Pony bite my daughter

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clairelouisehorses

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Hi we brought a new pony on sat, a little 4 year old welsh sec a for my 5 year old daughter to ride next spring when she has outgrown her Shetland the plan being for me to break him and get him out long reining all winter and for daughter to handle him on the ground but after tying him up last night we were grooming a side each and he seemed a bit unsure of her being there and tried to step away then he turned round and bit her on the neck, not sure wat to do from here, I did call the old owners and told them what happened and he has never done anything like this before, he used to get bullied in his old home by all the other horses, so not sure if this has something do to do with it, he is fine handled by myself, any help would be greatly appreciated
 
Was it teeth bares vicious I mean It bite? or I am ticklish gerroff bite... or was he grooming her?

Blooming hurts doesn't it!! Hope the little one is ok :-(

i would probably say you should have her on the same side as you or even not grooming him until you all know him inside out, its probably just a case of insecure pony, new home, etc etc etc

Horses and ponies can act very out of character when they move home, takes a while to settle in, make sure if the pony tries to do anything like this again you make sure it understands its very wrong!
 
It's also possible he may have been given treats at some point and was wondering why the pez dispenser wasn't working. One of my gelding was horribly nippy when he arrived as a 2yo. He was still finding his place in the world. Even now if anyone gives him one single treat he turns nippy for a few minutes in the hope of magically making more treats appear.
 
I am glad your daughter was not seriously injured.

A four year old pony is a baby. Buying a baby pony to bring on and prepare for your daughter exactly how you want him to be is a really good idea as long as you are experienced enough to do it (including light weight enough to ride him) and you don't let your daughter anywhere near the pony until you are sure he has manners, both on the ground and ridden. I would expect you to need about 18 to 24 months before the pony can be left entirely in your daughter's care, and while she can progressively do more with him, letting such a young child near a strange, young pony the first few days you have him is asking for trouble.
 
Thistle said:
Ok I'm going to be harsh!

You trusted a 4 yr old pony that you didn't know with you very young daughter? Hos totally irresponsible!!!
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I agree that it is naive to expect perfect behaviour from an unknown pony, especially one that has been plonked in a completely new environment with new people. I don't condone the behaviour, but it doesn't surprise me. However, I wouldn't assume that OP had been wilfully irresponsible.
 
I think you need a quick course in handling youngsters, especially in regard to child safety.

Neither your daughter nor the pony knows how to behave as a grownup at the moment, they both need you to guide them and for this to be a success you need to be one step ahead the whole time, not firstly allowing your daughter to get into a dangerous place and secondly failing to react to the pony's signs of discomfort in the situation.

I wish you success but you need to wise up, and fast.
 
Im experienced enough to being him on through the winter myself wasn't sure to leave my daughter out of the equation for a while or try and introduce them together a different way.

Thistle - think that is a bit harsh, even if I had owned him for a year and not let my daughter anyway near him and then let her groom him, which like this time, he would be tied up and it would of been supervise by me, he could have still turned on her, if he had displayed this behaviour with me then of course she wouldn't be allowed near him
 
Personally, I wouldn't have let such a young child handle and groom such a young pony when it had been in its new home for only a few days, and is likely to be feeling a bit unsettled and insecure. I would suggest that for the time being only you should deal with the pony until you are sure that you know it inside out and that it knows its manners. Even then you should ensure your daughter is properly supervised and instructed whilst grooming etc (for example, she should be on the same side of the pony as you, so you can see exactly what she is doing and how the pony is reacting).
 
I would spend time alone with the pony without your daughter, work out what makes him flinch and see if he has 'tickly' spots. I personally wouldn't let my kid near a new pony till I was perfectly comfortable that it isn't a nipper or kicker.
 
clairelouisehorses said:
Im experienced enough to being him on through the winter myself wasn't sure to leave my daughter out of the equation for a while or try and introduce them together a different way.

