PLEASE any advice please on elderly loaned pony :(

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lordchester

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hi to who ever is reading this, i dont post on here much as cant always figure it out :P ok.... about 7 years ago i loaned my beloved 13.2hh pony out to a family as i was to big for him, they have had him ever since he is now 23 and retired i see him now and then but they arent very local and diaries always clash. i visited yesterday having seen him last september, and my heart broke :( he looked well old, and i didnt think healthy, he looked dull and a bit quite, he has always bin a monkey with a very strong mind and he knew it! after convincing him to walk across the feild where he was just stood, not eating! hes a lil cob and is always hungry! he had one polo off me and walked off head down, he had a light weight rug on so couldnt see him, his neck looked thin and his legs were curly coat, a completly different pony to the stunning cheeky haflinger i grew up with, ive bin thinking what to do..... they didint mention his apperance just said ahhh hes happy, hes had his breakfast and isnt interested in us now, how do you say to someone whos had him loan for that long and are lovely people, i think he looks "unwell" i cant have him back i cant afford him thats why he went on loan, but i just want him to be healthy and he didnt look it... any advice where to go now? x
 
Could you politely ask them to feed him a supliment for the older horse and give him a feed for veterans. That way you aren't saying he looks poorly just could do with a different feed suitable for his age. I really feel for you as you are only wanting what is best for the pony.
 
Without pictures it's hard to see if he is really looking poor or you're just used to a bigger, fatter pony to be honest. However, at 23 I wouldn't expect a healthy, happy horse to be that disinterested to be honest - I have 26 yo pony I've had 18 years and he is still full of himself. Ok, so he looks a little older but then he's not ridden as much as he used to be BUT he still runs about, does his 'rodeo' moves and is always wanting food (unless he thinks it's 'poisonous' vet-drugged food! Lol). If you say the people are very ncie and they care for him the i would ask how he's been, has he been a bit poorly? Is he getting enough food? Has he had his teeth checked etc etc. If they've cared for him fine for 7 years (I assume you've seen him in this time?) I can't see why they would suddenly stop. I think the only way to sort it is to speak to them and maybe see if a vet check would be in order - can you afford a vet visit? There could be a number of reasons why he's just not looking as good.
 
Well - I don't want to sound unkind - but if you love him so much - why have you not seen him for 6 months?? Clashing diaries or not.

You have a problem - and if you want to do anything practical it will cost you money. Do they have any loan agreement/contract. I assume that you cannot afford to take him back. On the same basis, I assume that you cannot afford vets fees either. The only thing that you could do is insist that they call the vet - with you in attendance. However, someone is going to have to pay! At the end of the day - you did not see him without a rug - are you sure that he just has no muscle? In any event - I think that another visit with a proper examination of the pony would be my first action.
 
The curly coat on his legs could be an indicator that he might have Cushings? How knowledgeable are the people who loan him, are you confident they would pick up on any health issues other than the most obvious ones? Depression can also be an indicator, and you do sound as though you are describing a rather depressed pony.

If they are seeing him every day they might genuinely just not be noticing his declining health, if he has very slowly been going down hill that is possible I suppose. And you not seeing him for several months would pick up on these changes instantly wouldn't you?

All older equines can change in appearance and attitude, just part of the ageing process but TBH, at 23 he isnt exactly ready for a zimmer frame! A lot of ponies are still going strong in every way at that age.

You say they are very nice people and they obviously love your pony, could you possibly email them saying that you have been thinking about X since you came away from the visit and you are a little concerned and wonder if they have noticed any major changes in him over this winter? Another good pointer is a dramatic increase in water consumption - but if his drinkers are automatic they might not have noticed that?

