Potential sarcoid at vetting

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Hi guys some advice please if you will. I'm looking to purchase a really nice 6 year old boy who appears to suit me down to the ground for local stuff riding club etc. The hitch is at the pp vetting today the vet identified a potential sarcoid near his sheath. It's the size of a 20pp and has a small blood spot on top. Vet said this could be a bite , tick or sarcoid. He said that it's not in a location where it would cause a failed vetting but that I needed to be aware of the potential implications if it is one.

At this point I've paused the rest of the vetting so we can monitor the lump and check again in two weeks to see if it is a bite. Obviously my risk is that the seller will within her rights find another buyer in the interim , and I suppose that it could still be a bite and look the same in 2 weeks.

In the interim I'm interested in views and experiences please re: if folk would still proceed and if so any thoughts on % impact on purchase price if it is a sarcoid. I dont want to be too explicit on details as I dont want to identify the seller who would not reasonably have picked this up - I think it was just a good spot by the vet. Also he is soooo cute you may all run off with him.

Thanks Shivvy
 
Avoid like the plague! Plenty of horses without sarcoids out there. I nearly bought a lovely cob with sarcoids I was told had been treated and were gone, it rarely happens, although very small they were still very much in evidence ( and bleeding) . My vet advised only buy a horse with sarcoids if you are willing to keep dipping your hand in your pocket. what you can see on the outside - there may be more on the inside. That said a friend has a sarcoidy boy on loan. She said herself he is perfect BUT she will not part with any money as the future is uncertain. Sorry if I appear negative, but people who want the truth deserve an honest answer :)
 
I'm also looking for a horse and am in a similar position.

I've found a lovely horse and have been to see her three times and was going to buy her if I was still happy on the third visit! But during this third visit, I noticed that in trot she holds her tail to the left and dips her left hip slightly. My vet told me that it could be nothing, she might always have done it or she could have slipped in the field and sprained a muscle. On the other hand, it could be a musculo skeletal defect waiting to jump up and bite me in the bank account later on.

So I'm waiting two weeks to see if there is any improvement and there is definitely another purchaser going to see my horse tomorrow so I might lose her. But, as my vet also said, there are plenty of healthy horses out there, so why take the risk of buying her before the other potential purchaser sees her, and possibly have a very expensive problem later on?
 
I brought my show horse as a yearling and he got a sarcoid inside his back leg when he was two. He's never had another one since and my vet wasn't that worried about it.
The only thing you can do is wait and hope she doesn't sell to someone else. There are a lot of people that don't have vettings done so someone else may not even find out about it.
 
My boy has had sarcoids in the past, he has had two. Both were no bigger than my little fingernail, one dropped off on it's own accord and the other fell off after one treatment of Xterra cream.
In my experience if you catch them early enough then they are quite easy to get rid of, however I am by no means a sarcoid expert I am merely describing my own experience with my pony's sarcoids.
I don't think that sarcoids are too bad, so long as they are caught early! However the problem can arise when they develop in a really inconvenient place, I knew one horse with one the size of a golf ball which was in her inner back thighs and she kept rubbing and damaging it, causing her owner no end of problems!
However, it is also worth bearing in mind that not all sarcoids reappear, a horse can have one sarcoid and never have another, then again another horse can have 10 or 20 sarcoids!
I'd talk to the vet and see what they suggest, just ask them "If you were buying the horse, what would you do?"
Always gets me honest answers! :D
 
Thanks I did ask him and he said its something I would have to think long and hard about - which I am. The whole package is great and I could be lucky but on the otherhand ....
 
SNORKEY said:
I brought my show horse as a yearling and he got a sarcoid inside his back leg when he was two. He's never had another one since and my vet wasn't that worried about it.
The only thing you can do is wait and hope she doesn't sell to someone else. There are a lot of people that don't have vettings done so someone else may not even find out about it.
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Agree Snorkey that some folk dont vet even at market price. My feel is that if I had a horse that developed a condition then I would be more philisophical but knowingly buying feels scary.
 
