People who run down BHS exams have usually failed them themselves??????

[yaddowshad]

An observation I have made since joining this forum is that people love to run down the BHS exam system, and im wondering why this is so.

BHS level 1 is aimed at the absolute beginner so they are not expected to be experienced around horses and would not necessarily be employable as grooms.

BHS Level 2 introduces the digestive system and skeleton (how many of you experienced horse people know these systems?????) because at BHS 2 you have to. also jumping is introduced and to quite a high standard, they must have an independant seat to pass.

BHS 3 Muscle systems, conformation, leg conformation and tendon injuries ect, pasture management, double bridle and advanced tack, ect ect all at a reasonably high standard. Only at this stage are you awarded the grooms certificate. Jumping and flat is now much more developed as is the cross country phase.

None of these exams are easy and the examiners make you work for a pass.

So just wondering why so many people knock this system??????????????? Is it cos they cant do it themselves?????

 

[rema]

I have done all three as it was required by my boss at the time,,and he paid for it all but i probably wouldent of done them if i had to pay for them myself as i was not planning on working with horses long term.Why someone would knock them i'm not sure,they serve a purpose and are a recognised qualification,where as NVQ's are still very much ignored by employers.

 

[galaxy]

As an AI it does get to me sometimes too....

I know people say they know people who have the BHS exmas who can't ride for toffee.... But have you checked they actually do? I know 2 people who say they have their AI, when actually they never passed their entire Stage 3. Doesn't that say something?

I know someone however who has their Stage 2 who seems oblivious to the fact that their horse is horrendously overweight and really quite crippled lame... I just make myself feel better in that you don't actually get examined to lameness until stage 3...

I'd never say that you HAVE to have BHS exams to teach. There are plenty of people with great experience who teach well (there are LOADS that don't though!). I do compete BD. Not loads, but do. But actually I love teaching beginners and children (freelance). I do teach some competitive teenagers and adults, that do very well actually. I wouldn't teach someone who wanted to jump Foxhunters, go Novice Eventing, or Advanced Medium Dressage does that make me a bad instructor? I don't think so.

 

[Sparkles]

I've done my stage 3 and PTT training, looking back, they're honestly not that 'hard' so to speak but it's more just the pressure of an exam rather than the subject topics.

What I DON'T like about them, and I'm not a huge BHS fan when it comes to yards and training tbh, is that anyone can literally pick up the manual and do them, more-so the care. It's all fine having the subject criteria there in front of you beforehand and knowing what you need to know to put in your answers...but, having known some people that have taken the exams and passed, when in reality in a non-exam and no text book situation, they wouldn't actually be able to diagnose or use common sense when analysing/treating/giving advice/fitting tack to suit that horse/etc. As the experience just isn't there, it was just words learnt from a book.

Not saying that's the case for everyone obviously, most people are out competing/working/ and knowledgable etc. But there are a handful people who go out and do them who would just be useless to work on a yard in RL, but still have the 'qualification' on their name.

I still think, experience is more important than any 'stage' and would much rather have years of experience and be able to work with common sense and a sound knowledge instilled in me, rather than book learnt knowledge which doesn't always have a place on a yard.

However. That said. With how insurance and H&S is going these days, I wouldn't be surprised if it was going to end up being compulsory to have BHS stages or similar to comply with employee insurance in ten years time! Same as teaching as gone.

 

[Gluttonforpunishment]

Totally agree with Binky01.

If you can read, absorb and ride to a reasonable standard you can pass the exams - doesn't actually mean you have the experience & overall experience to be a good instructor / horseperson.

 

[dressagecrazy]

Im qualified & i think it's an un-fair statement to say all those who run down the BHS have usually failed.
The exams themselves are good & i would encourage anyone to at least go & take there stage 1.

Unfortunately the reasons why i slate the system is have seen some horrendous teaching done by AI's & I's to stage pupils & this is why i usually end up running the system down.

When i was training i ended up watching an BHSII make a girl cry. I then witnessed this same instructor beat a 3yo horse around the legs because it wouldnt pick it's foot up to be picked out by the stage 2 pupils who where all stood watching & being taught this was the right thing to do.

It was disgusting what annoys me more is that this same person has somehow got up to an I status now & she still hasnt changed.

