Planning a Yard

D

Destario

Well-Known Member
Joined
25 August 2012
Messages
192
Visit site
Hi,

I am currently planning the design of a yard to be built. It would also me to bring on foals, youngstock and improve 5-7 year olds. However, as my partner and I were talking we thought it would be best to make the yard bigger, and open it for DIY liveries. Which is something I've always fancied doing.

Anyway I had decided on an enclosed design sort of two closed brackets (these: [ ] ) with a tack and feed room in the center. The four corner boxes would be 16 x 12, the other boxes would be 12 x 12. We'd be building in brick, with blue brick flooring. There would also be adequate grazing for a fairly large number of horses, but there is a possibility to acquire more so space isn't really an issue...

But what I am unsure of is how many boxes to build...I'm not really sure how much demand there would be for this type of yard (rather an "old school" design) and how many boxes we should be looking at to make it a worthwhile venture?

Also any views on design are welcome as we are building from scratch :eek: and any other ideas are also welcome :)

Thanks,
Destario
 
It will depend on where in the country you are and what you might be planning on charging. What will "sell" in surrey will differ from what will sell in a remote part of the highlands. It is also worth looking at other yards around you. Do you have direct and more established competition? if not - why not? There is a trend for cheaper livery - will you price yourself out of the market?

Be really honest with yourself about this. Money is tight all over. You need to be sure you have a market to tap into - and enough of a finacial cushion that you can hand on for the months - or years - it takes to build a good reputation.
 
Sounds lovely but I prob wouldn't waste money on blue brick flooring in the stables - just go for concrete and rubber matting. Save the blues for walk ways.
I cant comment on foals etc but can as a livery. Unless you are going to include hay etc in your price then a decent alloted area for people to keep their own hay & bedding would be a good thing. Undercover tie up area, to shelter from rubbish weather and sun. Not all liveries like to tie up in stables. A yard I visited recently (very posh yard) had like a row of big school type lockers and each livery was allocated one. Good for locking your handbag away when you go out on a hack.

I think you def need a beautiful water fountain in the middle of your 2 brackets - would look stunning! (OTT I know but you did ask!!!)
 
We're on the Hampshire/Berkshire border, so there are a lot of horsey people and places around, I haven't really started thinking about pricing, mainly because I want to get sizing sorted first then look around to get an angle on pricing.

Lots of the yard around us are turning people away (at the moment we have a couple of stables back from when the house was built, but I need more, and wanted to plan it from scratch, lots of yards near me won't have foals or youngstock)

Money is fine, and we have a few bonuses on our side, like a pro architect/designer who can draw up for us (I know what I'm doing too :wink: ) a close friend who is a course builder/fencer, eater of many Sunday lunches, to name a few.

I know getting a good rep will take time, but as the style is brick enclosed, I'd like to get a decent number of stables first, then if I can't find people to fill them all, they can be storage, I'd rather have a few too many than not enough (especially as I plan on bringing on and hopefully selling horses).

So money is fine, just working out a good number of boxes to design... :)

I was thinking concrete, but having been at a very old yard which had blue brick floors for a week (was helping a friend choose a horse!) I was won over. Blue brick is excellent at regulating heat, and as the walls etc would be brick, I thought I'd continue with blue brick flooring!

From my time on many yards (half/grass/full/DIY, I think I'd probably go for not including hay - people have different requirements and I'd rather not restrict. I'd definitely have a barn though, for hay and bedding (restricted to one type as I'm keeping it at home! Hemcore - brilliant stuff especially for my current couple, and it breaks down quickly etc)

Yes we were thinking locker style things, either outside each stable or in the middle between the tack and feed room...I was thinking a large overhang over the stables? Or would you want more cover as an owner? I tend to be fine in rain but I know some horses are badly behaved in stables *cough Rizt cough* and angels outside...

