Persistant diarrhea - things to try?

SpottedCat

SpottedCat

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Quick background: horse had grade 3/4 ulcers, month of treatment with gastrogard then month of gastrogard and antibiotics. During second month developed diarrhea (poo like cow pats) - vet advised not to use probiotics etc. End of second month ulcers fixed, horse now on maintenance dose of gastrogard (half a tube a day) - vet advised this could be dropped to quarter of a tube. He has had tuff rock foal plus, some powder (sponge something or other I think) and something else which I forget from the vets, and every time we try and drop it down, poo like cow pats again. Loaner has tried aloe vera, horse is fed topspec now so is getting probiotics.

Is there anything else I can try with him which I have not done? Obviously have a call in to the vets (actually an email as am in USA!), but is there anything else I can suggest to vet? Am currently suggesting Biotal Equine Gold or anti-inflammatories - think the former might just double up what is in the topspec though!

Anything else we could try as an idea would be appreciated - horse is well and happy in himself, not loosing weight etc, eating fine, no sign of ulcers recurring.

I won't be able to reply for a few hours so thanks in advance for any ideas!
 
No advice re the diarrhoea (sorry) but I would avoid anti inflammatories if poss as they could upset his gut further especially as he's had ulcers.

Hope you get it sorted soon.
 
Cut out everything with liquid - ie carrotts, apples, sugar/speedibeat replace haylege with hay. Give an extra helping of chop/chaff in each feed and only dampen, if needed with a very small amount of water, just enough to avoid a choke.

On our yard we have an 23yo warmblood who as soon as we go onto winter turnout (one day in, one day out) starts squirting really, really badly - so much so owner had to wash legs/bum twice a day! Vets have done blood and poo tests with nothing in evidence and also given pancur 5 day and nothing changed. He was on hay not haylege too. Taking the above approach seems to have dried him up!

Whilst I'm no vet, I really struggle to understand why the vets didn't suggest this! The squirting has happend on winter change for last few years!!

Good luck and hope you get to the bottom (no joke intended lol) of this soon.
 
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No advice re the diarrhoea (sorry) but I would avoid anti inflammatories if poss as they could upset his gut further especially as he's had ulcers.

Hope you get it sorted soon.

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Ditto non steroidals - cause ulcers

How about trying adding into diet (brilliant in feed ball - get to drip feed all day )spillers or similar hifibre cubes - helped several that I know with soft faeces/diarrhoea.

Probioitics unlikely to cause diarrhoea.(check amouts in feed - I believe should be fed at about a level of 1 x10 power9 daily - might not be on enough top spec to give this amount - so you could give a bit more)

Hope he gets well soon
 
Can't think what it's called but I found the stuff you can buy over the counter at chemists for humans worked wonders on my old boy. I'll try and look up what it was. Maybe Kaolin and something?!
 
I've often been recommended natural yoghurt for squitty bums in foals so if it's gentle enough for them it might work for Boy.

Ditto the feeding as dry as possible, changing to hay etc and no molasses.
 
We had a horse that had had chronic squirts for months, and we were finally told "well, sometimes a salt block solves the problem..." and two dollars later it did!
Apparently, a lot of the upset in the tummy is caused by dehydration (which the diarrhoea exacerbates), and the salt block (and drinking more water) can really help.
I'm not sure if it will help, but it's worth at least thinking about.
 
Okay - thanks guys. Has to have haylage as hay (even soaked) makes him cough. Apart from that he has a high fibre diet, topspec balancer and topspec condition cubes so fibre intake isn't the issue (out every day too), has a himalayan salt block so don't think it is that. Has dry alfalfa/straw chaff and feed not routinely damped.

I think this is a hangover from the ulcers/antibiotics TBH - and apparently a side effect of ulcers is inflammation of the gut, meaning they can't absorb nutrients properly, which means they have the squits, hence asking vet about anti inflammatories.