 

[Blaise]

I wouldn't run down the BHS exams, but they're not perfect either. I absolutley hate exam situations and can be relied upon to forget everything i previously knew and turn into a rambling idiot, therefore prefer the NVQ system of doing things. I also think NVQ's give assessors a better idea of how candidates deal with situations on a day to day basis, rather than just on a specific day. However i realise that the NVQ system isn't as respected yet and the BHS exams are here to stay. Sometimes i do wish there was another way of doing things though, i would love to be able to qualify as an instructor but i know this is very unlikely to happen. I could pass the care side of the exams no problem, and would probably be able to do the riding part of stage 2 but it's highly unlikely i'd be able to do stage 3 riding. Not that i'm not capable, the flatwork section would be fine and i've jumped 3'3''+ SJ & XC courses on plenty of occasions in the past and used to love it but thanks to a back & neck condition now i just couldnt risk going XC on a horse i'd never rode before. I'll do it on my own, but i know them and how to ride them and it makes a big difference. I'm only 23 & i've been riding 15 years so it really does frustrate me that i'll never be able to teach as i won't be insured when i'm sure i could make a decent instructor one day. I know the exams are designed to test your capabilities and to make sure you're up to a certain standard, it's just frustrating knowing that i could be but can't do the exam as i can't do one small section of it purely for physical reasons rather than lack of knowledge. Anyway, my mini-rant over

 

[Kittykins]

The thing about the BHS exams, for me, is that they're a bit like your driving test: they prove that you can do what's required of you to pass the test, but nothing more. I know some horrendous drivers who've managed to pass their test - doesn't mean I'd get in a car if they were driving. Same goes for the BHS exams and horses.

 

[yaddowshad]

Im qualified & i think it's an un-fair statement to say all those who run down the BHS have usually failed.
The exams themselves are good & i would encourage anyone to at least go & take there stage 1.

Unfortunately the reasons why i slate the system is have seen some horrendous teaching done by AI's & I's to stage pupils & this is why i usually end up running the system down.

When i was training i ended up watching an BHSII make a girl cry. I then witnessed this same instructor beat a 3yo horse around the legs because it wouldnt pick it's foot up to be picked out by the stage 2 pupils who where all stood watching & being taught this was the right thing to do.

It was disgusting what annoys me more is that this same person has somehow got up to an I status now & she still hasnt changed.

Totally agree with you some teachers dont have good people skills and can easily ruin someones confidence by shouting at them.

 

[yaddowshad]

I wouldn't run down the BHS exams, but they're not perfect either. I absolutley hate exam situations and can be relied upon to forget everything i previously knew and turn into a rambling idiot, therefore prefer the NVQ system of doing things. I also think NVQ's give assessors a better idea of how candidates deal with situations on a day to day basis, rather than just on a specific day. However i realise that the NVQ system isn't as respected yet and the BHS exams are here to stay. Sometimes i do wish there was another way of doing things though, i would love to be able to qualify as an instructor but i know this is very unlikely to happen. I could pass the care side of the exams no problem, and would probably be able to do the riding part of stage 2 but it's highly unlikely i'd be able to do stage 3 riding. Not that i'm not capable, the flatwork section would be fine and i've jumped 3'3''+ SJ & XC courses on plenty of occasions in the past and used to love it but thanks to a back & neck condition now i just couldnt risk going XC on a horse i'd never rode before. I'll do it on my own, but i know them and how to ride them and it makes a big difference. I'm only 23 & i've been riding 15 years so it really does frustrate me that i'll never be able to teach as i won't be insured when i'm sure i could make a decent instructor one day. I know the exams are designed to test your capabilities and to make sure you're up to a certain standard, it's just frustrating knowing that i could be but can't do the exam as i can't do one small section of it purely for physical reasons rather than lack of knowledge. Anyway, my mini-rant over

Very valid points, I know alot of people who would like to become teachers using the BHS system but absolutely hate jumping for one reason or another. In other countries you can take teaching exams by specializing in one area either dressage or jumping which is a far better system to me. I would rather have an instructor who was a specialist in their field of teaching. I dont need a showjumper to teach me dressage.

 

[yaddowshad]

An observation I have made since joining this forum is that people love to run down the BHS exam system, and im wondering why this is so.

BHS level 1 is aimed at the absolute beginner so they are not expected to be experienced around horses and would not necessarily be employable as grooms.

BHS Level 2 introduces the digestive system and skeleton (how many of you experienced horse people know these systems?????) because at BHS 2 you have to. also jumping is introduced and to quite a high standard, they must have an independant seat to pass.

