Position Question

[Ambers Echo]

So I had a XC lesson a while ago which didn’t really go very well I kept being told to sit back/ bring my shoulders back/ bring my body back to try and slow Lottie down.
Then I had a jumping lesson at Ingestre. Jumped out of a forward seat, then out of whatever you call a sitting- in- the-saddle seat. And finally a sort of hybrid. Not fully in forward seat but in a forwardish, light seat. I was told that I was most effective in that hybrid seat.

I took Lottie back to a XC lesson and although I didn’t consciously pay attention to seat, I can see in the videos I am in that light seat. It worked really well to keep Lottie contained. Do I just ignore the sit back advice or am I missing something in what I was being told?

 

[EventingMum]

IMO xc you need to be able to adapt your position to the type of fence and terrain. The light seat is great for fences that you can ride to on a forward stride, sometimes I've heard them described as "power" fences, usually single fences with a spread. However, combinations type fences may well require a "coffin canter" and then the rider needs a more upright position to help the horse balance in it's shorter, rounder stride, especially between elements of the combination or at very upright fences. Likewise, drop fences would also demand the rider to be more upright (and obviously able to slip the reins) to preserve the balance of both horse and rider on landing. Between fence over fairly even terrain, the forward seat would be ideal. I like riders to be able to keep a light seat but within that light seat to have the balance and independence from the reins to be able to bring their shoulders back to influence the horse without necessarily sitting down in the saddle, in order to do this the stirrups need to be sufficiently short and the lower leg secure.

 

[Red-1]

I would teach my horse to adjust his stride according to my position. So forward seat for acceleration, light seat (mid way) to maintain the pace and shoulders up to bring the canter back to a coffin (or more contained) canter.

If you can control the pace within the canter with position first, reins second, then the horse is less likely to throw the head up and lose focus on the fence.

I would practice various canters in a field, without fences, first.

 

[Ambers Echo]

Oh yes that does make sense in terms of terrain or combinations. But what about in the context of slowing the horse between fences? Lottie was more rideable out of a light seat where I moved the bit and used my knees (sort of) to steady her than when I was trying to sit back and engage my core to slow her. Maybe I need to be able to do both depending on context/ situation?

 

[Ambers Echo]

Cross posted with Red but I think that answers my question! Thanks x

 

[Red-1]

I love this video, the riders bridge the reins and stay forward. Not how I was taught at all, but they look fabulous to me. Stable and consistent.

 

[iknowmyvalue]

Oh yes that does make sense in terms of terrain or combinations. But what about in the context of slowing the horse between fences? Lottie was more rideable out of a light seat where I moved the bit and used my knees (sort of) to steady her than when I was trying to sit back and engage my core to slow her. Maybe I need to be able to do both depending on context/ situation?

I’ve found that on some horses they take sitting back as an aid to go faster. Think it’s usually related to a gap in education. Also if you’re sitting “back” and you get tense/nervous you can end up unintentionally driving them forwards more, whereas in a light seat you can’t do that.

Might not be the case for Lottie, but just my experience and how instructors have explained it to me.

 

[Red-1]

I’ve found that on some horses they take sitting back as an aid to go faster. Think it’s usually related to a gap in education. Also if you’re sitting “back” and you get tense/nervous you can end up unintentionally driving them forwards more, whereas in a light seat you can’t do that.

Might not be the case for Lottie, but just my experience and how instructors have explained it to me.

I do think that it needs teaching, in a large arena or field. Once taught though, it is a gift.

 

[ycbm]

To throw a spanner in the works. I did Novice BE on two horses in the same season. One would not jump consistently if my bum was in the saddle approaching the fence and the other would not jump consistently if it was.

If Lottie prefers one way of being ridden and you aren't planning to go 4* any time in the near future, I would personally stick with what she prefers.
.

 

[Lyle]

Jim woffard has some great articles on Practical Horsemanship that covers a lot about rider position. There is a great one about how applying the half halt for jumping, whilst taught on the flat in a traditional dressage manner, can be applied differently when jumping. Might be worth a read? I'm a light seat rider; I evented to 3* being quite happy to pop the water fences and drops in a forward seat. But you do need to be adaptable, for example, while schooling the youngster, it might need a more upright, defensive position the first few times into water. But after a few runs, I would soften and adapt the more light seat (because that's how I like mine to go).

 

[Ambers Echo]

Thanks Lyle I’ll have a look for that

 

[J&S]

Red-1: I was most amused to see all the riders in the film still had their hats on when they went "upstairs" to bed!

 

[Leandy]

I thought the sit back advice for CC was about safety and security for the rider over fixed fences. You are less likely to be pitched forward and out of the front or side door if something goes wrong if you sit back and because the fences are fixed and over varying terrain there is a higher likelihood of needing to sit back and slip the reins to stay in the plate. That isn't nearly such a risk SJ.

 

[LEC]

There are very few riders xc who can stay in forward seat and they are mostly men. Burto, Tim price and Boyd martin spring to mind. I think most riders xc will have a hybrid of plugging in when needed depending on fence profile and staying light when they can.