Whoever said probiotics won't cause diarrhea, I know that, I was merely saying he was on them already in the topspec because they can help horses with the squits! I don't want to double up with the Biotal because what's the point in paying twice for the same thing?! Ditto natural yoghurt perhaps? Surely all the same stuff?

Have not heard of tea, will ask vet about that, thanks.
 
I think me and Moog must be twins as this is the second post I have agreed with him/her on in the space of about ten minutes!!. I don't think there would be enough probiotic in Top Spec to give a maintenance level, its rather like these stupid 'electrolyte' licks, - your horse would need about 20 of the things before he replaced electroylte loss! I would feed a good probiotic which includes a prebiotic. Lots of people feed a bran mash to colicy horses/horses with the runs but this is exactly what you don't want to do. As feed should be introduced gradually over 5 or so days suddenly giving your horse a load of bran would be counterproductive. You mention you have tried various supplements/feed but you need to give each new addition time to work, ideally 2-3 weeks to see any improvement. My horse is very squitty at the moment and due to snow he has not been turned out for many day so is eating ad lib haylage (he can't have hay) and getting worse everyday. He suffers from recurrent spasmodic gassy colic so needs to have forage constantly and its an uphill battle. He is fed pink powder - do you have that in the States? I find that is quite effective as it controls the colic and since he's been on that he doesn't have as many colics, although his are very mild anyway.
 
I too would start with salt.

It gets the kidneys working extracting more liquid from the hind gut. My vet recommended a heaped tablespoon per day made up of 2/3 table salt and 1/3 lo salt. (I think this worked out to about 50g)

It worked for a very squity pony.
 
I have never heard of giving salt when squitty but I will try this with my horse who is going through a squitty episode at the moment. I tend to give him very sloppy feeds when he has diarrohea as I know they can become dehydrated quicker.
 
I changed mine off rygrass and timothy haylage to plain meadow grass haylage and that helped. You can also get 'Pro Paste' probiotic from your vet which is a strong pro-biotic paste which acts quite quickly (much stronger than anything that will be in a feed). It may or may not cure the squits but he's sure to need a course of these anyway if he's had the squits to re-balance his hind gut.
 
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You mention you have tried various supplements/feed but you need to give each new addition time to work, ideally 2-3 weeks to see any improvement.

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I have to disagree with you on this point - there are (or is) products available which work immediately (within 20-30mins) if used on an adhoc basis for gastric problems (such as runny bums/scouring or bloated/gassy tummies) Also if fed daily you can see results fast (within days) not all products need to have the 2-3 wks/months before you see results
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Kate x
 
Ok, we'll all agree to disagree about Topspec and probiotics - they are added at the rate required for the horse in that you feed the balancer according to weight. I'm not 'chopping and changing' anything and not giving it time to work - this has been going on since November. For the record - horse is in UK (where I usually am!) and so I need stuff which is available either in the UK or USA - I can get either!

Vet is recommending either that we treat it with low dose of oral steroids and add in some rice bran such as equi jewel, can add in probiotics such as equine gold if I want to, or that we do further diagnostics by doing bloods (which will probably be normal), ultrasound scan abdomen then do biopsies of large intestine (and small if abnormal on ultrasound), do an absorption study then treat as per the first option. As horse is happy, not losing weight and performing well he is happy to do either, so since my insurance limit is rapidly approaching, we'll be treating and then doing diagnostics if he does not respond.

Thanks again for all the help though guys, some interesting new ideas on me there! I just don't think this is a normal 'management issue' causing the diarrhea if I am entirely honest. I am convinced it is due to the heavy dose of antibiotics and the horrible ulcers he has been on - poor horse has been through the mill a bit and has had to be kept in hard work so that we knew it was the drugs curing the ulcers not the rest/absence of 'stress'.
 
I am also having problems with my mare, she is really runny at the moment & has a really sore bottom! Have taken her off haylage & put her on hay & after reading this will take her off her speedy beat for a while & see if that helps.

I've also heard that Cinnamon can help?? though not tried this yet.

Going to try the tea too! maybe give her some burnt toast with it
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