Also my partner had an idea for how he could help - automated waterers but he'd programme them so that you would know how much was being drunk and putting it on a monitor in the tack/locker room for people to check...what do you think?
 
Last edited:
For youngstock livery, IMO, covered yards could be a better option than standard boxes.

Do you really want to mix youngstock with horses that are going to who knows where for days out? Liveries & breeding stock need to be kept separate for disease prevention..
 
I'm not planning on having breeding stock! Too much work, but I enjoy bringing younger horses (3/4/5 yr olds) on, and have always wanted to try bringing one or two foals up, it may go horribly and I'll just stick to my 3/4/5 yr olds, but I'd like to try, but many yards near me won't allow anything under about 4 unless backed and with good handling, which ruins my plans a little!

So other people with younger horses, or pre-backed horses would be more than welcome with me, as well as old hands and "normal" riding horses :)
 
In this day and age you have to be business like, and although you may fancy taking in DIY would find this makes it more difficult to run things in the way you want, for example the local RS has DIY and every Monday they spend half a day sweeping and tidying, admittedly the liveries are mostly kids. "Adults only" can be attractive but there are some real charmers [NOT] out there, kids are easier to deal with in many respects. DIY is not very profitable. You have to pay busness rates, not sure about rates on your own stables.
There is a possibility of non payers too, not all people are honest and you may have to deal with problems you would not have with you own lot.
I would always have full liveries if possible so all the horses get looked after properly and consistently, and I know what I am doing every day. Locally people pay £90 per week for full livery same summer and winter, though they are mostly competition horses with facilities and instructor on site. Local DIY in poor stabling is over £200 per month and hay or haylage ad lib is about £12 per week. I reckon they make 25% on haylage.
With plenty of turnout you don't even need to worry about exercising the horses, in winter turn them out, muck out and set up for night time, in summer there is even less work, just walk round and check them once a day.
Personally I would love brick stabling, not sure about brick flooring, I would go for semi deep litter wood pellets with EVA mats on the sleeping area. Good ventilation is essential.
Make sure all water pipes are lagged or have heated coils to prevent freezing if you have automatic driners, I think buckets are just as quick as long as there are handy taps, and the buckets get rinsed out daily.
i would not want anything in the middle of the yard as I like a clear view from all stables to the others.
A good mounting block is essential.
 
In my experience people are not interested in stable construction, they want to know the price and the facilites. An overhang on stabling is ideal, but you can hit your head on it if mounted. Make sure the drainage is man enough to cope with shavings and can be accessed for rodding, flooding is an absolute pain in some places where they have used domestic type drainage.
If you let people have their own hay and bedding and so on it will get stolen [otherwise known as borrowing] for this reason and space you are best to provide ad lib haylage and hay. Also you have assured that all horses will get plenty of food.
Some people will use almost no bedding so poor things are not getting molly coddled, if DIY you are best to put a bale out side their stable every Sat am and let them make up a bed, they can buy extra in from a feed store if they need to. When they arrive the stable should be cleaned out, and a new bed of four shavings to get them started.
I would definately not have lockers and clutter outside the stables, let them use their cars for valuables, the tack room usually works OK if open access and communal. To build cages with padlocks is another option, but untidy and takes time and materials. I would have a smart tack room to set a standard for tidyness and smartness, security is a worry, so make sure it is not easy access for theives.
I would not encourage people to tie up outside stables as they leave it in a mess. Make sure any tie rings are properly fixed, and insist on safety ties, not baling twine which will not break.
I would have a grass area in the centre so less sweeping ,and the walkways should also be easy sweep, the safest is rubber blocks , but I assume they are expensive.
 
Last edited:
I wouldn't really be able to go full livery, I could maybe manage part, but I wouldn't just leave everyone be! If I thought a horse wasn't being looked after well I'd do something about it...I'm rather a perfectionist, so the stabling would end up being amazing (hopefully) I really dislike poor stabling...each side of the section would look like a [ with stabling all the way round so you'd be able to see the other horses in your section...a little island between the two [ ] would be home to tack/feed/locker rooms...

