Pics of Golden's foal ... and a question.

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Tia

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So I didn't say what colour the foal was last night as I wanted to wait till morning to confirm....however I believe she is not palomino but genetically-speaking something else.....what? Cremello? Champagne? And what does this mean for breeding purposes?

The foal has pink skin, pink vulva, pink around her eyes and her muzzle. She has silvery-green eyes.

Anyway here are some photos taken a moment ago:


Is she going to be a showjumper?

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Megan making friends:

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Clover making friends:

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Clover guarding her new charge:

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ooh i dont know- i think she may be a palomino- looking at her mums coat she looks v similar- but the pink round eyes ect would suggest cremello..
gorgeous little foal.
 
Aww and aww!


No idea on colour but she is one gorgeous foal!
I see what you mean about the pink bits.

Clover is so adorable! She seems to be growing so fast!
 
Oh blimey Tia...don't start this again.lol...
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We've only just worked out what colour the last one is
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She's gorgeous by the way
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Oh prittstick I have been looking at these information sites all morning .... and I am still no further forward LOL!!
 
Definitely a showjumper!
As to colour, what do you know about Dad?
I'd say she's too dark to go cremello - because that's a "double dilution" so the colour should never be there in the first place. She looks like a "single dilution" to me - so probably a palo of one shade or another. I'd go for very similar to mum, but there's a lot of shades out there to pick from...
I reckon you'll know for definite in about 4 years' time...
 
The dad is my lovely tri-coloured bay roan tobiano; he comes from a line of black horses, so yes you're right she can't have the double gene.

Mother is palomino and comes from a very long line of cremello's and palomino tobianos.

I have never cared for palominos so I have obviously never been interested in the genes before. The thing is, I have to register this foal AND the purchaser came up this morning to pay for her (I sold this foal in-utero) ......but I'm not sure whether to sell her or keep her now!
 
Oh cool! She could be a very rare palomino with pink skin and silver eyes LOL!! Aaargh - I'm hoping that Chambon is around; she'll know for sure.
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See that is what I wondered.....but I don't know enough about champagne as a colour, or what it implies.
 
Oooh how bizarre is that. But he had black skin presumably. This one is pink, pink, pink....everywhere. Hey she is perfect for you PF!
 
We bred a chestnut filly with pink skin once - actually, she was more pink than any other colour for several months! Poor thing was known as "Pinky" for ages. as a mature horse though you couldn't tell, bit of a shame really!
 
Oh love her.
She is very pink isn't she? This is Isabella on the day she was born, her eyes were bluey coloured and the skin around her eyes was pink toned but now all her skin is black and she is definitely a palomino, although I live in fear that Lola's bayness will fight it's way through and I will wake up to a mud coloured foal.

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How are Cloud and Legacy taking the new arrival?
 
I'm pretty positive that the British Palomino Society will not accept palominos with pink skin. I really don't know what she is though, as I've just noticed her muzzle is dark
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Shes stunning though whatever she is
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Was Isabella's skin pink all over? This one has pink skin even under her back fur. Has the skin around her eyes gone black now? And have her eyes gone brown? Sorry about all the questions, I'm just a bit more interested now LOL!!
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All of Golden's herd are back in with her now. I have taken some photos - they are all getting on perfectly as I knew they would. Ezzy knows fine well that this is his daughter and Golden has been pushing the foal to him - most amazing to watch them interacting. Legacy has had a moment of jealousy, but Golden is being very kind with her and allowing her to be involved with the foal. Will post a couple more photos of the little family herd all together.
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Thank you everyone for your help and kind comments.
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Hi Tia,

Just love all the photos and it is so lovely to see the herd together, something I had been wondering about when Zeus becomes a daddy.

re: skin colour, no, Isabella had black skin (I think, it wasn't that long ago, how shocking that I don't remember) if she didn't at the time, like around her eyes, she most certainly does now. I can't quite see on Breeze (great name) but her mane and tail don't look as white as Isabella's did even new born (what a mouthful, why did I choose such a long name?)

This photo is better , you can see the skin around her eyes more clearly, taken at a few hours old.
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A very long article about creams, you have , no doubt, already read it, but I thought it might interest someone.
Champagne – In some rare horses a dilution exists that dilutes black pigment to brown and red pigment to yellow. There is some argument whether these horses are the results of a dilution of normal pigment or if for example black pigment has been altered to brown pigment. In addition to hair color the skin color is changed to a pinkish brown and the eye color is lightened to amber. The mane and tail are sometimes darker, sometimes lighter than the body color. It is a very rare color and there are a number of shades depending upon the background the shade is based on. Champagne is the color that results from this gene on a black background. It is an overall light brown horse with pinkish-brown skin and amber eyes. Amber champagne is what we see when the background is bay, a yellowish brown body color and darker chocolate brown points. Gold champagne is sometimes also called ‘pink-skinned palomino’ and occurs when the background is chestnut but it is not related to palomino at all except in resemblance as it is a deep rich gold color but it does not have the Cremello dilution gene. Gold champagnes are often registered as Palominos. Ivory champagne is the result of chestnut plus champagne combined with one Cremello gene. It is a pale cream color that very closely resembles the color that results when chestnut is diluted with two Cremello genes (called cream, Cremello or blue-eyed cream). However unlike true creams ivory champagne horses have green or greenish eyes instead of the pale blue eyes of creams.

