Please help - any advice appreciated.

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PIP17

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I have had my boy for nearly twelve months now (April 2010). He is 16.3hh ISH. I ride him in a hanging cheek snaffle and a runing martingale. When I first bought him I had a few problems with him which my friend on the yard helped me with - mainly canter transtitons - but I have worked very hard with him gaining his trust, taking things slowly, back checked reguarly, new saddle, massage occasionly etc etc. Gradually started to get on together - he is usually very quiet to hack out on his own and in company but Im not a yee-haa rider and only cantered when I felt happy which he was always good with. Anyway, got through the winter ok, didnt ride for a month because of the snow but when I got back on he was brilliant, not silly or anything and I really thought we were going from strength to strength. About six weeks ago I put him on a formula for his feet which is Lamanitic Approved and two weeks after that I had him clipped for the first time - he was clipped when I bought him last year - to cut a long story short he has turned into a total lune :( He did a rodeo display the first time I rode him after he had been clipped and I fell off, hacked him out later in the week in company and he was totally stupid till he got in front and now if I ride him round the field he is jogging and throwing his head around and threatening to bomb off. At this point I usually dismount and walk home. I have been lunging him to try to get rid of his energy and to be fair he bombs round for a bit and then settles but I dont know what Ive done to see such a change in character, he can be sharp sometimes but NOT like this! It has totally frightened me and I feel I dont know him anymore, he is very good on the ground,manners etc which I have taught him and he is still the same with this. Does anyone think its a good idea to get a more confident rider to take him round the field and give him a blast? Should I carry on lunging him and not ride till I feel safe to get on him. He looks like a steeplechaser ready to run the National!! Maybe I should finally admit I have bitten off more than I can chew and find him a home with a better person to deal with him than me?? Im really stuck. Any advise at all please really appreciated. Thanks for reading and sorry to go on.
 
We had a flush of spring grass a few weeks ago, could the change in his behaviour tie in with that, I think if you look back a few weeks there were several posts about horses suddenly behaving like lunatics. If that is what has caused it then he should settle fairly quickly as he gets used to it but have a look at what hard feed you are giving him and perhaps reduce it to make up for the grass.
 
Im only giving him chaff and unmolassed sugar beet, because of his size I have been careful not to heat him up and to be fair he has kept his weight on with just this and ad lib hay :(
 
There are some simple things you could try first: cut out all hard feed and turn him out for as long as possible, if possible 24/7, but keep an eye on his grass intake.

If it helps keep lunging him and/or take him schooling first to get the umph out of him before you hack. Do you have an instructor? It would be helpful to get someone experienced to give you their opinion on what's upsetting him and how to ride him through it.

Finally it doesn't sound like a physical problem but if you think it might be it's always worth asking the vet to give him the once over. Many horses react to pain by running off, spooking or napping.
 
Booboos said:
There are some simple things you could try first: cut out all hard feed and turn him out for as long as possible, if possible 24/7, but keep an eye on his grass intake.

If it helps keep lunging him and/or take him schooling first to get the umph out of him before you hack. Do you have an instructor? It would be helpful to get someone experienced to give you their opinion on what's upsetting him and how to ride him through it.

Finally it doesn't sound like a physical problem but if you think it might be it's always worth asking the vet to give him the once over. Many horses react to pain by running off, spooking or napping.
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I was going to write pretty much this, so will just 'ditto' instead (gawd, I'm getting lazy!).

Grey Mare was on Speedibeet. Now there is nothing in there that should heat up a horse, but she goes loopy on it. Three weeks and life was getting, er, interesting :eek:, but off it and after a week or so, she was back to her usual self :D

If you need something for weight, then I'd suggest Equijewel (no fizzing up!).
 