Outside the stables - I worked at a yard with green chests for brushes and whatnot outside each stable, but I was planning on a locker room between the tack and feed room with areas for each owner...it would most likely be blue bricked on the middle, not a fan of grass near stables. But one thing I refuse to have are shavings. Far too much mess, too dusty, takes too long to decompose, definitely not.

That seems really unfortunate! The last DIY I was on was really good, neat and tidy, even on the chalk pen areas (where I was) which are really hard to keep clean! I don't think I'd be happy with crazy mess, but I'm sure we could come to an agreement! I would be using the facilities too, quite a lot, so I'd always be around, unlike some YOs...

I'm pretty sure I can manage with most of the adminy stuff like bedding hay etc, we've never had an issue on any of the yards I've been on with people "borrowing" hay and stuff...I am more worried about how many stables I should have...at the moment I'm working with 16 - 32, but I'm not sure how many I'd need in order to get a decent business model going...
 
Last edited:
If it were me, I'd be planning on a smaller 'back' yard in addition (if money no hindrance).

Your [ ] could then look like this [ ]L if you see what I mean?
Put up 4 boxes in a line, with a corner unit made up of enclosed feed/rug room & then an open on 1 side barn for bedding/hay storage on the shorter side.

I'd trial 3 liveries there to start with & have them on part livery - you feed & turnout every morning (or do morning check if out)
They muck out & bring in etc. You can then provide additional costs for doing the extras for when needed on odd occasions (but try not to offer more than the feed/turnout or you will find this really eats into your time with your own).

One big thing to consider is to make sure you have PLENTY of parking - allow each livery 2 spaces - they bring friends, family or need to store trailers/boxes & there is nothing worse than people fighting for spaces or being blocked in.

Access to yards for lorry (if the worst happens & you need collection/horsepital).

Fields/school access - try to make mud free walkways if money no object, tho must be accessed by tractor/lorry too.

Drainage

Muck heap siting

Water & electrics - plan taps & power points well ahead of building. 1st fix for both is a big consideration for allowing for lighting, alarms to tack rooms & where you will have hot water points - and how you are powering hot water (gas boiler, or elec tank?)

Think of weather conditions - where does the worst wind come from, where is hottest sun buring down etc - shade & shelter are useful but also you do need to get a bit of sun on the yard in the winter if you can

Good luck - and am v envious of your plans :D
 
Last edited:
I'm not sure how popular they are but walkways and field gates I was thinking of getting matting to put down there...the matting with holes in that is supposed to stop it getting muddy, you have to lift it for a bit every year and replace but that's fine...Also it would be electric fencing (upright posts) with sheep wire at the bottom (I have learned from a houdini with sweet itch that this is the only way forward!)

Thanks for reminding about lorry access! Definitely important, but I don't use lorries, just a box which lives at the house, so I tend to forget about them! I was thinking of building/modifying a small barn into hay/bedding/rug storage...I am leaning more towards DIY with part livery option now, but it all depends on time really...

What do you think stable wise? 16? 32? more? somewhere in between? I'd hope to always keep one free for clipping and baths etc
 
Sounds lovely. Are you sure about the extra hassle and work for having DIY liveries? There is not a lot of money in it. I am in a lovely yard on the Hants Berks border, unlimited turnout. New boxes with high ceilings and rubber mats. (I wouldn't be without mats in my stable now), A lovely outdoor school, show jumps in the field in summer. Owner lives on site and has very high standards. We buy hay and bedding and food from the yard. I pay £110 a month for DIY, pay for hay and bedding as used (if I was keeping her in at night hay would be £30 a month i.e. £1 a day) I can also keep my box there included in the price.