You might find they have got some niggling worries and will be relieved to talk through them with you and come to some arrangement to have a vet look at him perhaps?
 
lordchester said:
hi to who ever is reading this, i dont post on here much as cant always figure it out :P ok.... about 7 years ago i loaned my beloved 13.2hh pony out to a family as i was to big for him, they have had him ever since he is now 23 and retired i see him now and then but they arent very local and diaries always clash. i visited yesterday having seen him last september, and my heart broke :( he looked well old, and i didnt think healthy, he looked dull and a bit quite, he has always bin a monkey with a very strong mind and he knew it! after convincing him to walk across the feild where he was just stood, not eating! hes a lil cob and is always hungry! he had one polo off me and walked off head down, he had a light weight rug on so couldnt see him, his neck looked thin and his legs were curly coat, a completly different pony to the stunning cheeky haflinger i grew up with, ive bin thinking what to do..... they didint mention his apperance just said ahhh hes happy, hes had his breakfast and isnt interested in us now, how do you say to someone whos had him loan for that long and are lovely people, i think he looks "unwell" i cant have him back i cant afford him thats why he went on loan, but i just want him to be healthy and he didnt look it... any advice where to go now? x
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It's difficult but I think you need to talk to the loanees and suggest a visit from the vet which you might have to pay for and should attend.
What loan aggrement did you have with them ? At the worse case senario you will have to take him back and PTS if you believe that's what's needs doing .
I assume you put him on loan as you did not wish to lose track him when he was old well now he's Old and he might need you , your his owner and that what responsible ownership is about you want him to be healthy so try to make it happen if you can't then you have to walk this road with him that's surely why you did not sell him to take this responsiblity in the end . I am not saying you are coming to the end Just you need to talk to them and take it from there.
 
I would get the vet to look over your old horse. You mentioned the curly coat, so it could be cushings maybe? that can really affect them in the way you have described in fact, I would get the vet to look him over though. It can be a shock as animals can quite quickly look rather old

charmeroo said:
Well - I don't want to sound unkind - but if you love him so much - why have you not seen him for 6 months?? Clashing diaries or not.
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I do no think there was any need for this statement in truth /\/\ was there?
 
poor boy. Does he have cushings? Is he still in work? Maybe a good idea to suggest that he has tests done for cushings if you don't know for sure he has it. Hopefully that would also bring up any other issues. You really should insist on seeing him without a rug as well. It may be that he is not feeling too well and that could explain a loss of condition but if he was definitely not the spritely pony you remember then in the very least you need to make a point of visiting alot more frequently to keep a closer eye on the situation. It may just be that they haven't realised it themselves that there may be a problem developing.
 
Originally Posted by charmeroo View Post
Well - I don't want to sound unkind - but if you love him so much - why have you not seen him for 6 months?? Clashing diaries or not.

Oh dear, someone always has to put the boot in don't they?

Quite honestly OP I would ignore this bit of thinly disguised vitriol - as you say the loaners have had him for 7 years, you have been happy with the way they have looked after him in all that time, so a visit every 6 months isnt unreasonable IMO. And now you aren't happy with the situation you are asking for advice, cant see the problem with that TBH but there you go - it is dear old Hell and Hang'em isnt it?:rolleyes:
 
I think you need to have a conversation with the loaners, preferably face to face. You don't need to be overly harsh, just quietly state that you are not happy with the condition he is in and that they need to change his management and improve this. I am the first to admit my oldie isn't looking fantastic atm but I have changed his feed and he is already improving. Furthermore, he is clearly a very happy horse.
 
Personally i think 6 mths flies past these days so I don't think that's an issue at all. I also don't necessarily think just because he has curly hair on his legs means he has cushings mine gets curly-ish hair on his legs and he doesn't have cushings but he winters out and they grow hair - it may go curly if it's got wet etc.

I just think you need to chat to the loaners - I don't see why this should be an issue. Just say you're a bit concerned that he's lookiing underweight and that worries you. At the end of the day he is still your horse so if you're not 100% happy with how he looks you need to bring it up. Our 28 yo this year has ben looking a bit ropey and has been losing hair in patches through the in winter - just basically looked rubbish! We treated for lice and we are now treating him for liver function and he seems to have improved. We have not had the vet but would do if we felt hewas not right in himself or if what we were doing wasn't working.

23 is not that old, it really isn't so I wouldn't expect a 23 yo to be looking that poor without good reason.
 
charmeroo said:
Well - I don't want to sound unkind - but if you love him so much - why have you not seen him for 6 months?? Clashing diaries or not.