BHS 3 Muscle systems, conformation, leg conformation and tendon injuries ect, pasture management, double bridle and advanced tack, ect ect all at a reasonably high standard. Only at this stage are you awarded the grooms certificate. Jumping and flat is now much more developed as is the cross country phase.

None of these exams are easy and the examiners make you work for a pass.

So just wondering why so many people knock this system??????????????? Is it cos they cant do it themselves?????

Thank you for all the comments, it highlites the need for the BHS to consider allowing people to be taught to be teachers without having to jump if they dont want to. Other countries dont deny you the right to teach just because you cant jump or dont want to jump. What if you are unable to jump due to a disability of some kind!!!!!!! I feel a new thread coming on.......

 

[charlie76]

I have my BHSI (SM) . For stage 4 I had to showjump to newcomers level and xc to BE novice level plus ride on the flat at medium level. I don't think thats easy.
For my SM I had to give a talk on the conformation of a horse from top to bottom and in extreme detail, be able to assess a horse for sale, know all there is to know about feeding and fittening 4 * event horses, PSG dressage horses, Grade A SJ and endurance horses at Golden Horseshoe level as well as be able to have in depth knowledge about breeding,AI,ailments and drugs to treat them. I also had to give a 15 min lecture on Riding Schools in the 21st century with power point and hand outs and have a in depth knowledge about running an equestrian centre as a business, RIDDOR, COSH, Approvals, Licencing, Insurance ect.

I am doing my E & T in the Autumn where I am expected to assess and improve an unknown horse to ad med level, sj to foxhunter level and xc to BE intermediate level as well as ride and assess a horse as if I am buying it for a client.
I have to lunge youngsters and teach on the flat to Ad med level, foxhunter sj level and BE intermediate level.

I do believe that to take any of these exams require some form of skill and practical experience.

 

[teddyt]

Ive got a few BHS exams but i personally dont rate them. i know of several qualified instructors that i wouldnt let within a mile of my horses.

When i took mine, ten or so years ago, it was very much a money making scheme for the BHS imo! The boys who flirted with the female examiners always passed, the gobby girls always passed because they elbowed their way past others and those who actually knew what they were doing often failed.

 

[Kat]

I'm planning to have a bash at mine, so it isn't in my interest to run them down but I seriously think there should be more focus on teaching skills for the AI.

I have seen a lot of fairly junior instructors teach while my nephew has been learning to ride. I have lessons at a where to train centre and they tend to let the "trainees" practice on the lead rein classes whereas the more advanced groups are almost always taught by senior staff. Some are brilliant, but others are really lacking basic communication skills. It doesn't necessarily follow that the best riders are the good ones either!

Having said that I've had a few really excellent instructors, but then I think there is more emphasis on coaching for the II and I.

 

[Kat]

Oh and I also think that the register of instructors should be improved so that you can tell exactly what level any instructor is qualified to. It is frustrating that you can't check up on an instructor who is employed full time at a riding school because they are not required to be on the register.

 

[yaddowshad]

I have my BHSI (SM) . For stage 4 I had to showjump to newcomers level and xc to BE novice level plus ride on the flat at medium level. I don't think thats easy.
For my SM I had to give a talk on the conformation of a horse from top to bottom and in extreme detail, be able to assess a horse for sale, know all there is to know about feeding and fittening 4 * event horses, PSG dressage horses, Grade A SJ and endurance horses at Golden Horseshoe level as well as be able to have in depth knowledge about breeding,AI,ailments and drugs to treat them. I also had to give a 15 min lecture on Riding Schools in the 21st century with power point and hand outs and have a in depth knowledge about running an equestrian centre as a business, RIDDOR, COSH, Approvals, Licencing, Insurance ect.

I am doing my E & T in the Autumn where I am expected to assess and improve an unknown horse to ad med level, sj to foxhunter level and xc to BE intermediate level as well as ride and assess a horse as if I am buying it for a client.
I have to lunge youngsters and teach on the flat to Ad med level, foxhunter sj level and BE intermediate level.

I do believe that to take any of these exams require some form of skill and practical experience.

WELL DONE, you are exactly the point im trying to make, im about to take level 4 and its been very hard work to get here, and endless hours studying so I hate it when people run it down unless they have a valid reason.

I do wish you the best of luck, you are a fine example of the system.

 

[Weezy]

I did mine eons ago and they have changed. Sorry, but after being told by a woman who had her Stage 1 and was *doing her PTT* and would no doubt become an AI that it was absolutely necessary to wash every gelding's sheath, me disagreeing and her telling me *well I know I am right, it is the the BHS book* I lost all will to live with the system.