My mare developed a sarcoid on her belly shortly after I got her at 5 years old. It was successfully removed. She is now 19 years and never got another one.
 
I was in a similar situation six years ago when the vet thought a lump could be a potential developing sarcoid but went ahead with the purchase as I really liked the horse. I asked him to finish the vetting and if anything else came up, I would have walked away. I personally wasn't convinced it looked like a sarcoid and thought the vet (not my own vet due to distances involved) was just being over cautious. It is worth discussing with the seller and how much they would reduce the price as you will be taking a risk and it means that the insurance company will exclude sarcoids and other skin diseases/cancers on your policy.

I still have my lad six years later with no issues with other lumps etc so far and had a lot of fun with him.
 
It's one thing a horse getting a sarcoid once you already own it and another buying one with possible sarcoid flagged on the vetting (as will be excluded from insurance).
 
Just be aware that the vet will note it on his report so any insurance you take out will exclude sarcoids. My boy has had his removed twice, surgically and laser and is going in again next week for more laser, this will be the last time on my insurance and without my insurance i'd have been looking at about a 4 grand bill in 12 months.

Had my vet been able to give me the same findings i'm not sure i would of bought him but he is perfect in every other way, would have hated to have to make that decision when i bought him.
 
Follychoppins said:
Avoid like the plague! Plenty of horses without sarcoids out there. I nearly bought a lovely cob with sarcoids I was told had been treated and were gone, it rarely happens, although very small they were still very much in evidence ( and bleeding) . My vet advised only buy a horse with sarcoids if you are willing to keep dipping your hand in your pocket. what you can see on the outside - there may be more on the inside. That said a friend has a sarcoidy boy on loan. She said herself he is perfect BUT she will not part with any money as the future is uncertain. Sorry if I appear negative, but people who want the truth deserve an honest answer :)
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funny that, it is a potential sarcoid to be reassessed, carl hesters yard has lots of horses with sarcoids, doesn't pose a problem for him. Although I do appreciate what you are saying, sarcoids can be bleeding awful things, and I am sure that carls yard has a lot more money to be able to afford such treatment. If it was your good old floating lump, I would say, lop it off with a rubber band and buy as these are non malignant and i have never known a horse develop a second one, however, if it does prove to be a sarcoid, with its description I would proceed with relevant caution
 
jnhuk said:
I was in a similar situation six years ago when the vet thought a lump could be a potential developing sarcoid but went ahead with the purchase as I really liked the horse. I asked him to finish the vetting and if anything else came up, I would have walked away. I personally wasn't convinced it looked like a sarcoid and thought the vet (not my own vet due to distances involved) was just being over cautious. It is worth discussing with the seller and how much they would reduce the price as you will be taking a risk and it means that the insurance company will exclude sarcoids and other skin diseases/cancers on your policy.

I still have my lad six years later with no issues with other lumps etc so far and had a lot of fun with him.
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I would also add that this horse made me smile as soon as I started to ride him unlike the other horses that I had tried. They could all have done the job but I just felt this horse was special to me right from the start.

It is a risk as other posters have pointed out and there is always a lot of things to go wrong with horses so you always want to start with a healthy sound one! I took the risk and not regretted but my experience is no guarantee of what would happen to you

piebaldsparkle said:
It's one thing a horse getting a sarcoid once you already own it and another buying one with possible sarcoid flagged on the vetting (as will be excluded from insurance).
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This is the major thing that you must consider carefully.
 
Having had a horse with sarcoids which had to be removed by laser surgery, I wouldnt buy it. My boy had two - one the size of half a petit pois near his girth area and the other the size of a 20p coin near his sheath. They were lasered off and he had 4 months off work for them to heal. It cost about £2,000.

I wouldnt have bought one with sarcoids, but he developed his and they sort of just sprung up overnight - I didnt even notice the one near his girth area - the surgeon went over him and found it.

