketing machine and have recognised and exploited the cult of celebrity.

If the equine world was willing to be patient and school horses using a sensible sound approach then the market they have exploited will not exsist.

If the equine world do not change their collective mindset then they will mearly be replaced by another fade, latest gadget or expert.
 
Yes, except of course there is no collective mindset.
You could probably say the same of the athletics world, the church world, the needlework world .. it's a modern disease.
You're right of course. It takes a long time to school a horse. And another out of fashion virtue, a little humility.
 
I am surprised no one has taken me up on this. This goes further than Parelli but a fundemental mindset of the horse owning public tat needs to be examined.
 
I think you are right Parelli again yawn!!

I should have entitled it, bare foot shoeing, swales bits, super cure all oitment or tomorrows fad...are they only filling a need for a quick fix. But the title string isn't long enough for this!
 
From everything I've seen it's far from a 'quick fix'. In fact you spend MONTHS messing about just getting the horse to back up.

Yes, it's has slick marketing but it has filled a gap in the market - for those lacking experience gained through many years of working with horses (which nowadays is hard to get) it breaks it down into step by step bite sized pieces. If the horsey world was less snobby (and expensive) about sharing their knowledge and experience with others there may not even be a market for it.

I don't like pat parrelli (I think he's a hypocrite and not a very good horse man either) but they have produced an easy-to-follow guide from those needing help. No wonder it sells well.
 
I think the problem is that owners don't have the confidence, or maybe the time, to work with their horses the way they should. When we bought ours 6 years ago I ended a 22 year break from horses. As a child I used to reschool people's problem ponies, I would ride anything with no fear, I would handle anything with no fear. I was a riding instructress and I had a lot of knowledge. On buying 2 wild ponies 6 years ago, one a colt that turned aggressive (probably because I had forgotten everything I ever knew) and tried to attack my daughter I immediately learned fear and this led to me losing my confidence and forgetting everything I ever knew. I became desperate for a way to sort this pony out so that I wouldn't have to have him pts. I was terrified of him even after gelding and eventually after much internet searching I contacted and IH recommended associate. I got right into the whole thing but had constant worry that I wasn't doing it properly, the way they say. I can look back now and see exactly where I went wrong with the pony from the start, this is nothing to do with IH but to do with me rediscovering my knowledge and confidence. I really do think people are just looking for a way to get it right, and tbh so what if it costs a lot of money, if it helps those people then all is good. I would say that a very high percentage of the people who practise NH/IH and all the others don't get anywhere near the stuff that has caused all the trouble (and well deserved, it was disgusting). I would say that if people can't afford it then they won't do it so those who do must be able to afford it, they are simply a business and will continue as long as they make money.
 
Is the problem that experianced horse people are unwilling to share their knowledge or is that the inexperianced are unwilling to take it?

We appear to have a situation where peolple will self diagnose problem horses based on DVD rather than asking advice from them around them. The perception is that advice that is paid for must be more valuable than freely offered advice from those who can see the situation.
 
antagonist said:
Is the problem that experianced horse people are unwilling to share their knowledge or is that the inexperianced are unwilling to take it?

We appear to have a situation where peolple will self diagnose problem horses based on DVD rather than asking advice from them around them. The perception is that advice that is paid for must be more valuable than freely offered advice from those who can see the situation.
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I suppose you will have experienced people who don't like to butt in and inexperienced people who don't like to ask. You will also have those who know nothing who will offer a load of cr*p advice and make the situation 10 times worse. I would never ask for help from someone who brags about how much they know but now would be happy to ask someone who's opinion I respect. I suppose before I thought 'professional' advice and help would be more effective and also at the time didn't really have anyone to ask as we were on a small yard with 1 loony other livery! In fact the day she grabbed the colts lead rope to 'show me how to lead him' and nearly shat herself when he went up in the air and boxed at her proved to me that she wasn't worth asking anything! The RA that came out to him dealt with the rearing in about 5 minutes and he has never done it since (5 years ago) - money well spent!
 
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antagonist said:
I am surprised no one has taken me up on this. This goes further than Parelli but a fundemental mindset of the horse owning public tat needs to be examined.
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but I did take you up on it, and pointed out that it was NOT just the horse owning public, it was an entire generation.

Not the answer you were looking for? Waiting for someone to throw a punch from the Parelli corner?
 
Assessing the quality of advice is something we all do on a regular basis. Unfortunately, the younger horse owners may not have the life skills to make these judgements calls!

Personally, my first port of call in this process of assesing advice is whats in it for them. This makes me very uneasy about Parelli and the many others.
 
hch4971 said:
I suppose you will have experienced people who don't like to butt in and inexperienced people who don't like to ask. You will also have those who know nothing who will offer a load of cr*p advice and make the situation 10 times worse. I would never ask for help from someone who brags about how much they know but now would be happy to ask someone who's opinion I respect. I suppose before I thought 'professional' advice and help would be more effective and also at the time didn't really have anyone to ask as we were on a small yard with 1 loony other livery! In fact the day she grabbed the colts lead rope to 'show me how to lead him' and nearly shat herself when he went up in the air and boxed at her proved to me that she wasn't worth asking anything! The RA that came out to him dealt with the rearing in about 5 minutes and he has never done it since (5 years ago) - money well spent!
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Oh dear. We still have a lot of angry people around!!! The parelli "learn by DVD" formulae may be abused and misenterpretated. The fact remains, that is, western philosophy and "NH" for want of a better term is an incredible useful tool, when in the right hands.
 
antagonist said:
Parelli are a commercial organiastion who along with several others have identified equine owners desire for a quick fix
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I strongly disagree. The PNH program is not about 'quick fixes'. People who invest in PNH home study courses are not looking for a quick fix. An equine owner that is looking for a quick fix will consult a horse behaviourist who will sort it out for them.