Thistle - think that is a bit harsh, even if I had owned him for a year and not let my daughter anyway near him and then let her groom him, which like this time, he would be tied up and it would of been supervise by me, he could have still turned on her, if he had displayed this behaviour with me then of course she wouldn't be allowed near him
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In your OP you stated that he seemed unsure of her being on the other side of him from you. So you noticed there was a problem, you then utterly failed to act. You had had the pony 4 days FGS, it is a baby, and you didn't supervise, you let her get into a dangerous position and you did nothing.

And then you describe yourself as experienced. But not experienced enough to keep your daughter on the same side as yourself or introduce her and the pony slowly and under careful supervision.
 
These things happen and I hope it hasnt put your daughter off.
Some ponies dont like feeling "trapped" between two people,I have a horse that just cant cope with one person each side.
Try again with you at the ponys head and on the same side,let him get used to her and read any warning signs very quickly,if he sidles away back off for a moment then start again.He may just not be used to little people and will take time to adjust.
I have a section A that is really happy with little ones as she was handled by a 4 yr old from a young age,your pony if he is a kind pony will gain confidence fairly quickly.
 
Thanks for the people who have given good advice for me to follow, it's really appreciated, as for the harsh comments, I feel bad for whats happened and I noticed the problem straight away but it happened so quick I never had time to react, I have learned from my mistakes and I'm sure even the most experienced people make mistakes from time to time surely
 
Make sure you have someone it back the pony properly before sticking your daughter on, i'd rather my kid was too big on her shetland a bit longer than on a green section a! After viewing a few 5 and 6yr olds this year I wouldn't have gotten on some, they can be fast and flightly little beasties! Good luck though x
 
It is too long ago for me to remember all details but my sons first pony was a well handled 3yo Sec A bought straight off a stud. My son was 4 and had pestered for his own pony.
She had 2-3 weeks professional backing and then came home.
All my son wanted to do was just sit on for 10 mins at a time and potter around the field. I lunged her before each session.
I did ride and lead with her for a year without jockey.
Then we hacked together, still ride and lead and i used to collect him from school (hat and boots in ruck-sac)
She was not easy--a bit of a spook at times (mounted games flags) but took good care of him. The scary bit going off the lead rein, but she was really good.
I definitely dont remember her ever biting but she had never had tit-bits and any treats with us were only out of a bucket.
She took him right through minimus tetrathlon, county show etc

Yes it was a risk--but I had been teaching Pony Club for years and seen many older ponies ( and sat on a number of them!) I would not have trusted.
 
I think you have hit the nail on the head when you say the pony was bullied in his last field.

I read a really good article a while ago which explained that when ponies are the bottom of the pecking order in a field, they will often try to be above something else, even if it is a human. They described it as 'misplaced play activity' which makes sense - they get bitten in the field, so in turn they bite a little person. He is testing to see if he can be above your daughter. So not evil, but equally not acceptable.

As others have said, be firm and let him know it's not acceptable, without frightening him.
 
PonyIAmNotFood said:
Why an unbroken 4 year old for such a young child? Why not a been there done that 15 year old for her to grow confidence with?
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this is what id have done. also saved yourself a lot of time long reining on icy roads in january and have history
V young children and v young ponies are often an accident waiting to happen!


i hope your daughter's ok. with young kids its so easy for a bad experience like this to make them scared of the pony and not want anything to do with it. that will present extra problems you dont need ;)

goodluck lula x
 
Wow at the harsh replies!!!! gobsmacked, we have all done really stupid things and thought afterwards OMG why did I do that?

Letting your little one help groom on the other side in hindsight was daft, but I am sure the OP had a why did I do that moment afterwards! I wish I was as perfect as half the people on this forum, then I would never get kicked again, never be pushed up against a gate by a bolshy horse, never get headbutted etc etc etc.