Silver dapple – This color resembles dark palomino but where dark palominos generally have lighter bellies than backs, a silver dapple is likely to have a fairly uniform ventral/dorsal color. The color occurs when hairs of a black background are lightened to tan or flaxen. Black hairs can still be distinguished intermixed with the tan ones. Dapples are common but not always present. The mane, tail, and legs are often lightened more than the body, sometimes to flaxen or even nearly white. Some horses that are silver dapples are erroneously called ‘liver chestnut’ however they do not reproduce as though they were chestnuts. Silver dapples are also sometimes called blue silvers or chocolate silvers. Silver dapples and silver dapple bays have amber or light brown eyes. There is an eye disease that is closely linked to the silver dapple color gene called Anterior Segment Dysgenesis which results in malformation of some parts of the eye, however even in severely affected horses most of the vision remains intact and the horse is not disabled. Not all silver dapples and silver dapple bays have ASD.

Silver dapple bay – This color can resemble chestnut however there are usually some black hairs remaining in the mane and tail and sometimes substantial black can be seen on the legs. The color results when a bay background has the silver dapple gene lighten most of the black hairs to light tan, flaxen, or almost white. This color is the source for much confusion and some registration disqualifications as it is often registered as ‘chestnut’. When a chestnut is bred to a chestnut the only color that can be produced is chestnut. However if one of the ‘chestnuts’ is actually a silver dapple then breeding with a chestnut can sometimes result in a bay foal. Some registries don’t recognize the silver dapple color and yet the gene that causes it does exist within their gene pool. For example a number of Arabian foals have over many years been disqualified for registration because of the chestnut rule despite the fact that the silver dapple gene does exist in the breed. This color is sometimes called red silver.

Cremello dilutions – Buckskin, Palomino, and Cream.

Buckskin – A horse with a yellow body and black points (mane, tail, legs, ear tips, muzzle). Some very light golden bays are mistaken for dark buckskin, and vice versa, but careful examination of the pedigree should make it possible to determine the correct color. For example purebred Arabians are never buckskin, the Cremello gene does not exist in that breed, however there are light golden bays. Bay is the background color on which one Cremello gene acts to lighten the red in that coat to yellow. Buckskins range from light to dark, some are dark enough to almost appear to be seal brown but there will be more light hairs around the barrel than one would expect with a seal brown. Usually a buckskin will have at least one parent that is a cream, a buckskin, or a palomino, rarely the parent carrying the Cremello gene will be black but that black will trace directly to cream, buckskin, or palomino rather than have any intermediate bay or chestnut ancestors inbetween.

Palomino – This is the color sometimes referred to as the golden horse of the west. This color is the result of a chestnut background plus one Cremello gene which acts to reduce the red color of the chestnut coat to the yellow of the Palomino. Palominos can be dark or light though the ideal is supposed to be a perfect 24-karat gold color. Sometimes light chestnuts (also called blond sorrels) can appear to be palominos. Again a careful examination of a pedigree can usually distinguish the two colors. For example purebred Arabians are never true Palominos, the Cremello gene does not exist in the breed, however there are light chestnuts that sometimes are mistaken for palominos. (See buckskin.) Palominos can range from light to dark. A common color that is mistaken for dark palomino is silver dapple. The two colors can usually be distinguished by looking at the hairs themselves, palomino is a red hair that has been lightened to yellow, silver dapple is a black hair that has been lightened to tan. The very lightest palominos are sometimes termed ‘isabellas’ and can resemble creams. Look at the eyes to distinguish the color, creams will have blue eyes, palominos will have brown to light hazel eyes, as will isabellas.

Cream – Also called Cremello, Perlino, Smokey Cream, and Blue-eyed Cream (BEC). Cremello, Perlino, and Smokey Cream are names used by some when it is thought that the horse's background color is known to be chestnut, bay, and black respectively. However it is impossible to tell the underlying background color of the horse as there is no significant difference in the appearance of the horse because the two Cremello genes that these horses possess dilute all pigment equally. Therefore for registry purposes one name is used -- Cream. Creams have creamy to nearly white hair, a light pinkish-grey skin color sometimes called ‘pumpkin’, and pale blue eyes. The color is caused by the horse having two Cremello genes these dilute both red and black pigment to a light cream color. This is a form of partial albinism (complete albinism where the animal lacks any pigment in skin, hair, and eyes does not exist in horses). It can be confused with White and Grey. To distinguish it from White look at the color of the eyes, and skin, whites have pink skin, not pumpkin, and brown, or hazel eyes not blue. Greys have dark grey skin, most usually retain some pigmented hairs along with grey hairs on the legs, or in the mane or tail, and greys have brown eyes. In the Connemara breed it is possible that a grey horse could also be a cream, look to the eye color to distinguish the cream. In paints and pintos it is possible for a horse to have blue eyes and a white or mostly white color and yet not be a cream, this would be incredibly rare but could be distinguished by looking at the pedigree and progeny. A final color that could be mistaken for cream is ivory champagne. The difference would be in the eye color; the ivory champagne would have hazel, amber, or green eyes, not blue. Ivory champagne is the result of an interaction between a single Cremello gene and the champagne gene.
 
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