Project Horse / Companion / Broodmare ?

[vonno]

Any suggestions as to what would be the best for a 3 year old filly?
She is a well bred reg'd appaloosa (with a long mane!) but when she moves has an inward fetlock deviation although she has always been sound. Also, she has bitten twice - we did later find out that she had problems with her teeth and was in pain, so is much sweeter though as she still can make faces needs an experienced handler.
On the plus side she is laid back, good to catch, load, farrier, dentist etc.
Someone has suggested I breed from her as neither of her parents have this problem, however I'm not sure I'm willing to take the risk.
Another option would to loan her for embryo transfer, but I don't know if she would be suitable as she hasn't been bred yet.
She could be used as a companion, but it seems a shame to give up on her at such a young age and I already have a 10 year old who injured himself as a foal and can't be ridden.
Anyone got any ideas or would a site like Project Horses be worth a go?
(Also posted in breeding)

 

[AmyMay]

Ooo would absolutely not be breeding from her. I'm afraid I would not pass her on either, and unless I had the room to keep her myself would quite probably have her pts.

Sorry, pretty negative......

 

[Faithkat]

Echo AmyMay - she certainly shouldn't be bred from with a known conformation fault nor would you want to pass on an "iffy" temperament. Again, long-term prognosis not good, I'm afraid, unless she's just going through a youngster-trying-it-on phase. How long have you had her?

 

[zigzag]

If she is sound, has the vet said she can't be ridden? she might make someone a hack...

 

[bellaM]

When considering a horse for breeding, you think about how it has proved itself in life, conformation and temperament. Doesn't sound like your mare would score highly on any of those!!! Sorry!!!
I would try redwings as a retirement home or keep her. There are so many stories nowadays of horses on loan as companions that have been ridden, sold on without the owners knowledge and lets not forget the amersham horses. I would maybe try the embryo transfer.

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
I would try redwings

[/ QUOTE ]
Why - that is not what they are there for? We have a duty as owners to make the best decision on behalf or our horses - not pass them on for someone else to do!

 

[bellaM]

Because I used to work there and I know that they take in horses like this!

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
Because I used to work there and I know that they take in horses like this!

[/ QUOTE ]

Which is hugely commendable of them - they are wonderful. However, this situation is not what this charity was set up to deal with imo. They are a rescue centre, not a retirement home........

[ QUOTE ]
Every year we provide a safe, secure home for rescued animals who, through no fault of their own, have fallen upon difficult times and are in great need of our help and care. Many suffer as the result of ignorance but others are the victims of deliberate neglect or cruelty. Whatever their story, we do everything within our power to help them.

[/ QUOTE ]

 

[u04elw2]

AmyMay, are you honestly saying that it is better to put a sound horse to sleep than to give it a chance at a place like Redwings??

Horse rescue charities are there to provide a home for horses that need to be rehomed, for whatever reason. They're not JUST there to take in horses that have been neglected or abandoned. Many people sign there animals over if they simply cannot take care of them any more.

vonno, I think she sounds like a spell as a companion with a friendly pony / ponies would do her some good. Provided she's sound and happy I see no reason to take such drastic action as has been suggested so far in this thread. A period just being a horse out in the field, either with you or someone else, might be good for her state of mind and maybe someone will want to buy or loan her once they get to know and love her.

Good luck whatever you do. I've had horses with issues that others would have given up on and I'm so glad I didn't listen to them.

 

[quirky]

I would not put to sleep, I think that is very drastic.

Maybe AmyMay was joking, I did see another reply of hers on a different thread that suggested the same thing. Lord help her horse if it goes lame ;-)

If it was me, I'd be tempted to advertise and see what turns up, you never know, she may not break down when broken.

 

[Skhosu]

I would not put her to sleep if she's sound. I would either find a light hack home (if she can be ridden), find a loan, vetted, companion home or your idea of embryo transfer sounds good. Definitely wouldn't breed from her.

 

[rach1984horse]

It May be worth having a chat with your vet re embryo transfers etc if that is the way you want to go, as he will be able to tell you all the ins & outs.

Have you discussed with your vet what the likely outcome for the future will be, eg could she be a hack, will she stay sound even as just a companion etc.

 

[burtie]

[ QUOTE ]
but when she moves has an inward fetlock deviation although she has always been sound.

[/ QUOTE ]

Have the vets suggested that she won't stand up to any work? If so then I'm afraid I would also have ner PTS if I could not keep her in retiremet myself.
If however she was capable of work then I would start gentle long reining her this year and then back her next and carry on building up her fitness gradually and see how it goes, with her problems I would try and avoid any lunging and too much school work.

The biting would not worry me, chances are she was just a youngster trying it on.

 

[Boodle]

I hope you can guarantee her a loving and permanent home, whether it is with you or someone who you know will care for her. I know there are many people out there who would. *raises hand*.

I think you should definitely be sure that she can never be ridden before writing her off, as mentioned she may be suitable for a hack.

I hate to see an otherwise (aside from fetlock problem) sound and healthy horse put to sleep, just because they are not 'perfect'.

Good luck.

 

[seabiscuit]

'inward fetlock deviation'Do you mean that she simply dishes? That is no big deal..

 

[vonno]

Thanks for all your replies. At the moment I have some extra land, so keeping her this year is certainly not a problem. Maybe I will try some work with her. Soundness is not a problem now, but don't know if long term she will stand up to it (Ouija Board, it is like an inward dish but quite pronounced). I bred her myself but wouldn't sell her because of these issues, if she was to go to another home it would be on a loan basis.
I think the temperament is perhaps even habit now - she is not biting, just pinning her ears, so I stand next to her until they are forward again. As I mentioned she was in pain with her teeth, but this has been sorted and the dentist checks her regularly which she is fine with. (It was the farrier she bit both times! and he's been doing her since she was a baby).
Anyway, will def not breed from her, - I haven't bred the dam since either beacuse of it, so really don't know why I even considered it when it was suggested to me. Think I was just at a loss as what to do with her.
I won't be putting her to sleep as she is fit, healthy and happy - currently out with other horses 24/7.
Looks like I may just end up with another babysitter!

