Petition to ban the sale of fireworks to general public

3OldPonies said:
5) With so many excellent organised displays that pet and horse owners can plan for, there is no need for every tom, dick or harriet to have they're own potentially lethal party in their back garden.
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I don't want to trapse into town to watch an organised display, I want my own. Who is to say the person organising the organised display is any more competent with fire works than my jack Russell terrier.

*Box walking for hours after the event and whilst they were going off - standing shaking so hard that his shoes rattled on the concrete, dripping sweat and rolling eyes - all whilst under sedation.
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That's a very worrying reaction - have you actually taken any steps to desensitise your horse so that it is able to cope with loud noises?

I think it worth noting too, that this petition is to ban the sale of fireworks to the general public, not to ban organised displays.

Let's face it - the organised ones may be louder and flashier (and more fun) but they can be planned for if you know your animal has a problem.
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I think bonfire night is pretty well publicised - you can plan for the 5th of November without issues. The organised displays are louder, do cause more disruption (not to mention litter and late night drinking) and are bound to be more scary for horses.
 
I have also signed, taking animals out of equation (and my dog is not happy with them, thanks to the idiots next door letting off fireworks with no consideration for others. We lost 4 out of 9 lambs and had a barn full of horses, who were used to fireworks, panicking because they were going off directly overhead - my farmer landlord went ballistic) too many people are injured by fireworks. I've recently seen a video where a group of people allowed a dog to pick up and carry a lit firework which shoots out little light balls at intervals and carry it around, effectively making it a kind of machine gun. Do you want people like that in charge of explosives? What about the Croydon Riots when people were throwing fireworks at the police? No, unfortunately for me the idiotic few have spoiled it and, whilst I appreciate that many people who use them are sensible, I would like to see organised displays only.

http://www.radass.com/2014/07/03/dog-carries-lit-fireworks-mouth/
 
RunToEarth said:
I don't want to trapse into town to watch an organised display, I want my own. Who is to say the person organising the organised display is any more competent with fire works than my jack Russell terrier.

That's a very worrying reaction - have you actually taken any steps to desensitise your horse so that it is able to cope with loud noises?

I think bonfire night is pretty well publicised - you can plan for the 5th of November without issues. The organised displays are louder, do cause more disruption (not to mention litter and late night drinking) and are bound to be more scary for horses.
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Ok, in answer to what I felt was quite a condesending reply (it that's not what you meant it to be like, you should be more careful how you write):

Anyone 'firing' fireworks at an organised display will have to be a competent person, otherwise they wouldn't be able to purchase the fireworks in the first place.

Yes, I have worked on de-sensitisation, he's fine with the big displays and with guns during the shooting season and even bird scarers (unless they go off at his feet!) But, we have a caravan park behind the stables and the locals find annoying the horses funny so they get hold of as many fireworks as they can and let them off right behind the stables, so close that you can even heat the whoosh as they take off. Police not interested in the fact that their are juveniles with fireworks in a public place, even though it is illegal. Also lot of big houses nearby who like to have parties and save up their fireworks bought when they are on sale for other times of the year (not illegal). Needless to say, we never know when they are going to start kicking off, so cannot plan ahead.

We have three organised displays local to us, one of which is very close, they do not cause a problem, after desensitisation and with the lights on, people around, and an companion present (the one that likes watching the pretty lights) we can handle these as they advise of the dates, when they will be commencing firing and when they intend to finish. As far as I know, there are no problems with crowds, drinking or anti-social behaviour as by and large these are family events, albeit attend by 100s of people and the organisers are very good about picking up litter.
 
In Ireland the public aren't allowed to buy them (They still do) All of mine from foals to 27yr old don't give a dam when they go off and mt TB broodmare loves they she just stares at the sky while they are going off happy as larry.
 
Can we ban pigs as well! Funny ours are fine with fireworks but won't go near pigs. I think sometimes you just have to put up with things.
 
I can see what OP trying to do. Yes fireworks in the wrong hands are dangerous and IMHO I think fireworks should only be available for sale to professionals at licensed events. However this will never happen due to how much money fireworks makes and the VAT on them too. Sadly this petition is not going to change anything :(
 
3OldPonies said:
Ok, in answer to what I felt was quite a condesending reply (it that's not what you meant it to be like, you should be more careful how you write):

Anyone 'firing' fireworks at an organised display will have to be a competent person, otherwise they wouldn't be able to purchase the fireworks in the first place.

