Poo Picking Dilemma!

[The Fuzzy Furry]

OP, I understand where you are coming from.
My 3 winter paddocks (1 big 2 small) are also the ones i use in early summer, it annoys me intensely to see piles of droppings in them :redface3: so I poo pick.
Usually its quicker to shove a barrow round than it is to muck out, I do mine twice a day so I dont get annoyed if I have to miss the odd time due to being late/going out etc

If I turned mine away on much larger grazing then I probably wouldn't tho. But that isn't going to happen as i like to ride as much as i can so have them near to hand when weather horrible etc

 

[madlady]

I've never poo picked.

Mine are out in summer on 12 acres of moorland type grazing - not all of it is edible as there are some patches of reed in there but it's ideal - there are a few different types of grass and it isn't lush grazing.

Horses are wormed before they go out on it and then worm counted during the summer (I've not had to worm them during summer based on worm counts for the last 6 years). When they come in the fields are topped and harrowed. We've never had any obvious 'toilet' areas, nettle patches or dock patches. Our well rotted manure gets spread on the top fields that are used for hay.

 

[Enfys]

Three months of this, poo picking, nah, not happening

 

[Auslander]

and potentially cause more worm issues.

Even when the horses in question are on a comprehensive worming/testing programme?

 

[happyclappy]

Obsessed with poo picking, have always done it, rarely had to worm.
If you continue poo piking he will have nothing to spread!

 

[OWLIE185]

Poo picking will prevent the grass land from being damaged as if the poos are allowed to remain on the grass then the grass below them will die off causing weeds to take over.
There is also the issue of worms and be aware that a worm count will not detect any encysted small round worm or tape worm.
There is absolutely no harm in picking up the poos.

 

[ameeyal]

never poo picked in 35 years of owning horses, { think i would rather do house work }

 

[Auslander]

There is also the issue of worms and be aware that a worm count will not detect any encysted small round worm or tape worm.

Hence worming for ESR at the appropriate time of year, and testing/worming for tape.
I just don't get why worms keep beng mentioned in relation to horses/land where correct worming programmes are in place.

 

[Lplates]

What is the smallest amount of land to ponies where it becomes less important to pooh pick? I do, but would love to give up over the winter! I have two small ponies on two acres, so presumed pooh picking was essential.

 

[WelshD]

What is the smallest amount of land to ponies where it becomes less important to pooh pick? I do, but would love to give up over the winter! I have two small ponies on two acres, so presumed pooh picking was essential.

I have two small ponies on 2.8 acres and I do not poo pick apart from in the hottest of weather where they spend all day in a very small spot (the shade)

I feed black sunflower seeds which means that gangs of crows spread the poo for me which is great but I have a little flock of sheep which are absolutely magical in refreshing tired grazing and cutting down the chances of worm problems

I think the sheep are worth their weight in gold (apart from lambing time when they become an utter nightmare for three weeks)

 

[SusieT]

if you just spread the muck and have the horses on the same land all year round you are more at risk of worms- if you are harrowing you need to rest the land for 3-6 months at some point to allow any larvae that over winter etc. to be killed off. Harrowing and leavin gon the same ground all the time doesn't work without the rest to kill off the life cycle.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

never poo picked in 35 years of owning horses, { think i would rather do house work }

Oh yuk - I would rather pooh pick than house work as I get more buzz seeing my fields clean and horses happy than hoovering and polishing.

Taken From the site in my signature:

Chain Harrow your manure

Pros

Can cover a large area in fast time

Harrow your pasture in the summer – it takes temperatures of 90 degrees Fahrenheit to kill parasite larvae

Do not drag your pasture in the spring or fall. This practice only aides in spreading the larvae which can over winter and be infective the following spring.


CONS

If you haven't got a good deworming protocol in place the manure will have an egg load and the eggs are often quite tough, and you'll have spread them all around in a thin enough layer that the usual habit of not eating around the piles won't be true. So you'll be happily reinfecting your horses.
Breaking up manure piles in the heat of the summer so that the sun can kill the parasite eggs is a good idea, but using a harrow can spread parasite eggs more widely over the entire field. Bottom line: if you must harrow your field, don't do it in the spring or fall or when you have horses on it.
if its too wet to harrow you will end up ripping the field up
If you leave it, or birds spread it - the eggs have got onto the grass and then you've lost the control benefit.



H&H members write

Chain harrowing is spreading the muck across the whole field so unless it can be rested afterwards for a few month at least, all its doing is just that, spreading the muck around.
The muck then cover the whole paddock so none of the grass is 'clean' and can eventually become horse-sick,(sour and unpalatable for the horses to eat) .
It can also increase drastically any worm burden.

 

[Enfys]

if you just spread the muck and have the horses on the same land all year round you are more at risk of worms- if you are harrowing you need to rest the land for 3-6 months at some point to allow any larvae that over winter etc. to be killed off. Harrowing and leavin gon the same ground all the time doesn't work without the rest to kill off the life cycle.

Even in a British winter there should be spells of cold enough weather to kill larvae, be easier if you could just rely on the things drowning wouldn't it?

To pick or not to pick, it's one of those things that depends entirely on personal preference, yard rules, what land you have available and a host of other variables.

 

[SusieT]

yes but there is an overwintering phenomena which is how the cycle keeps going as otherwise worms would all die at the first cold snap! In addition obviously to the parasites living in the animals.