'Pat Parelli' and the 'PNH Program' are not one and the same thing .....
 
skewbald_again said:
but I did take you up on it, and pointed out that it was NOT just the horse owning public, it was an entire generation.

Not the answer you were looking for? Waiting for someone to throw a punch from the Parelli corner?
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My aim is not to debate Parelli but the atitudes of the horse owning public and the need for a fad, and as you pointed out this extends to the entire spectrum of modern life.

Debating the pros and cons of parelli would but such an easier debate to have, but it has been done to death!
 
antagonist said:
Assessing the quality of advice is something we all do on a regular basis. Unfortunately, the younger horse owners may not have the life skills to make these judgements calls!

Personally, my first port of call in this process of assesing advice is whats in it for them. This makes me very uneasy about Parelli and the many others.
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But you know what is in it for them - money, they are simply a business! BUT.....if they make people think about what they are doing with their horse, then it that such a bad thing!
 
antagonist said:
My aim is not to debate Parelli but the atitudes of the horse owning public and the need for a fad, and as you pointed out this extends to the entire spectrum of modern life.

Debating the pros and cons of parelli would but such an easier debate to have, but it has been done to death!
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So what is your fad?? bet you've got one!! In fact, to a lot of people owning horses would be considered a major and unnecessary fad in itself!!
 
hch4971 said:
But you know what is in it for them - money, they are simply a business! BUT.....if they make people think about what they are doing with their horse, then it that such a bad thing!
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But is watching a set of DVD's a subsitute for experiance. Shouldn't you buy that experiance by getting advice (either paid or unpaid) than spend money on DVD's.

Do the DVD's make people think they know what they are doing rather than actually know what they are doing?
 
vandypip said:
Oh dear. We still have a lot of angry people around!!! The parelli "learn by DVD" formulae may be abused and misenterpretated. The fact remains, that is, western philosophy and "NH" for want of a better term is an incredible useful tool, when in the right hands.
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I'm sorry, what part of my post made it look like I was angry! I agree with you that it is a useful tool, as are part of IH and RM, and all the others. I have a carrot stick, I use 12ft ropes, I have NH rope halters (which I love) and I have a dually, I would rather longline than lunge! I believe that anything which helps owners to work with their horses in a manner that suits both is good. I am NOT anti NH methods, I don't agree with how PP handled things at that demonstration, wrong place etc, I don't like HIM, but I am not anti the system. I have never paid a penny to any of the organisations for training other for an RA to sort my pony. I have also never used their DVD's to learn but did watch the Monty Roberts one on how to use the dually properly.
 
I see pp is one of the 3 trainers taking part in The road to the horse colt starting compitition next year so it will be interesting to see how he stacks up...
 
antagonist said:
But is watching a set of DVD's a subsitute for experiance. Shouldn't you buy that experiance by getting advice (either paid or unpaid) than spend money on DVD's.

Do the DVD's make people think they know what they are doing rather than actually know what they are doing?
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I don't know, I would think that those who use the dvds would know by the results whether or not they were getting it right. If people choose to use dvds thenthat is up to them, if they prefer to learn that way. People learn in different ways through different media and it has to be personal choice. I don't really see what difference it makes how you learn if you get the desired result in whatever area you are learning.
 
hch4971 said:
I don't know, I would think that those who use the dvds would know by the results whether or not they were getting it right. If people choose to use dvds thenthat is up to them, if they prefer to learn that way. People learn in different ways through different media and it has to be personal choice. I don't really see what difference it makes how you learn if you get the desired result in whatever area you are learning.
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Would you let your child be operated on by a surgeon who had just watched the DVD.

DVD is a learning tool and a component of gaining a sound knowledge, but not the only component.
 
antagonist said:
Would you let your child be operated on by a surgeon who had just watched the DVD.

DVD is a learning tool and a component of gaining a sound knowledge, but not the only component.
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No, but I used a dually after watching the dvd and correctly too!!
I agree it is not the only component but I cannot imagine anyone watching a P dvd and thinking that they are an expert because they had watched it. I would imagine that they would practice until they got it right and would check back with the dvd to confirm they are using the correct method! Nor would the NHS in this country allow a surgeon to operate unless he had practised what he had learned from the DVD!!!!
 
vandypip said:
Maybe you're suckered antonganist by starting this debate? why, if you are so opposed, waste your time???
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The dabate is to challange people's perception that the lastest vogue, fad, gadget, or fashion is an essential component of your life.

To train a horse you need patients, time and empathy not DVD's, the latest bit, or the limited edition cure all oitment!
 
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