Possibly weird question...

Shantara

Shantara

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Sooooo...I've umm'd and ahhh'd about posting this, but what the heck, you guys might be able to give me the best answer.

I'm doing a fancy dress class with Ned (hopefully) and I'm going as a native american.

These are the 2 cheapest costumes I can find...but which one do I get? Shuddup, I know they're tarty!!

If someone can find me something under £16 which still looks cool, then be my guest :)

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j308/gothic180/13128564420.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j308/gothic180/13128544710.jpg
 
Nah said:
Sooooo...I've umm'd and ahhh'd about posting this, but what the heck, you guys might be able to give me the best answer.

I'm doing a fancy dress class with Ned (hopefully) and I'm going as a native american.

These are the 2 cheapest costumes I can find...but which one do I get? Shuddup, I know they're tarty!!

If someone can find me something under £16 which still looks cool, then be my guest :)

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j308/gothic180/13128564420.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j308/gothic180/13128544710.jpg
Click to expand...

I think the second one looks better. You're a braver person than I am. :eek::p But you're quite a lot younger than me. ;)
 
I'm not going to stop you, or jump on you here, but I would suggest having a quick google of cultural appropriation (there are a few very informative tumblrs, many run by Native people). I know it's not as bigger deal in the UK, but the overt sexualisation of Native culture is something a lot of people feel very strongly about.

Like I said though, it's your life, your decision, no judgement from me if you still want to dress this way.
 
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SwingHorse said:
I'm not going to stop you, or jump on you here, but I would suggest having a quick google of cultural appropriation (there are a few very informative tumblrs, many run by Native people). I know it's not as bigger deal in the UK, but the overt sexualisation of Native culture is something a lot of people feel very strongly about.

Like I said though, it's your life, your decision, no judgement from me if you still want to dress this way.
Click to expand...


I don't particularly like over sexualisation of any nation/culture either (especially the whole 'Japanese school girl' thing...weird) but sadly, these two are pretty much the only 2 in my price range :( I was going to try and go with Mulan at first (but I look more Native American than I do Chinese lol!) and then I was going to try Jasmine from Aladdin, but same problem. I then perhaps thought Military like War Horse, but since I've always wanted to paint a horse like the Natives do, I figured I should go with that.
I think I might try and find some leggins to make it a bit more appropriate. I don't like looking like a tart :P
That said, looks like the 2nd one it is!!
 
I think the 2nd original one, if it's a male judge you'll be a dead cert! ;-)

And I doubt there'll be many real native Americans there to take offence....
 
Feathered said:
And I doubt there'll be many real Native Americans there to take offence....
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Doesn't mean it isn't wrong. You wouldn't dress up in black face because you may not see any black people :confused:
Also, the word costume is indicative. Race is not a costume, especially not a race the was persecuted and massacred as a consequence of it.
 
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SwingHorse said:
Doesn't mean it isn't wrong. You wouldn't dress up in black face because you may not see any black people :confused:
Click to expand...

Goodness, I don't think anyone is talking about 'blacking up' here :O
I don't think it's wrong to wear clothes from other nations. I own Chinese dresses, African stuff and a few Indian style things too. I'm not making fun of other cultures, I just really like them. I would be so upset if someone thought I was making fun :(
Also, I do know a real Native American, she lives in the US and she thinks it's a cool idea!
 
SwingHorse said:
I'm not going to stop you, or jump on you here, but I would suggest having a quick google of cultural appropriation (there are a few very informative tumblrs, many run by Native people). I know it's not as bigger deal in the UK, but the overt sexualisation of Native culture is something a lot of people feel very strongly about.

Like I said though, it's your life, your decision, no judgement from me if you still want to dress this way.
Click to expand...

SwingHorse, well done, I've worked with the Navaho in Arizona, wonderful people, huge problems thanks to the 'White' culture.
 
lets not get into a massive "culture " discussion. Its a horsey local show fancy dress for goodness sake. Before anyone starts shouting I am part Oglala Lakota [ from the "Salford Sioux" Google it for more info].
OP choose your costume and have a fun day. Thats what life's about. Enjoy.
 
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Horsesforever1 said:
lets not get into a massive "culture " discussion. Its a horsey local show fancy dress for goodness sake. Before anyone starts shouting I am part Oglala Lakota [ from the "Salford Soiux" Google it for more info].
OP choose your costume and have a fun day. Thats what life's about. Enjoy.
Click to expand...

Thank you *hugs* It's utterly ruined my day and my spirit for entering the show. I was having fun making feather things to put in Neds mane, but I wish I had never posted this now. Obviously this forum wasn't the best place to ask :( I hate to think I'm going to be labelled as racist!
 
Nah said:
Thank you *hugs* It's utterly ruined my day and my spirit for entering the show. I was having fun making feather things to put in Neds mane, but I wish I had never posted this now. Obviously this forum wasn't the best place to ask :( I hate to think I'm going to be labelled as racist!
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As I've said in the PMs it wasn't my intention to upset you, but this is a problem that many people are ignorant of, which as someone who is white but who has a Mexican husband and a daughter that looks Mexican is something I've had to witness.
If you want to dress as a NA, go for it. I just think people should be aware that what they think of as innocent (whether due to being British and not knowing a lot of what happen to Natives, or because they don't see it as a big deal) can be construed as in poor taste.
I am sorry if my comments have upset anyone else too, but like I say, it's a very big issue in modern society.
 