Sorry to hear this has happened :( You need to be carefull with lunging horses like this as it will only make him fitter which will mean he has more energy! Also getting someone to take him for a good gallop isn't nessecarily a good idea as he might then assocaite all rides with galloping and be even worse! What would be more productive would be to get a good rider to do some schooling with him for you (both in arena and on hacks) so he learns he has to listen to his rider and not be silly. The secret with horses like this is confidence. You have to make yourself be calm when they start jumping about otherwise they'll only get worse. I would try to school him round the field so he doesn't just associate it with going fast, get him really listening to you and only up the pace when you feel safe. Often with horses like this it is important to let them go forward (otherwise you'll just be fighting them and creating tension), but you need to do it in a controlled manner. If he is feeling fresh I would get him to trot on into a consistent contact, not so you are pulling him but so he feels contained. Do lots of transitions to keep him listening to you. After awhile of schooling like this you should be able to trust him more as he will realise he has to listen to you and not just do what he wants all the time! Hopefully then your hacks can become more enjoyable again.

ALso ditto what the others say regards spring grass, hopefully it is just a phase! I am not sure what Formula 4 feet has in it but if you think this is connected to his behaviour maybe look at using a different hoof supplement. Have you changed anything else about his feed or management lately that may have triggered this behaviour? What sort of clip did you give him? It might be worth putting an exercise sheet over his hindquarters whilst you warm up (just check he won't freak out at it first!) I hope you can find a solution! :)
 
Thanks everyone! I was thinking maybe the lunging could be making him slightly worse. We gave him a full clip, which was a bit of shock to him I think and if I can cope with him till next year (!) I wont be doing it again! I used to ride him with a flash on has he does open his mouth but it seemed to really unsettle him so I have been trying with out but there are times when I dont feel I have control. I read a post on here this week or last that Grackles can be better. Maybe try that to get him listening again? He is usually very good with his schooling now, although he wasnt when I first bought him, he was very stiff and unhappy but now he usually offers him a contact when we school. :rolleyes:
 
This may be totaly random but two things occured to me as i read your post. Could the cold after he had been clipped make him act like this, OR, had the previose owners hunted him, and he associates being clipped with hunting?
 
Yes I have tried the exercise sheet but not last night actually when he thought he was runing the National!! I did wonder if he associated the clip with something like hunting etc but his previous owner never mentioned hunting just fun rides when he informed me he rode him in a gag and a drop nose band :eek:
 
fun rides when he informed me he rode him in a gag and a drop nose band
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There's a big old clue for you.

What hard feed is he getting?
How much turnout?
What type of clip?
What is the name of the foot supliment?
 
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must admit, this is why i don't clip my very lively ones if i can help it, i've had the clipping make them hyper-sensitive nutters.
all the above is good advice. all i'd add is:
what saddle pad or numnah are you using, might be worth trying something different, certain materials can stick a bit to a clipped coat (read: velcro) and some horses really don't like it... and can be very eloquent about it.
i would definitely lunge him lightly before getting on, every time, just as a 'check how full of beans you are today' kind of thing... if he is feeling silly, it's better that he gets it out of his system 20m away than underneath you!
good luck. hope he calms down and you can relax and enjoy your riding again.

btw, the 'gag and drop noseband' thing really isn't that big a deal imho... fun rides can be lunatic asylums on the move, people charging past you out of nowhere, etc etc, i'd rather have a horse over-bitted for something like that than under-bitted, that's for sure! nothing worse than getting carted in a snaffle!
 
My mare is always silly just after a clip, it has become a standing joke that she is liable to deposit me on the floor the day after! spring grass has a lot to answer for too !
 
Lottie always used to go NUTS when she was 1st clipped. Only lasted about a week though. Expected to hunt or compete as soon as the fur was off and got over excited everytime I tacked up!!
 
amymay said:
There's a big old clue for you.

What hard feed is he getting?
How much turnout?
What type of clip?
What is the name of the foot supliment?
Click to expand...

Just Hi-Fi lite and unmolassed beet
All day turn out from 6.30am till 5.30ish on an evening
Full Clip
Formula for Feet (hope Im allowed to say that :rolleyes:)
 
I'd also say it is a combination of spring grass and being clipped.