The fact is some people read and then quote it as tho it is the Bible. They have no room for thinking outside the box and no natural take on issues.

I liken it to a Marketing company I temped at - they absolutely refused to take Marketing Graduates, as the MD stated *they come here thinking they know it all and their way is the right way because that is what their lecturer said, and they refuse to be adaptable*.

 

[charlie76]

Thanks and good luck to you! Esp learning the endocrine system and all the minerals and vitamins- more knowledge than a vet by the time you are finished! People don't realise how much you have to learn!
BTW, I was asked to give the other candidates a short lecture on the anatomy of the eye - it isn;t in the syllabus, might be worth brushing over!

 

[Munchkin]

I did mine eons ago and they have changed. Sorry, but after being told by a woman who had her Stage 1 and was *doing her PTT* and would no doubt become an AI that it was absolutely necessary to wash every gelding's sheath, me disagreeing and her telling me *well I know I am right, it is the the BHS book* I lost all will to live with the system.

The fact is some people read and then quote it as tho it is the Bible. They have no room for thinking outside the box and no natural take on issues.

I liken it to a Marketing company I temped at - they absolutely refused to take Marketing Graduates, as the MD stated *they come here thinking they know it all and their way is the right way because that is what their lecturer said, and they refuse to be adaptable*.

This! And I don't think an AI should be anything more than an ASSISTANT instructor - to this day I haven't met one that I'd let near my horses. (Or at least not to my knowledge, I suspect those I have are the ones who don't feel the need to tell me they passed a BHS exam because they have nothing to prove.) I'm fed up of meeting AI's who use the phrase "I'm an AI" as though they've said "I am a messenger from the God of horsemanship, sent to fix all of your equestrian difficulties. I have nothing left to learn."

I have also witnessed colleges training students towards BHS exams and teaching them the fiddle fiddle kick kick method of riding. If you can pass an exam by doing things incorrectly, that is quite terrifying and I'm not surprised there's a lack of talent in this country when the BHS is considered the backbone for recreational riding.

Of course many riders who take their BHS exams are already well established, experienced horse people but it does worry me that some think having these qualifications means they're in some way superior to those who manage on vast experience alone. I pick my trainers on recommendation and reputation whether they have letters after their name or not - they mean nothing to me.

 

[dressager]

I was thinking of getting my AI at some point just for my own enjoyment but not necessarily to earn a living. I think it's a good starting point at least and shows commitment to the profession.

Of course it's not the be all and end all, that's the same in any profession. I studied at uni for 5 years but didn't graduate and instantly assume expert status! Lifelong learning is what it's all about. Pointless blaming the BHS if you can't be bothered to put the effort into self development after the course.

I would always look for a good qualified instructor unless they'd competed to GP level or been round Badminton. There are just so many instructors around you really need to be the complete package these days, unless you can sweet talk your way into your clients purses!

 

[galaxy]

I have also witnessed colleges training students towards BHS exams and teaching them the fiddle fiddle kick kick method of riding. If you can pass an exam by doing things incorrectly, that is quite terrifying and I'm not surprised there's a lack of talent in this country when the BHS is considered the backbone for recreational riding.
.

I am yet to meet a college student come out with their AI! So I wouldn't worry about their standards too much!

Weezy, your friend who had their stage 1 and was doing their PTT will be in for a shock at the exam when she realised she needs her Stage 2 first!! I have never read in any BHS book that you HAVE to clean your horses sheath, so she was only spouting.

and for the earlier poster who said they could physically do the Stage 3 XC but wanted to teach, you can get insurance and not be qualified. If that's what you want to do, have a look into it.

 

[Onyxia]

I did mine eons ago and they have changed. Sorry, but after being told by a woman who had her Stage 1 and was *doing her PTT* and would no doubt become an AI that it was absolutely necessary to wash every gelding's sheath, me disagreeing and her telling me *well I know I am right, it is the the BHS book* I lost all will to live with the system.

The fact is some people read and then quote it as tho it is the Bible. They have no room for thinking outside the box and no natural take on issues.

I liken it to a Marketing company I temped at - they absolutely refused to take Marketing Graduates, as the MD stated *they come here thinking they know it all and their way is the right way because that is what their lecturer said, and they refuse to be adaptable*.

Will have to dig out the books,but I really don't think it says in the stage 1 or 2 that you must sheath clean,just asks about how and why you would if you choose to.