Yes, I have worked on de-sensitisation, he's fine with the big displays and with guns during the shooting season and even bird scarers (unless they go off at his feet!) But, we have a caravan park behind the stables and the locals find annoying the horses funny so they get hold of as many fireworks as they can and let them off right behind the stables, so close that you can even heat the whoosh as they take off. Police not interested in the fact that their are juveniles with fireworks in a public place, even though it is illegal. Also lot of big houses nearby who like to have parties and save up their fireworks bought when they are on sale for other times of the year (not illegal). Needless to say, we never know when they are going to start kicking off, so cannot plan ahead.

We have three organised displays local to us, one of which is very close, they do not cause a problem, after desensitisation and with the lights on, people around, and an companion present (the one that likes watching the pretty lights) we can handle these as they advise of the dates, when they will be commencing firing and when they intend to finish. As far as I know, there are no problems with crowds, drinking or anti-social behaviour as by and large these are family events, albeit attend by 100s of people and the organisers are very good about picking up litter.
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I don't think it was condescending at all - to the point, perhaps, however I don't have a lot of people whose answer to everything controversial is to ban it.

In your situation banning fireworks is not going to stop the locals from terrorising your horses - people like that will find another way to make your life difficult, I think you will have more luck banning juveniles than fireworks...
 
Broke_But_Happy said:
I have also signed, taking animals out of equation (and my dog is not happy with them, thanks to the idiots next door letting off fireworks with no consideration for others. We lost 4 out of 9 lambs and had a barn full of horses, who were used to fireworks, panicking because they were going off directly overhead - my farmer landlord went ballistic) too many people are injured by fireworks. I've recently seen a video where a group of people allowed a dog to pick up and carry a lit firework which shoots out little light balls at intervals and carry it around, effectively making it a kind of machine gun. Do you want people like that in charge of explosives? What about the Croydon Riots when people were throwing fireworks at the police? No, unfortunately for me the idiotic few have spoiled it and, whilst I appreciate that many people who use them are sensible, I would like to see organised displays only.

http://www.radass.com/2014/07/03/dog-carries-lit-fireworks-mouth/
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The favourite lit missile of rioters is a molotov cocktail.

I know, let's ban petrol !
 
The thing is, some people are just stupid, and unless you cull/ban stupid people, accidents are still going to happen.

Most accidents on the road happen because of stupid drivers, or a stupid person who has spilt something on the road and hasn't cleared it up. Most accidents at work are because someone stupid did something stupid, and either injured themselves or someone else.

Fireworks are not inherently dangerous - they are quite fun if you use them properly, so I feel it would be shame to ban them because some people misuse them. CPT is right - what next, petrol, nitrogen fertilizers, sharp objects?
 
RunToEarth said:
The thing is, some people are just stupid, and unless you cull/ban stupid people, accidents are still going to happen.
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Now there's a petition I would sign...

How about fireworks can be bought freely, but only by anyone who can set out the basic chemical equation for the reaction involved, and tell you what colour to expect from a copper compound. :)

See, I don't mind regulation, so long as it doesn't affect me, but that is never the case. Petty regulation is how we lose our freedom, slice by slice.
 
I'll be signing, organised displays mean that there is usually notice given when animals need to be kept indoors. Anyone having there own back garden event can mean distress and trauma for dozens of animals. Plus it doesn't mean that fireworks are banned, just that they are more likely to be in the hands of responsible experts.

There are always idiots that is true, but why make it easy for them? The following link http://www.occupyforanimals.org/fireworks-and-animals.html has statistics of the number of guide dogs for the blind that have to be retired due to the stress fireworks cause, not to mention the deliberate cruelty that can happen, such as the german shepherd that had a firework deliberately exploded while taped in its jaws blowing its face off. There are also the hundreds of call outs the fire brigade get when fireworks are thrown through letterboxes, or in peoples hoods and fires started with them.