For the spring grass issue you might find adding magnesium oxide to his diet helps.

I've also got one that can go hyper on speedibeet, even though there issupposed to be hardly any sugar in it, it has a dramatic effect.
 
Perhaps imagine how you would feel if you rode tomorrow with virtually no clothes on - all your nerve endings would be working overtime for sure! I gave mine a full clip when he was 7 (5 years ago now) and have never repeated the experience - neither of us wishes to actually! He changed from being an averagely spooky warmblood to being a full-blooded tb on speed.

Some just over-react to feeling the cold air all over them. Personally I'd turn him out for a month with a medium rug, and while the hair grows back maybe take up bridge or cycling - your safety comes first :) Then when he has more hair I'd start again slowly.

Definitely don't let a friend take him for a good gallop - he will think that's an option every time you ride.
 
I should think it has alot to do with the clip, i know many peopl dont clip there lively horses or youngsters because it does have atendancy to wind them up, that combined with spring grass is likely to be the cause, for future reference try not to clip at all but if you do take as little off as possible (bib clip). For now make sure you hae an exercise sheet on incase it is cold ensure he has a good numnah and pad on to protect his back if it is just sensitivity. It maybe worth getting someone confident to just take him out a couple of times so he maybe relaises getting wound up doesn't work.
As for spring grass he will be used to that soon so that won't matter in a week or so's time. Maybe loose the speedibeet tho as that does sometimes make horses hyper even though it shouldnt.
 
Llewelyn said:
Perhaps imagine how you would feel if you rode tomorrow with virtually no clothes on - all your nerve endings would be working overtime for sure! I gave mine a full clip when he was 7 (5 years ago now) and have never repeated the experience - neither of us wishes to actually! He changed from being an averagely spooky warmblood to being a full-blooded tb on speed.

Some just over-react to feeling the cold air all over them. Personally I'd turn him out for a month with a medium rug, and while the hair grows back maybe take up bridge or cycling - your safety comes first :) Then when he has more hair I'd start again slowly.

Definitely don't let a friend take him for a good gallop - he will think that's an option every time you ride.
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Totally agree and wish I had never done it to him :(
 
Ah Spring is in the air !

I feed the same as you minus the feet formula and my mare also likes to think she could win the national at this time of year show her a bit of grass and a spring breeze and off we go! Snaffle mouth normally but in thes situations I bit up to a happy mouth dutch gag on the middle ring / one below snaffle when I was hunting we went for the bottom ring and a flash - if it's annoying him it's likely to do with the fact that it's working and he can't avaid the bit ! get yourself a neck strap. I feel a wave of panic if I don't have my martingale to clutch at hair times.

He shouldn't really need a blast if he is playing with his mates all day. His new clip will have made a differance to how he feels, are you over rugging him ?? Be honest how many coats does he have on ??

:-)
 
Ladylina83 said:
Ah Spring is in the air !

I feed the same as you minus the feet formula and my mare also likes to think she could win the national at this time of year show her a bit of grass and a spring breeze and off we go! Snaffle mouth normally but in thes situations I bit up to a happy mouth dutch gag on the middle ring / one below snaffle when I was hunting we went for the bottom ring and a flash - if it's annoying him it's likely to do with the fact that it's working and he can't avaid the bit ! get yourself a neck strap. I feel a wave of panic if I don't have my martingale to clutch at hair times.

He shouldn't really need a blast if he is playing with his mates all day. His new clip will have made a differance to how he feels, are you over rugging him ?? Be honest how many coats does he have on ??

:-)
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Medium weight with a hood. He is with one other horse and he usually cant be bothered to play!
 
PIP17 said:
Just Hi-Fi lite and unmolassed beet
All day turn out from 6.30am till 5.30ish on an evening
Full Clip
Formula for Feet (hope Im allowed to say that :rolleyes:)
Click to expand...

Okey dokey - then I agree with the others, that it's likely to be the clip that's causing the problem. I wonder why you had him clipped out??