Sadly,no exam system will ever teach muppets to be normal people and the bad AI's have always been the ones who seem to think that the AI gives them expert status-every single good one has wanted to study more and gain more RL experiance.
The marriage of experiance and the exams is obviously the ideal and I agree that for people who don't jump for whatever reason it is an unfair system,but not a bad one.

 

[3BayGeldings]

Horsey people do seem to get very threatened by others they perceive as more experienced than themselves. Then the knives come out!

 

[kirstyl]

What an interesting thread! I passed my AI when I was 17, and am 20 years on still using it. I took Stage 2, Stage 3 and PTT in a year through a college but I had worked at a riding school / event yard since I was 12 so gained masses of experience there. I don't think anyone who has never taken a BHS exam can really comment constructively - it is a huge generalisation to say all BHS instructors are rubbish - you try passing the exams! In every walk of life there are people who are fantastic at their job and people who aren't so sparkling at the same job. Perhaps you can ride at Grand Prix level but it doesn't mean that you can automatically train someone else to the same level.
What I do know is that I have continued to train and learn since I passed my AI through regular lessons, lectures and demos so I would now consider myself to be more effective, experienced and knowledgable, but so I should be 20yrs on!
I now teach children with special needs and it was a requirement that i had AI. It shows that you have achieved a certain level of training and ability - and shows that you are trainable.
It really has been the most useful qualification I've got. I was able to freelance in the evenings and weeknds when my children were small and it is a qualification that people recognise. The AI has allowed me to get the job I have now, which I love!

 

[kirstyl]

Oh and I also think that the register of instructors should be improved so that you can tell exactly what level any instructor is qualified to. It is frustrating that you can't check up on an instructor who is employed full time at a riding school because they are not required to be on the register.

Couldn't agree more! A few years ago I workd for a woman who turned out to be decidely dodgy and was claiming to have her BHSII. The BHS couldn't tell me which I think is appalling. Don't they keep records of who has passed the exams? They certainly should for the amount of money the exams cost!

 

[Onyxia]

Couldn't agree more! A few years ago I workd for a woman who turned out to be decidely dodgy and was claiming to have her BHSII. The BHS couldn't tell me which I think is appalling. Don't they keep records of who has passed the exams? They certainly should for the amount of money the exams cost!

I am sure they do(just as with birth cert ect,there are times when you would need a replacement and BHS must have records to be able to issue one) but who they disclose the information would,I imagine be restricted?

 

[JenTaz]

i believe that the BHS system has some many valid points to it, i am looking into doing my stage two now as i have my NVQs from a yard i worked at last summer, however one thing i noticed while i was at an equine college which WAS BHS APPROVED was the low standard of care that the horses recieved, they stood in stables all day to be used for students to then get chucked out in the fields all weekend, yes they got fed, but there was hardly anything else in the fields, many horses colliced when they came back in on the sunday due to lack of food and gorging themselves on haylage, and this was a place where people where being trained the BHS way, eh i dont think so somehow! this is why i dont think many people come out of doing their bhs exams and setting a good example for the bhs

 

[kirstyl]

I can't think why you would you not be able to check whether someone has a professional qualification or not. Strangely enough we had to get full birth certificates for our children today to send off to get their first passports (we only had short passports for them). I was amazed that my husband needed no other information than their names and dates of birth, didn't have to show any ID!

 

[the watcher]

With how insurance and H&S is going these days, I wouldn't be surprised if it was going to end up being compulsory to have BHS stages or similar to comply with employee insurance in ten years time! Same as teaching as gone.

I'm sure you are right, and think this is the direction that the BHS is taking - aiming for total control of the grading systems for the equestrian business.

I do think the training can be rigid, and there does seem to be little scope for anybody with disabilities to qualify under the current system.

 

[Onyxia]

I'm sure you are right, and think this is the direction that the BHS is taking - aiming for total control of the grading systems for the equestrian business.

I do think the training can be rigid, and there does seem to be little scope for anybody with disabilities to qualify under the current system.

Would need to do some fairly awesome black ops on less famous ABRS

While flatwork is everything,jumping is a comple "optional extra" so it would be good for those who do not jump to be able to take a non jumping version,maybe with something else in it's place(although I have no idea what,if anything!).

Having said that,I used to work for a very well respected dressage rider who is petrified of jumping. Hung onto the mane all the way round her stage 4 and passed.
She could jump well enough,she was just terified,think the examiners must have taken her fright into consideration.