You have a problem - and if you want to do anything practical it will cost you money. Do they have any loan agreement/contract. I assume that you cannot afford to take him back. On the same basis, I assume that you cannot afford vets fees either. The only thing that you could do is insist that they call the vet - with you in attendance. However, someone is going to have to pay!
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seen as they have had him so long we dont do regular check ups, they have always cared for him, so its more just age, but 23 not that old really? he cannot come back we are at livery yard with no room, and its unfair to remove a pony in an enviroment where he can roam around a farm with no fences and live in a crew with his two little freinds to a busy yard where he is stabled every night in a fenced feild every day, the reason he went out on loan was i went on to a 14.2, shes still with me as ive not grown :P also have her little one, working full time doesnt give much time for a third one either, if it was my own feild or a rented feild then yeah its cheaper but 3 on a diy yard comes at a price, vet bills would never be an issue savings always come in handy to spend on your horses :P oh no hes not ridden anymore hasnt bin since spring, the girl has totaly outgrown him now
 
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Ok - apologies - I misread the situation. I do think that if you are unhappy with him that you need to at least take it up with the loaners though.
 
I would suggest you arrange to meet up with the people loaning your horse and then suggest it would be a good idea to have the vet out to give him a full check up. i.e. eye test, respiration, heart, trot-up, blood test for Cushings etc. which you would pay for.
 
PeterNatt said:
I would suggest you arrange to meet up with the people loaning your horse and then suggest it would be a good idea to have the vet out to give him a full check up. i.e. eye test, respiration, heart, trot-up, blood test for Cushings etc. which you would pay for.
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I agree with this from Peter, 100% and think it is the only way to ensure your old pony gets the best chance.

It appears they love him to bits and I would hope they would be happy to care for him, if he needs that little bit of extra TLC ...........
 
gonna go up there next week, and have a chat with them, and see if they would mind my vet having a look at him see what they think, thanks for advice guys, just kinda shocked and upsetting after having so much fun and growing up with them it kinda gets to you, and he really is a fab, hunting, jumping cross country machine, who gives so much every time
 
lordchester said:
gonna go up there next week, and have a chat with them, and see if they would mind my vet having a look at him see what they think, thanks for advice guys, just kinda shocked and upsetting after having so much fun and growing up with them it kinda gets to you, and he really is a fab, hunting, jumping cross country machine, who gives so much every time
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That is great, please let us know how you get on :)
 
I think you could say that as you haven't seen him for a while you've really noticed a difference in how he is.

My horse has lost condition since Christmas and I didn't notice it until all of a sudden it smacked me in the face when I realised his saddle had got too wide. Then I realised he looked awful, just scrawny and dull, but it took something like that to highlight it to me. A much more calorific diet is sorting it out, I'll be watching out for it next winter.

When you look after them every day and you are very close to them, you sometimes don't notice a gradual change in condition or behaviour - someone like you who knows the horse but hasn't seen him in a while is much better placed to spot something that the daily carer might not have picked up on yet....
 
I think you need to tread carefully so as not to upset them. If I were you I would play it like this: call them up and say thanks so much, it was lovely to see him etc. The thing is, and maybe you're being paranoid, but you noticed he has curly hair and you're a bit worried it could be a symptom of cushings. You totally appreciate it might just be because you haven't seen him for six months and you know that horses can suddenly age, but to put your mind at rest would they mind dreadfully if you paid to have the vet out? Tell them you appreciate massively how well they've looked after him and that he's so lucky to have such kind people looking after him as he gets older and you'd like to pay for this as you appreciate he's your responsibility too. I'd probably go along when the vet comes and take them a little something to say thank you for all their care for him.

Hopefully that will deal with the issue without suggesting you are questioning their care or judgement.
 
it's good that you're going to go talk to them, if you explain to them like you have done to us that you have such happy memories of him in his prime that it really struck you how he's aged and would they be ok for you to have your vet to give him a little once over MOT type check, I'm sure they'll be ok and not feel that you are blaming them or accusing them of anything:)
 
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