Any way - work, work, and more work again - should get the naughtiness out of him. If you can get him out for an hour or two hacking every day, I'm sure he'll settle down pretty quickly for you.
 
amymay said:
Okey dokey - then I agree with the others, that it's likely to be the clip that's causing the problem. I wonder why you had him clipped out??

Any way - work, work, and more work again - should get the naughtiness out of him. If you can get him out for an hour or two hacking every day, I'm sure he'll settle down pretty quickly for you.
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He seemed a bit hot and itchy to be honest - I can only ride for long periods at weekends but will do my best. Can just about do half an hour of an evening now but might ask my friend who is a much better rider than me to school him round the field (with me there) to help.
Thanks everyone for all the replys xx
 
Sounds like he's feeling too well, spring is upon us so a change in the grass will effect him along with as much hay he can eat, his extra feed (even if it is only a piddly amout) plus he'll feel fresh with full clip, perfect ingredients for silly behaviour.

Change his diet or at least cut out any extra feed and hay, if he's well covered and not lacking in the energy department, why bother feeding extra it's a waste of money, you may feel a bit of a mean mum and yes he may drop a little weight but it might be just want he needs to bring him back to planet earth until he settles, better than having a stupid horse, bang him on a mag calmer, see how he goes on for the next month.

Don't lunge him too much, some horses it just makes them worse or indeed fitter but if he needs a good old bronc then fair enough I see why it's temping but ideally you don't want to encourage a horse get it out of his system, it's not acceptable for them to act like this when ridden or on the lunge, plus your increasing the risk of injuries if their looning about when they have not been warmed up.

Make sure he's in the right frame of mind before you get on, sometimes it can just take five minutes of walking him round, bit of ground work, backing up, lifting feet, basically messing around with them but making sure he's focusing on you and not what he thinks your going to do (jump on and ride), I used to ride a horse like this, you'd be amazed how worked up he could get but a 5-10 minutes getting his attention and getting him relaxed really helped, lunging him if would just fuel the fire.

You'll probably find he comes back to his normal self with a few little changes once he's had his fun :)
 
It does sound like the clip has something to answer for, coupled with the season changing and the grass starting to come through. Mine always gets a bit livelier when he's clipped (full clip too) but he has to be done as he gets too hot and uncomfortable (I have to clip him out in the summer too). Try be firm with him when you ride. If you feel that maybe you'll be safer in a stronger bit then I'd go for that too to be honest. whatever works and makes you feel in control to be honest as i think this makes you more confident anyway which helps the whole situation. After all he's not a small horse is he. I would try not dwell on his behaviour to be honest (I know, easier said than done) and just put it down to one off, silly horse behaviour. If it helps to get someone else on him for a bit to work through it then so be it. I am sure i he will settle down soon enough.

oh and i think formula 4feet may have a fair few vitamins and stuff in that could well cause some excitanle behaviour. I was feeding mind Kossolian (blood salts) to help with his energy levels as he sometimes needs a boost. i also fed him on formula 4 feet as he suffers with brittle hooves. However, as he was on various supplements we compared the ingredients and found that the kossolian and the formula 4 feet had pretty much the same stuff in (formula 4 feet just has biotin added) so we stopped the kossolian as pointless ooverdosing!!! Lol. So, i would maybe consider taking him off the formula 4 feet and replace with plain old biotin if you are feeding to maintain hoof growth.
 
Possibly the clip hasn't helped, but there have been so many "help, my horse has gone mad!" thread on here in the last two or three weeks I would say that the spring grass coming through is the biggest issue.

If its any consolation, my husband's, usually laid back, ISH was a nutcase today when I hacked him out. He is not clipped or fit. We were meant to be out for 40mins as part of a fittening programme, but he was so spooky and silly that I just kept going and going until he calmed down. I got home three hours later!!

If it is grass growth or the clip, either way he should settle down soon! He will return to type soon. Don't let it worry you.

Ps. You could always go down to thinner rugs - let his coat come through a bit..
 
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