For that the YO maintains all the fencing and the grazing, removes the much heap, removes the muck from the fields (we put the much in the buckets she collects and takes to the heap), pulls up all the ragwort, grits the yard in winter, keeps areas of communual storage tidy, sweeps the yard daily, ( a large area) maintains security etc etc. I know you will need to do some of this but the liveries will create more work. I don't think there is a lot of money to be made but a lot of hassle. It may be that you will gain in that you will have people to ride with etc.

There is probably more to be made by offering more services - I can pay for extras where I am as and when I need them. ie putting in or out, schooling etc.

Whatever you decide good luck. Sounds like a very exciting time
 
Bear in mind that you will be charge business rates on all the facilities (other than boxes solely occupied by your own horses) and this includes empty ones, and that the rateable value is different for a stable of 12x12 than for the same amount of space in a barn.

So...I would build the storage space in designated storage buildings where poss and also if you build stables, fill them all! Otherwise the biz plan will fall over.

Would strongly recommend using the cast iron drain channel covers (we used Hauraton) which they use for petrol stations / airports etc not the crappy thin tin fetlock slicers that ping up if a horse treads on em funny, in any areas where horses or vehicles will be moving regularly. They also look MUCH much smarter and I find its the details like this that make a yard look smart (they are easier to sweep as well).
 
Thanks, I'll take a look at those covers...I think we have settled on about 20 stables...four of which would be 16x12 (the corners of the [ ] and so hopefully I could have 1/2 to 3/4 full with part liveries or DIY, and a barn for hay/bedding/rugs...

I would be fine with people using matting in their stables, I just don't fancy paying for the matting for all 20 stables! Expensive stuff! I'd probably get some matting in mine though, maybe do the others if I have the excess money...

There is an awful lot to look at with this, but I think we have settled on a good design: the long bit of the [ would have 6 12x12 stables, and the short bits would have a 16x12 and a 12x12 in the center of the rectangular central yard would be a tack room, locker/storage room and a feed room and outside the [ ] would be a barn for hay/bedding/rug storage.

Nitty gritty details now though! You have all been so helpful thus far, any more enlightened comments welcome, I'm sure I'll overlook things at this early stage!
 
The only query I would have about having buildings in the middle is that it would make it hard to do those 'glance round and make sure everything is as it should be' checks. Also the horses wont be able to see their pals across the yard?

Heres the link for the drainage gully thing, you can get lots of different tops but we had cast iron (they look like the top middle pic in the CIVILs tab). They prise open so you can clean the channels but cannot ping up.
http://www.hauraton.co.uk/

Will there be a wash down bay, and where will things like clipping be best done ie will there be a designated place or will electric be available to all the boxes.

PS am liking the design tho and the 16x12s are excellent, my 17 hander is a whole lot less messy since he moved into his Poo Palace (we built a mini barn with external and internal windows and made one a 16x12).
 
The buildings in the middle will be relatively small, and the [ shape should allow horses to see each other in their half, as well as those on the other side on the other half...Thanks for the link I'll be sure to have a look! My OH is an electronics engineering genius so he has many great plans for everything electronic (mapping the amount of water each horse drinks for eg) so either all the stalls will have an outlet, or just the bigger corner stalls, I was planning on putting a wash section either in the middle next to tack/feed rooms or turn one of the gaps in the [ ] into a wash station with a back wall/gate depending on what I decided would work best, I'm still struggling to decide tbh!
 
If its at all possible, I would get the stables 12x15, then brick off the back 3' and leave each stable with its little individual tack/feedroom area that can be locked off. We wanted this at our yard but planning knocked us back. I once saw it at a beautiful DIY yard, and it stopped so many arguements and things lying around on the yard.. We got 14x12 boxes in the end and put a metal tack locker in the corner of each stable for the liveries.

I'm not sure of the tackroom in the middle of the yard idea - it would spoil the look of a nice yard. Personally I would have it in one of the corner boxes perhaps.

We bought rubber for all our stables in one go, and got a good discount online for nine stables.
 