I am very very neurotic with my 4 yr old around the 15hh 4 yr old to the point shes not actually allowed in the stable with him, and I bet OP will be like that from now on, shes allowed one mistake without being called irresponsible!

OP another bit of advice which is really really hard to enforce as feels utterly OTT is to have a rule with your daughter from now until shes an adult is to not be allowed to enter the stable or lead etc etc without her hat on. Imagine if that was a hoof on her head. Was a little girl a few yrs ago who went into muck her pony out and was killed by a stray hoof... always assume the worst even with a perfectly mannered pony.

don't let some people make you feel guilty, we are all guilty of it sometimes XX
 
Devonshire dumpling said:
don't let some people make you feel guilty, we are all guilty of it sometimes XX
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agreed!
ive broken at least 2 bones form making stupid mistakes around my horses taht with hindsight, a bit of thought and common sense could have avoided.

but it is her 4yr old daughter. as you pointed out, sometimes you don't get a second chance to learn from your mistakes with children.
 
Isn't there some old quote "One rose doth not a summer make"?

One bite doth not a drama make either! It's regrettable, and I'm sorry your daughter was hurt - and probably shaken up - but these things happen. It's not the end of life as we know it. The pony is a baby, he has just arrived in new surroundings, your handling, however good (or not) is strange to him. and it's a naive assumption that all little ponies adore little people. They don't!!! If I wanted something that a small daughter could do what she wants with I'd get her a big kind hairy cob - or a TB (and I'm not joking). Why do you think Americans put their 2-year old kids on quarter horses?

I'd keep daughter and pony at a respectful distance from each other until he has settled, and you know what he's really like. I'm sure with careful handling he'll become a lovely pony for your family.
 
Thanks Devonshire dumpling for sticking up for me, I absolutely know where I went wrong and was so shocked with the pony and more with myself for letting it happen, I have a 12 year old 16.3hh and a 11 year old mini Shetland that i brought 10 years ago both unhanded and never had a problem with them and broke them both myself, sometimes i think u go on past experience and think it will be ok, I never brought my daughter a young pony thinking it will be like this, and as much as I would of loved to have brought her a been there done it all they are way out of my price range so will have to work with wat we have got
 
Llewelyn said:
I think you have hit the nail on the head when you say the pony was bullied in his last field.

I read a really good article a while ago which explained that when ponies are the bottom of the pecking order in a field, they will often try to be above something else, even if it is a human. They described it as 'misplaced play activity' which makes sense - they get bitten in the field, so in turn they bite a little person. He is testing to see if he can be above your daughter. So not evil, but equally not acceptable.

As others have said, be firm and let him know it's not acceptable, without frightening him.
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I have seen this kind of behaviour myself, so many times. We always used to call it 'kick the cat' syndrome. We actually had a Welshie who was bottom of the pecking order who would literally chase any cat she saw in the field (never did manage to kick one fortunately).
I find that horses who are not used to being handled by 2 people simultaneously do find it quite strange at first, no matter how old they are. It is a skill that we always teach them but we do have to be on the ball, watching their reactions, in the first few weeks and wouldn't be likely to do it within the first 4 days.

OP, I hope your daughter is not too upset/badly injured by what happened. I agree with the other posters who have mentioned that you could have done things better (but I guess you know that now). While you are getting to know the pony you need to watch his behaviour carefully and learn to pick up on the tiny signals that he gives to warn you about his next move. I would make sure that you know the pony really well before letting your daughter do anything more than talking to him over a fence/stable door.

I would explain to your daughter that the pony felt threatened because there were 2 of you, didn't mean to hurt her, and that you are going to do things differently from now on. She can concentrate on her Shetland while you get to know the pony and teach it the things you want it to know.
 
clairelouisehorses said:
Thanks Devonshire dumpling for sticking up for me, I absolutely know where I went wrong and was so shocked with the pony and more with myself for letting it happen, I have a 12 year old 16.3hh and a 11 year old mini Shetland that i brought 10 years ago both unhanded and never had a problem with them and broke them both myself, sometimes i think u go on past experience and think it will be ok, I never brought my daughter a young pony thinking it will be like this, and as much as I would of loved to have brought her a been there done it all they are way out of my price range so will have to work with wat we have got
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Ahhh no problems, I am a mummy too and know you are mortified, i expect guilt made you even post here, you certainly didn't need someone having a go, if you didn't care and worry you wouldn't have told anyone!