 

[Lplates]

I have two small ponies on 2.8 acres and I do not poo pick apart from in the hottest of weather where they spend all day in a very small spot (the shade)

I feed black sunflower seeds which means that gangs of crows spread the poo for me which is great but I have a little flock of sheep which are absolutely magical in refreshing tired grazing and cutting down the chances of worm problems

I think the sheep are worth their weight in gold (apart from lambing time when they become an utter nightmare for three weeks)

Brilliant about the sunflower seeds - I can borrow my neighbours sheep - how many do you have and are they in with the ponies?
Are there any problems with this? Wondering what would happen to my field shelter etc!

We had v v low worm counts recently, so not too worried about that, but do you never get grass sickness if you never pooh pick?
Thanks heaps!

 

[ilvpippa]

We stop poo picking around November as its pitch black and too far with the mud. Always looks clean as the rabbits/crows get on it. Horse is regularly wormed when needed & worm counted. Will be doing winter worm soon

 

[WelshD]

Brilliant about the sunflower seeds - I can borrow my neighbours sheep - how many do you have and are they in with the ponies?
Are there any problems with this? Wondering what would happen to my field shelter etc!

We had v v low worm counts recently, so not too worried about that, but do you never get grass sickness if you never pooh pick?
Thanks heaps!

My sheep graze happily with the ponies but I have a ram who doesn't like me and two pushy goats with horns so in the interests of safety as well as land management I try to keep them apart

I have between three and seven sheep depending on the time of year

There is a part of the land not fenced for sheep and the difference in the quality and cleanliness of the grazing is significant. I don't pretend to understand the science behind it but I understand that by rotating the sheep and ponies and then resting the ground is ideal for worm control. Certainly I've never had any bad results with worm counts

Big fan of sheep here but obviously it's not practical for everyone

 

[*hic*]

Ive always been under the impression horse manure is not the best to spread on fields.


I also agree it is down to space and the amount horses.
In a smaller are horse will be forced to eat nearer their much and potentially cause more worm issues.
Cross grazing is best but also good rotating and resting of the fields.

Oh yuk - I would rather pooh pick than house work as I get more buzz seeing my fields clean and horses happy than hoovering and polishing.

Taken From the site in my signature:

Chain Harrow your manure

Pros

Can cover a large area in fast time

Harrow your pasture in the summer – it takes temperatures of 90 degrees Fahrenheit to kill parasite larvae

Do not drag your pasture in the spring or fall. This practice only aides in spreading the larvae which can over winter and be infective the following spring.


CONS

If you haven't got a good deworming protocol in place the manure will have an egg load and the eggs are often quite tough, and you'll have spread them all around in a thin enough layer that the usual habit of not eating around the piles won't be true. So you'll be happily reinfecting your horses.
Breaking up manure piles in the heat of the summer so that the sun can kill the parasite eggs is a good idea, but using a harrow can spread parasite eggs more widely over the entire field. Bottom line: if you must harrow your field, don't do it in the spring or fall or when you have horses on it.
if its too wet to harrow you will end up ripping the field up
If you leave it, or birds spread it - the eggs have got onto the grass and then you've lost the control benefit.



H&H members write

Chain harrowing is spreading the muck across the whole field so unless it can be rested afterwards for a few month at least, all its doing is just that, spreading the muck around.
The muck then cover the whole paddock so none of the grass is 'clean' and can eventually become horse-sick,(sour and unpalatable for the horses to eat) .
It can also increase drastically any worm burden.

Perhaps it should be noted that the stuff you C+P is opinions copied from this forum, rather than any authoritative source.

 

[Auslander]

Perhaps it should be noted that the stuff you C+P is opinions copied from this forum, rather than any authoritative source.

Oh come on - if it's on the internet, it's correct. Surely you know that by now?

 

[Dry Rot]

It is probably just cynical old me but I do notice the almost complete absence of published scientific papers on this subject! Could there be a vested financial interest somewhere to sell us as much wormer as possible?

The companies who do FECs seem very concerned that we handle poo samples with kid gloves in case we cause the worm eggs to hatch and they get an incorrect count. Yet harowing "spreads worm eggs". Discuss!

And is it the worm eggs or the larvae that are infective? Surely, eggs will eventualy get washed down off the grass by rain and larvae will only be present in the summer when conditions are suitable, i.e. when it is warm and damp?

Why are they so keen to keep us ignorant?

I have a vacuum poo machine which is expensive to run as both that and the quad use petrol, so I tend to harrow with a 10ft spiked chain harrow behind the tractor with a railway sleeper dragged behind that to smash up the lumps. I harrow at least twice, the second time at right angles to the first. The poo is shattered and the fragments distributed thinly over a wide area. The ponies go back on when the grass has been washed clean by the rain, not according to the calendar.

An old microscope and some plastic McMaster counting slides don't cost a fortune and full instructions on how to do your own worm counts are available on-line anyway. Seems to work for me.

 

[DD]

It's all down to acreage and what the worm counts tell you .
I never poo pick here apart from fatties skinny strips and the tiny turnout squares .we also spread the muck heap on the land when it's well rotted .

same here

 

[EQUIDAE]

I too never poo pick - it's nice to see the birds getting a free meal, especially in winter Badgers and 'eyebrows' too. Oh and not forgetting my free range chickens!

If you harrow in spring and spread the muck heap (and have no worm burden) then there is no need to fertilise in the spring - as well as saving the effort, it also saves money.

I do poo pick in summer when they are on tiny paddocks but usually even this is spread by the birds.

 

[Tnavas]

I am exactly the same, but the pheasants are my spreaders!

My friend always feeds some oats to her ponies as the birds then come and break down the dungs and the rain washes it in. My own paddock is just harrowed, the dung puts fibre back into the soil.