Fireworks aren't a necessity, much the same as those chinese lanterns, they can do a fair bit of damage and just not worth it for the few seconds they give pleasure.
 
touchstone said:
I'll be signing, organised displays mean that there is usually notice given when animals need to be kept indoors. Anyone having there own back garden event can mean distress and trauma for dozens of animals. Plus it doesn't mean that fireworks are banned, just that they are more likely to be in the hands of responsible experts.

There are always idiots that is true, but why make it easy for them? The following link http://www.occupyforanimals.org/fireworks-and-animals.html has statistics of the number of guide dogs for the blind that have to be retired due to the stress fireworks cause, not to mention the deliberate cruelty that can happen, such as the german shepherd that had a firework deliberately exploded while taped in its jaws blowing its face off. There are also the hundreds of call outs the fire brigade get when fireworks are thrown through letterboxes, or in peoples hoods and fires started with them.

Fireworks aren't a necessity, much the same as those chinese lanterns, they can do a fair bit of damage and just not worth it for the few seconds they give pleasure.
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This ^^
I have signed too for the very same reasons.
 
touchstone said:
I'll be signing, organised displays mean that there is usually notice given when animals need to be kept indoors. Anyone having there own back garden event can mean distress and trauma for dozens of animals. Plus it doesn't mean that fireworks are banned, just that they are more likely to be in the hands of responsible experts.

There are always idiots that is true, but why make it easy for them? The following link http://www.occupyforanimals.org/fireworks-and-animals.html has statistics of the number of guide dogs for the blind that have to be retired due to the stress fireworks cause, not to mention the deliberate cruelty that can happen, such as the german shepherd that had a firework deliberately exploded while taped in its jaws blowing its face off. There are also the hundreds of call outs the fire brigade get when fireworks are thrown through letterboxes, or in peoples hoods and fires started with them.

Fireworks aren't a necessity, much the same as those chinese lanterns, they can do a fair bit of damage and just not worth it for the few seconds they give pleasure.
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Guide dogs for the blind retired because of fireworks? What do they do when cars backfire? Throw a panic attack? Not very safe as guide dogs then, probably best off retired before they hurt someone. Would most of them be Labradors? As in the GUN dogs???

Such a lot of hysteria on this thread!

Ban fireworks and idiots will find some other way to torment animals and other people, it's what idiots do.
 
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undergroundoli said:
I really don't think people who have a massive image problem and hang out in the road while sitting on half a ton of slow moving, ultimately unpredictable traffic hazard should be encouraging the current trend for banning things.

We're next.
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Very very good point .
 
Red-1 said:
The things that I DO think should be banned are Chinese Lanterns. Not for horses in particular, but there is enough evidence that they cause fires, such as the tyre dump fore last year and some stables, that it can be proven that setting a fire going and floating it up to who knows where is negligent as to the safety of other people. That is something that comes inside your gates.
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Totally agree with this.
 
In NI you need a licence for fireworks. Sparklers and indoor fireworks don't need one though :)

Whilst you do get those who have them 'unlicenced' I have found generally it has cut down the amount of fireworks that people set off at whatever time of year, and generally fireworks are only really seen in displays.

It's not a ban, as such, and I find it works pretty well. The general public can still get them from shops as long as they're licensed to buy them. Of course people will get them unlicensed but that's the same with a lot of things. They're just harder to get.

Petrol bombs seem to be preferred by the rioters in Belfast, rather than fireworks.
 
cptrayes said:
Guide dogs for the blind retired because of fireworks? What do they do when cars backfire? Throw a panic attack? Not very safe as guide dogs then, probably best off retired before they hurt someone. Would most of them be Labradors? As in the GUN dogs???

Such a lot of hysteria on this thread.

Ban fireworks and idiots will find some other way to torment animals and other people, it's what idiots do.
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Not hysteria at all, we are talking about the irresponsible use of fireworks:- "Fireworks also lead to more and more problems even by guide dogs for the blind. Every year, guide dogs and other working dogs are forced to retire after being traumatised by the irresponsible use of fireworks. Others have to be sedated, and some even retrained, leaving their owners without mobility for weeks at a time. Every year, the Guide Dogs for the Blind Association (England) have to retire four animals because of stress caused by fireworks. Another 150 dogs need further training to deal with problems related to loud bangs. It costs up to £30,000 to train a guide dog and each animal is selected to suit the individual lifestyle of the owner." I daresay the majority are labs, but my two labs although perfectly fine with guns, aren't keen on incessant fireworks, and of course there is such a thing as a gunshy lab.