I bet your little pony will be a gem in no time, these babies tend to be teethy anyway, they just need to learn NO!

go read my new thread, its designed to make you feel better, look what I did!! haha
 
The reason people are being harsh in their replies is that OP's original post does NOT give the impression of someone who made a silly mistake (which happens to everyone and anyone) and is aware of it, but rather sounds like she thinks the pony is unsuitable. What people are pointing out is that the pony's behaviour is perfectly normal, it's the situation the pony was put in that is problematic and needs to be rectified. The reason the OP sounds less experienced than she claims to be is that she doesn't entirely seem aware of the fact that she created the situation that led to the problem - harsh but since the problem mey recur with worse consequences this time and since this is an open forum, people are pointing this out.

OP I would go for an elderly been there done that pony, at that height and lead rein they are not that difficult to find or that expensive to buy plus many families want to loan rather than sell so that would be a good option for you.
 
I agree with DD how many of us can say in hind sight why on earth did I do that, I expect OP feels a tad guilty but things happen luckily it sounds like her child wasn't hurt so I expect she won't make the same mistake again.
I'd follow what others have said about getting to know pony first let the pony settle before introducing your daughter. Am sure your daughter will have years of fun welsies are fab :D
 
Sorry I've not read all the post so probably going over covered ground.

I too have a 5 year old welsh A we've had him for a year and daughters didn't touch him for 4 months as he was a bit ferrel (not naughty or dangerous as such just unhandled and unknown) they just played around him- being their usual noisy selves until he was used to that then helped grooming, now a year on they can dangle of him pick his feet out bring him in from field- four year old can even (when leading him) his him a check to make him walk nicely and he respects her. But even now it's all supervised accidents can happen...

Good luck I'm sure it was just a blip take it right back to basics that last thing you want is for your daughter to lose interest.
 
clairelouisehorses said:
and I noticed the problem straight away but it happened so quick I never had time to react, I have learned from my mistakes and I'm sure even the most experienced people make mistakes from time to time surely
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Your mistake was to buy a 4 year old pony for such a young child and then be surprised when the pony acted like a 4 year old. If you must buy such a young pony, surely you should be training it yourself before introducing your daughter to it in safe careful steps. I find your comment that the previous owners, when you spoke to them, said that it had never done it before. As if a 4 year old can be trusted to act like an experienced child's pony in a new home!
 
Booboos said:
The reason people are being harsh in their replies is that OP's original post does NOT give the impression of someone who made a silly mistake (which happens to everyone and anyone) and is aware of it, but rather sounds like she thinks the pony is unsuitable. What people are pointing out is that the pony's behaviour is perfectly normal, it's the situation the pony was put in that is problematic and needs to be rectified. The reason the OP sounds less experienced than she claims to be is that she doesn't entirely seem aware of the fact that she created the situation that led to the problem - harsh but since the problem mey recur with worse consequences this time and since this is an open forum, people are pointing this out.

OP I would go for an elderly been there done that pony, at that height and lead rein they are not that difficult to find or that expensive to buy plus many families want to loan rather than sell so that would be a good option for you.
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Totally agree with this post, it is wrong to blame the pony for what was essentially a human mistake due to what sounds like a lack of experience.
 
Pony was uncertain, you carried on regardless - and your daughter was bitten...

Pony was thrown in at the deepend by the sounds of it and you've learnt an important lesson. Children need to learn not to take animals for granted, and so do you.

Onwards and upwards.
 
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