As someone else has already said, there are plenty of horses out there that are fit and healthy. Unless the horse was super talented or something really special about them, I wouldnt bother. It gets a bit desperate when you feel like you have been looking ages, but the right one is out there.
 
Thanks all this is really helpful. I think for me the issue would be the potential to knowingly buy a sarcoid problem as opposed to having a horse that developes one. I'm sure in two weeks time it's not going to be conclusive so it would be a risk - or he will be gone I did click with the boy and he is great but it would be quite selfish of me to buy him knowing I'd have no insurance cover at those sort of treatment prices. I wouldn't do that to hubby he already thinks horses eat £50 notes but is happy when I'm happy!

In any case strangely I've heard nothing from the dealer who was out yesterday - I called twice. Not sure if that is indicative or not but in the absence of other info it's making me think.
 
Shivvy,

We could see that our Cob Billy had had Sarcoids surgically removed when we went to see him two years ago, but that fact did not stop us from putting a deposit on him on the spot. We have not regretted that decision.

He has had several Sarcoids re-occur which have been treated. We would not change our decision in getting him for the world (well I did wonder for a short while when he trod on my foot :eek: ).

My advice is to ask from yourself what you want from a horse and if this boy will deliver it for you. Sarcoids can be treated and if it's just the one, should be fairly easy. Ask your vet about Xterra cream. It worked for Bill. Thanks to Sarah, our Vet for promoting it's use. Only cost about £40 a pot, plus the Vets call out charge.

Keith :cool:
 
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Thanks Keith I'm glad your boy has worked out so well even if he squashed your foot :D. At the moment my head is telling me not to proceed unless 100% healed at further inspection. He is an expensive horse and it would be selfish to take advantage of hubbys goodwill.
 
The pony I ride has sarcoids and when I first saw him he had a huge one above his eye, luckily it fell off on it's own accord and we are just watching it closely incase it grows back. He also has one on his sheath but it hasn't grown and if anything it seems to be getting smaller.
I think as long as you are prepared to treat him if he had any more appear, and you weren't planning on doing a lot of showing with him then go for it. There's no such thing as a perfect horse, you just have to love them for what they are. Sarcoids included ;)
 
Shivvy hun

you are in exact same place I was a few weeks ago. Tried loads of horses, didn't feel safe on many and none made me really smile

Then I found Emil, he is perfect. At the vetting my vet, who is a well known equine vet said he has a small cluster around the sheath BUT he rarely vets a horse without signs of them.. He actually said if you don't buy him, I will. So I did.

In all other situations where a vet might find 'something' I would walk away, but not for a possible sarcoid
Also remember it might be nothing, but because it is a blemish vet has to say possible sarcoid
 
If the vet notes on vetting that there is a sarcoid, it will be excluded.

It depends one where they are and what type they are with respect to treatment. All of the creams essentially burn them off, so couldn't be used on my boy as his was on the front of his sheath; as soon as he went to pee, his "personality" would have touched the cream and in the words of my vet "that would not be nice". So it was lasered off - £2k.
 
Two of my last four horses have had sarcoid issues. My husband's gelding had two when we bought him - one of which were on his sheath. They weren't as big as a 20p though, more like wart size. We have never had any issues with them. Our vet recommended a lotion made of tea tree oil and lemongrass, which we put on them, and one fell off! It is excluded from his insurance. We've had him four years now without a single issue with them.

The first horse that had them had one lump on her elbow, which grew and started to weep/bleed. That was removed by the vet. Now I seem to have had a cheap bill compared to others on here, it was about £150. For the following two years that we owned her we had no further incidents. She wasn't insured for vets bills anyway.

A sarcoid on the sheath is not that bad, but the fact that it has a blood spot on it suggests that it is active and more worrying..

My final point - we would still buy both of our horses that had sarcoids.
 
Thanks all I think it's the insurance that is my stumbling point and the fact that the excellent Prof Knottenbelt site had pictures that frightened me to death in case it was in that league.