Nah said:
Thank you *hugs* It's utterly ruined my day and my spirit for entering the show. I was having fun making feather things to put in Neds mane, but I wish I had never posted this now. Obviously this forum wasn't the best place to ask :( I hate to think I'm going to be labelled as racist!
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Don't worry, I don't think anyone here thinks you're racist!
You get sexy/fancy dress nurses outfits, does that mean I should be offended because my job as a nurse isn't reflected properly in that?!

Have fun at the show, Nah, and get lots of pics! :D
 
"My people" get the same treatment too... http://www.measureformeasure.co.uk/...7B19C0-D05C-4EDF-BDFB-3FC10B5DDEDB}_20358.jpg
http://images.joke.co.uk/images/webshop/medium/62700.jpg

Just because I don't have the accent and don't live there, doesn't mean I'm not proud of my fab Scottish bloodlines.

Had I thought about it sooner (and not sunk a bit of cash into my NA costume already) I would have gone as the first Leslie, Bartolf, who saved the Queen from drowning. Though, I doubt I'd get placed, I'm sure no one knows who he was.
 
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Nah said:
Thank you *hugs* It's utterly ruined my day and my spirit for entering the show. I was having fun making feather things to put in Neds mane, but I wish I had never posted this now. Obviously this forum wasn't the best place to ask :( I hate to think I'm going to be labelled as racist!
Click to expand...

Don't be silly, and I'm sure the other poster meant no real offence. I would definitely pick one of the three other outfits though!!! Good luck in your class and don't forget the head dress :)
 
FGS it's a fun fancy dress.. The world has gone PC mad, people will take offence at anything on anyone's behalf & personally I think we all need to lighten up
 
Nah said:
"My people" get the same treatment too... http://www.measureformeasure.co.uk/...7B19C0-D05C-4EDF-BDFB-3FC10B5DDEDB}_20358.jpg
http://images.joke.co.uk/images/webshop/medium/62700.jpg

Just because I don't have the accent and don't live there, doesn't mean I'm not proud of my fab Scottish bloodlines.

Had I thought about it sooner (and not sunk a bit of cash into my NA costume already) I would have gone as the first Leslie, Bartolf, who saved the Queen from drowning. Though, I doubt I'd get placed, I'm sure no one knows who he was.
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You beat me to it :D, and i for one would never say you were being racist, go and have fun, ooh and lots of pics please :) i do like to see Ned
 
Been drawn to this through Soapbox - I have a friend who was raised Navajo (she is Lakota-Kiowa-Apache-Sioux through birth) who is very itchy about this sort of thing and objects to people who use terms like 'warpath' and 'war paint' and such as she sees those things as sacred to her culture.
I have another friend who is Yaqui (and in a very high position in his tribe) and he often dresses in 'Indian' fancy dress with a fake tomahawk etc to make a laugh of it.

While I see no real harm, we do need to bear in mind that Indian/Aboriginal/First Nations people are real, they exist, not just in history books and do not all live behind fences or on the res as some sort of tourist attraction.

Hope you have a good time Nah and it would be nice if you could do some reading up and make it as authentic as possible - have you seen some of the pics by Edward Curtis? The could give you some great inspiration :)
 
At school we studied the 'American West' for my GCSE, I found it all fascinating- definitely worth doing a bit of research- will be very impressive at the show if you can explain what the painted markings on the horse are for (I remember a circle round the eye is for better vision, but I can't remember the rest).
And remember to have fun, thats what little, local fancy dress shows are all about :)
 
CaveCanem said:
Been drawn to this through Soapbox - I have a friend who was raised Navajo (she is Lakota-Kiowa-Apache-Sioux through birth) who is very itchy about this sort of thing and objects to people who use terms like 'warpath' and 'war paint' and such as she sees those things as sacred to her culture.
I have another friend who is Yaqui (and in a very high position in his tribe) and he often dresses in 'Indian' fancy dress with a fake tomahawk etc to make a laugh of it.

While I see no real harm, we do need to bear in mind that Indian/Aboriginal/First Nations people are real, they exist, not just in history books and do not all live behind fences or on the res as some sort of tourist attraction.

Hope you have a good time Nah and it would be nice if you could do some reading up and make it as authentic as possible - have you seen some of the pics by Edward Curtis? The could give you some great inspiration :)
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No way! I have a Navajo bareback pad :) I'm sure it's just a brand name and not really connected, but I didn't realise it was a tribe!
I held a contest to design Ned's markings and the person who won did a great job and found all the meanings of the different markings, which I thought was pretty cool. While I can't do much about the actual costume (very very limited budget) I am trying my hardest with this :)
Just had a look at Edward Curtis's pictures and they're fantastic! I love photos like that.

I like to be respectful, but I believe people should be able to have fun :) Like your Yaqui friend. If I got upset every time I saw someone with a kilt or a silly hat with ginger hair, or when TV shows took the mick, or when I heard someone say "You're Scottish and you don't eat Haggis?!" I'd never get anything done :P
 
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