Playing or bullying? *videos*

Hopefully it will all settle down -- every year when I put out the new yearling with the herd (30 horse herd), we have a few weeks to this type of behaviour. It's actually the reason I only let them join the ground once the ground is dry/safe! The yearlings seem to set off the 2 and 3 yos ... and then the 4 and 5 yos join in and soon everyone is rearing and dragging each other around by the mane/tail or sweet itch rug (!!); at some point the older horses step in and tell everyone off for having too much fun and it all settles again. Horses will be horses and MOSTLY they work it out without injury.
 
I think as everyone else has said they are just playing as when your horse is left alone in the 2nd video he goes over to the youngster.The cob is just beign a baby and playing, He hates that muzzle and must be quite hungry as grass is short so not much gets through it im sure. He obviously wants to get it off. Unfortunately the only way he will learn to behave is to get put in his place by a dominant horse and it doesnt sound as though the ones in this field are from what you said.
But if you are worried either ask to be moved or have the cob put with another horse where he will be put in his place.
 
I've got to say, I can't agree that he needs to be "put in his place" by a "dominant horse".
Anyway, it will be interesting to see how he is in a few weeks, after his new regime has had a chance to take effect.
 
Tinypony said:
I've got to say, I can't agree that he needs to be "put in his place" by a "dominant horse".
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Why not though? He looks to me like a poor s0d who's not been socialised correctly (and apols but the fact he is coloured and cobby makes me slightly more confident in that big assumption).
 
Well, because the idea of putting him in his place and using a "dominant" horse seems to imply that somehow this youngster is in the wrong I suppose. It sounds as if he needs a good duffing up to sort him out.
There is a lot of argument about dominance theories in horses, but the horses that seem to do really well with youngsters are the less "dominant" ones. The horses that Mark Rashid describes as "passive leaders".
 
I don't think they are playing - this is usually for mutual enjoyment - I don't see this here. I think this is the youngster trying to assert himself and the older horse isn't having any of it and warns him by kicking out but not forcefully as he recognises that he is just an annoying teenager with no social skills. In the second video the older horse jumps on the young one to put it in it's place before it can get going. Either way personally I would not want that great lump standing on my horse's back on a regular basis or ripping up my rugs. It might settle down as the herd settles but sometimes if they are too close in the pecking order with no clear leader then often trouble continues.
 
Tinypony said:
Well, because the idea of putting him in his place and using a "dominant" horse seems to imply that somehow this youngster is in the wrong I suppose. It sounds as if he needs a good duffing up to sort him out.
There is a lot of argument about dominance theories in horses, but the horses that seem to do really well with youngsters are the less "dominant" ones. The horses that Mark Rashid describes as "passive leaders".
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Why do you suppose we don't mean a "passive leader"? Noone's suggested a thug that would beat it up. Such an animal would itself be unsocialised.
 
I haven't read all your replies but it looks like the hairy could be young? alot of his behaviour is identical to that of one of my yearling gelded colts towards another, in my situation they both play and then rest afterwards. I think as others have said that the hairy is possibly very bored, there isn't going to be much he can eat with a grazing muzzle on with that grass level and bit of hay, so he's resorting to colt play. I don't believe this is 'bullying' as such and I don't believe there is much risk (except to your rug maybe!) of damage to your boy, if anything I think he'll finally get peed off enough to belt the other, resulting in the other one getting injured!

I think to curb this, another solution other than the muzzle issue needs to be found, separate hay piles established and possibly a field block for continued grazing at, I would try to have a big bale of hay put out if possible, to minimise it disappearing and boredom setting in again. With the hairy try and advise a horseball or similar put out for him, my welsh boy loves playing with his when my other yearling isn't interested in play!
 
galaxy23 said:
I wouldn't say that your horse is being bullied. He certainly doesn't move out the other horse's way and the other horse isn't being agressive. The other horse horse is just annoying your horse to the EXTREME!! If I was the other owner I'd also want him moved (if it is just a bad combination) because your horse gives back as good as he gets (and quite right too! the other horse is just too thick and persistent to get the message and bog off!).
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Agree.
It is perfectly reasonable to want him moved, if the behaviour patterns continue your horse will get more and more annoyed untill one of them does get hurt.

Personaly,I think it would do the young coloured the world of good to be out with either other youngsters who will play together without anyone getting angry and/or an older more dominant horse who will teach some manners-assuming the mussle is not going to be comming off any time soon he HAS to learn to accept it,winding up the others in the group trying to get it off is not doing him or the rest of his turn out group any good.
 
i am pleased to report that cob has been out all week without his muzzle and so far things are going well. Cob has also been seen playing with one of the older horses in the field too.

I was talking with the owner yesterday and she told me that at the previous yard she came from (they've only been here a few weeks) the cob was made to wear the muzzle AT ALL TIMES when out - he hasnt been turned out without it for 9 MONTHS!!!

Owner said she hated it but if she ever left it off she would get nasty texts from other liveries asking why he hadnt got his muzzle on and she was made to go and put it back on him. Shocking!

Owner also said his behaviour in the stable is so much better now he is unmuzzled as he was getting nasty and bulshy before.

I am now happy for him to stay in our field without his muzzle and Chico will just have to be more assertive if cob starts getting annoying, and i'm okay for Chico to play with him when he's in the mood.
 
Good news!!!! Pleased to hear it PMP... i feel sorry for the lady who owned that cob being MADE to do that....

nowt so queer as folk as they say...
 
Brilliant, that seems to support the assessment many made here of the cob's behaviour. His owner must be very relieved.
(Skewby, no big deal, I was reacting to the use of the word "dominant" and the connotations that often get attached to it. I didn't think you were talking about a passive leader because Mark R would assert that those horses don't display what most regard as dominant behaviour).
 
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