Thanks again will keep you posted if I progress matters.:)
 
Shivvy said:
Thanks Soulfull are sacoids excluded now on your insurance because that is a big factor for me that and any future upset to the animal?
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Yes they are BUT my vet said they are much easier and cheaper to treat nowadays, and of course it is an 'if' they even ever need treating.

In all honesty if you had asked me this BEFORE I went looking, and found Emil I would most likely have said walk away there are plenty more. Sadly having to look for a horse twice in the last 3 years I have realised that for me at least it is hard to find a horse that really makes me feel safe and ticks all the boxes. As my vet wasn't worried neither was I.
 
A month ago I went to see a mare and I noticed that she had a couple of very small lumps above her eye. I mentioned them and the dealer told me that she had banged her head in a low stable. I asked the vet to check them out on vetting and he advised that they were not sarcoids but he was 70% certain that they would turn into them!

I took 24 hours to decide to buy her - yes it was a risk but she is absolutely gorgeous. 4 weeks later, the scabs have healed and dropped off and the little lumps have haired over. There is still some slight thickening of the skin but I now believe that the dealer was telling the truth.

What can I say - if you really think the horse is worth it then go for it - it is near on impossible to get a vet to pass a horse these days so a bit of what they say has to be taken with a pinch. Lameness though, never ever ever buy a horse with lameness issues!
 
I wouldn't, I bought a horse with a tiny sarcoid on the outside of his ear, 6 months later it was huge and since then he has had loads appear on his sheath, thighs and armpits. You have to realise that it won't be just one sarcoid there will be more within time.

Could you not get the vet to send some photos to prof knottenbelt and see what he has to say, I don't think he charges to look at the photos. At least then you would know if it is a sarcoid and what possible treatments you could look into. When my vet sent the photo of my boys ear prof knot said that he didn't believe that it would be possible to treat his sarcoid successfully and that the cosmetic results would be hideous. So he may be able to tell you how successful he thinks your treatment would be.

It was a constant worry to me, my boy having them. I would be looking all the time for any new
Sarcoids and it was a constant battle trying to keep the flies off them.
 
My loan horse has sarcoids. He has a huge one on his armpit which I asked my vet about and he said unless it starts to impact on him to leave it alone as its not causing him any problems. He also has a couple on his sheath, again not a concern.
 
Dear OP
We sold a young 4 year old many years ago after he had had sarcoids on his sheath treated. He stayed with that same owner for another 20 years, and they never had another sarcoid appear on him. they told me, they were always so grateful they had bought him as he was "the best horse they had ever had". Good Luck with what you decide.
 
I bought my boy back in January, I had a 5 stage vetting and he came up with sarcoids around his sheath, it was gutting as I could see so much potential. I said I have to think about it, was looking on line at what you can do and how to deal with sarcoids etc.

He was 6 and would jump anything without hesitation, however needed slowing down; his flatwork was very rusty, could barely keep a straight line however I decided there was something there so I bought him. I did however say I would not pay the price I was going to and I wanted Liverpool treatment before I took him home. They agreed and he had the treatment and he came home with me.

He has been a star, he is a 16.1 Chestnut ISH, lovely looking and very clever, his flatwork is miles better and he is using him self when jumping now, he looks amazing. He is so well behaved, has not done anything naughty, when he spooks he jumps on the spot but nothing dangerous, doesnt buck, spin etc.Wh still have a way to go but we are looking to do 3 day eventing.

With regards to the sarcoids, only one dropped off with the liverpool treatment which is a pain but the vets are going to band after the summer and then put Exterra on. Where there is one sarcoid there is likely to be more however if you treat them early then you have a better chance. The biggest nodular one my boy has in marble size. The vet did say to me if a horse has sarcoids around their sheath they would not fail a vetting due to the location it is unlikely they would spread to the face etc. I would definatly reccommend a fly rug in summer, there is a lot of evidence to suggest that they carry the virus friom one part of the horse to another.

It is such a hard decision to make and if the horse passed the vetting in all other ways then it might just be a matter of asking for money off to treat the sarcoid, they are worth less with them.
 
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