That sounds like a great idea, but I'm not sure how effective it would be given the shape of the yard I'm planning, people would have a long way round to walk if they were in the middle of a [ ! and I'm not really a fan on having an internal door...I put the tack room in the middle purely for accessibility reasons with a door on each side...Hopefully it will all be aesthetically pleasing, being brick and me being a perfectionist! It might work instead of a joint feed room though so I'll have a look into that, then there would just be the tack room in the middle as the locker room wouldn't be needed if there was a lockable feed/locker room behind each stable...still accesiblity is the only problem I can think of with that!
 
Yes - the ones I saw had the doors in the back of the stables, about 2' above the ground, so you could still have banks. Each mini tackroom had room for feedbits, a rug rail and a saddle rack.

As well as the tack lockers, we had a fold flat rug rail in each stable too. The overhang of each stable is hollow too, so they could stack unused rugs up there out of sight - extra personal storage.. Things like that cut down on the amount of "shared storage" needed, and stealing issues!

I worked at a great yard in Italy many years ago that had flaps in the back wall of the stables, and you threw the muck out there straight onto a muck heap. That was pretty cool too! (Wouldn't work on your yard though!)
 
I would have the boxes a bit bigger too... 14x16 is a nice size.
One box with cross ties and hot wash
Box with a Solarium and cross ties is nice touch too.
Large over hang is good to keep area outside boxes dry,prevent driving rain going in door etc.
A rear window can be really nice too for more ventilation and natural light.
Muck wagon is nicer than a heap or an under cover heap that'd kept tidy and regularly removed.
Don't forget to plan for future developments...eg space for horse walker, or even an indoor if moneys no object....
 
Definitely agree with rear windows in stables with your design; I also love those designs which incorporate small dry lot turnout 'paddocks' accessed by a door at the back of each stable - brilliant for horses which can't be turned out but need to be a bit more mobile and, set up to be so, sociable for them. Don't see that much over here though.
 
I'd definitely have windows! Front as well as back if I can...that sounds like a great idea, especially if your horse is on box rest but wants a little grass and fresh air, not sure how easy it would be to incorporate, but maybe for a few of the stables...hmmm
 
I would suggest more than one tack room, perhaps one every 4 or 6 stables or something like that, anything that reduces the risk of theft (both internal and external) or arguments. Do you really want to keep your tack with your liveries? I would have a separate tack room if I were you.
Do you want to share a yard with liveries or do you think a slightly separate or an adjoining yard would be preferable?
Lots of water taps and electric points.
I would buy in hay/haylage and bedding and charge each livery a weekly fee for each otherwise storage for everyone becomes an issue.
If you are a control freak can you handle being on a yard with dirty stables til people finish work and muck out and do their chores on an evening - personally I think having yard rules such as "all stables to be mucked out by a certain time" is unreasonable.
I think a wash box is pretty essential.
Will you be providing muck out tools and wheelbarrows? If not liveries will also need space to store their own.
Ooooh and a rug room would be a bonus, preferably heated otherwise wet rugs in winter become wet cold rugs by the next morning!
Hope this has given you a couple more ideas to mull over😄
What about a manège? Will this be big enough for a few liveries to ride in together?
 
Just thought of a couple more. It sounds like you have or have access to a fair amount of land, could you set up a hacking route around it (your own private farm ride)?
I like the idea of windows or opening top doors at the back of stables.
A box with cross ties etc for clipping/farrier etc would also be a good idea.
 
If you do the pen idea you can have one pen to two boxes...do the pen is a fairly decent size.
Also great for lamanitics.
If moneys no object surface it with sand so its safe to trot on but won't get muddy.
Lots of under cover storage for hay, haylage and bedding as well as yard tools- I hate seeing them and other clutter outside boxes.
For livery.storage a full height 3ft wide locker for tack. Having it heated is great too.
If you are having DIY then setting out breeze block type compartments with lockable gates on is good for their hay feed etc.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top