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
AmyMay, are you honestly saying that it is better to put a sound horse to sleep than to give it a chance at a place like Redwings??

Horse rescue charities are there to provide a home for horses that need to be rehomed, for whatever reason. They're not JUST there to take in horses that have been neglected or abandoned. Many people sign there animals over if they simply cannot take care of them any more.

[/ QUOTE ]

What I am saying is that places like Redwings were not set up to take horses from people who are looking to re-home them because they are no longer wanted or are surplus to requirements.

No where in the original post did the OP say that she was unable to look after this little horse - therefore she can either a)afford to keep it, or b) find a suitable home for it as a companion etc.

And to the silly little girl who said 'Lord help her horse if it goes lame' grow up! You presumably have no conception of what can happen to horses of suspect soundness passed on because the owner no longer wants it. We have a moral responsibility to our horse to ensure the best outcome for them if a permanent lameness problem arises. That usually means retirement or euthanasia. I have had two horses put down because of long term lameness issues because they would never have recovered. Would you have preferred that I sold them to an uncertain future just because the idea of putting an otherwise healthy animal down leaves you a little uncomfortable???

The OP asked the forum what we would do with this filly - given that she has a limb deformity and possible behaviour issues. The OP told us that there was an inward deviation of the fetlock joint, which can be quite a serious defect, and the filly may never be up to any work - only ever paddock sound. However, as we don't know how severe the deviation is it may be nothing more than a slight inward dish - and the horse may go on to have a sound riding career. But how can you take the chance of passing it on with the uncertainty over it's head of soundness issues???? Where could it possibly end up? Another poor bugger hauled round the auction sites, ending up in the hands of people like Grey?

As owners we have a responsibility to our animals - and bottom line is if you can afford it financially you don't pass it on to a charity to take care of.

I hope this little horse has the most wonderful long life - but if she can't do that with the breeder, and she is unable to find a companion home for it then morally she should put it down.

Having read the OP's response to all of our posts however it would appear that she is very happy to have her at home, and so the filly's future is secure. Which is great.

 

[Rueysmum]

I bought my 13 year old gelding as a rising 3 year old with a shocking knee deviation and associated fetlock twist. His knee is so bandy now that he cannot be ridden any more but he has a home with me for life and is a much cossetted pet.

We had 6 years of ridden fun including hacking, dressage and low-level jumping, so you may not have to write your filly off just yet.

 

[quirky]

And to the silly little girl who said 'Lord help her horse if it goes lame' grow up!

Ooo hit a raw nerve did we AmyMay? And thank you, I'll take that statement as a compliment.

You persistently make flippant remarks in posts with seemingly no thought or regard ... maybe you just think controversial is clever. I don't happen to think it is, I think it shows a certain level of ignorance.

You presumably have no conception .. Umm conception, now isn't that what happens when an egg and sperm meet ..... what an earth has that got to do with lameness???????

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
And to the silly little girl who said 'Lord help her horse if it goes lame' grow up!

Ooo hit a raw nerve did we AmyMay?



You presumably have no conception .. Umm conception, now isn't that what happens when an egg and sperm meet ..... what an earth has that got to do with lameness???????

[/ QUOTE ]

We'll leave the grammer lesson for another time - but do look up the the word 'conception' in the dictionary to understand all it's meanings

As for hitting a raw nerve - then yes, or course you did. No one likes putting horses down - whatever the reason. And I have never done a harder thing in my life. I suspect you have never been faced with that dilema which is wonderful. Hopefully you never will - but it's a reality that few of us avoid.

As for flippant remarks - have you no sense of humour?????

 

[Daisychain]

There is a saying, if it aint broke, dont fix it! You bred her know all her history, it has obviously never caused her a problem... if she was mine i would break her in and carry on and not worry about it, she probably wont stand up to doing badminton but will be fine for a pleasure/allrounder horse. At the end of the day what have you got to lose, especially when the other options arnt paticularly nice. Just crack on with her and you could be suprised.

 

[quirky]

AmyMay .. I'll make this a last post to you on this matter.

Yes, I have had to put a pony down 4 years ago, I had owned him for 17 years from a 2 year old and I loved him like nothing else. I still cannot talk about him without a tear rising. I was pregnant at the time and the stress and worry caused me to have a very small baby. It's all well and good people telling you not to worry but until you have been in that situation, you cannot begin to imagine how painful it is.

If you have done the same, as you say you have, I am surprised that it is your stock reply to everything ... shoot it!

My sense of humour is fine ta very much, it is yours that I find a little brutal BUT the world would be a boring place if we all laughed at the same things.

Maybe one day I can laugh about the day I lost my beautiful pony like you can but I don't think it'll be in this lifetime.

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe one day I can laugh about the day I lost my beautiful pony like you can

[/ QUOTE ]
Where did I say I was laughing?????????

 

[quirky]

Sorry I've just had to put you on ignore ... look back at some of your flippant/rude/ignorant responses on posts and look at the emoticons that you use ... they look like laughing to me.

 

[amandaco2]

personally i wouldnt breed from her
or use ET on her if she has a dodgy temperment she could pass this attitude onto the foal.
prehaps sort out her behaviour issues and she could be a companion.?