A car backfiring is a one off which most dogs cope with, it is when in cities and large towns there are fireworks going off for weeks on end and it is like living in a war zone that it becomes a problem, with not only animals, but some elderly and children being frightened by them too. If it was only one or two nights a year, with considerate, responsible use then there wouldn't be an issue.
 
bonny said:
Two problems, 1, on line petitions are a waste of time and 2, why should thousands of people be denied buying and enjoying fireworks because your dog/cat is scared ? It's a few days of the year, you know it's coming up so deal with it !
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A friend of mine had a foal break both it's front legs in the field running blind scared because of fireworks that they didn't know were being set off at a neighbour's party. Fireworks these days are like bloody bombs going off so I FULLY SUPPORT a ban. Can't people enjoy themselves without affecting everyone else for Christ's sake!
 
I find it bizzare that the general public can buy explosives, with no lisence, with no record of who has bought them, or any sort of regulation about the storage of them!
 
I've signed, my dog hates them and is so stressed out that one year she tried to throw herself through our patio doors, I've tried to desensitise and everything else and nothing works. The problem where I live is the constant fireworks that go off from October through to January and even sometimes in summer as well, I'm not against enjoying them at displays and even if it was only for bonfire night and new years eve we could cope but it's relentless and ongoing for weeks on end. Maybe I just need to move to somewhere quieter like the gobi desert :)
 
Horse owners/ riders are a very small percentage of the population.

Fireworks (organised or not) are enjoyed by a large chunk of the population.

We need to get over ourselves and desensitise our animals to fireworks, as another noisy, but normal part of life.

People using them like idiots, or being selfish re. giving notice to their neighbours, are a complete pain, but you won't successfully deal with them, by legislating against the lawful.
 
I enjoy proper organised displays but i hate the private ones which are let off anytime anywhere. I think they are anti social , I can enjoy myself without affecting other people and animals.
i have signed for what its worth and am very grateful that the area we now live n suffers very little. I also enjoy going to the local displays on bonfire night that are advertised for weeks on end and giving fair warning to animal owners .
So sad for the poor mare that has died this week .
 
cptrayes said:
Guide dogs for the blind retired because of fireworks? What do they do when cars backfire? Throw a panic attack? Not very safe as guide dogs then, probably best off retired before they hurt someone. Would most of them be Labradors? As in the GUN dogs???

Such a lot of hysteria on this thread!

Ban fireworks and idiots will find some other way to torment animals and other people, it's what idiots do.
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The only hysteria im seeing are the comments of those in favour trying to ridicule those who arent. Fireworks outwith public displays are dangerous because of the people who have access to them, anything that stops thugs from using them as weapons to hurt, maim and kill people and animals is a good thing in my book
 
pennyturner said:
See, I don't mind regulation, so long as it doesn't affect me, but that is never the case. Petty regulation is how we lose our freedom, slice by slice.
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cptrayes said:
Ban fireworks and idiots will find some other way to torment animals and other people, it's what idiots do.
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PT & CPT are absolutely spot on.

touchstone said:
A car backfiring is a one off which most dogs cope with, it is when in cities and large towns there are fireworks going off for weeks on end and it is like living in a war zone that it becomes a problem, with not only animals, but some elderly and children being frightened by them too.
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I have lived in both war zones and cities and I can assure you fireworks do not cause the latter to resemble the former. Parents need to teach their children not to be scared of things rather than banning them. Otherwise we just end up with more idiots.
 
I genuinely cannot believe that people are allowed to buy explosives without any licence. They should be banned to the public without a doubt imo. There are plenty of big public displays that are well organised with health and safety measures put in place (im no health and safety freak by a long shot! but let's face it, a firework party usually involves a lot of drinking, and since when did drinking with explosives end well ! people deliberately buy them to let off near old peoples homes, to torment animals and cause a disturbance. Yes there are lots of people who use them sensibly but they still p*ss off the nearest person who is not involved in that party/ house display. People buy them and let them off with a scary amount of ignorance and stupidity, I would have no idea if a neighbour who was oblivious to the dangers let off fireworks near my horses right now
 
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