Pros and cons of buying a youngster

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emfen1305

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Long story short, I am selling my cob, we are just not gelling and he will be much better suited to a competent teenager!! I am going to start looking for another one but seems if I want a safe, sane sensible show cob type between 5-10 with no issues I am looking at upwards of £5000 (and that is still cheap!) which is fine because they are worth their weight in gold but sadly the budget wont go that far. I have always wanted to buy something a bit younger so I can do the work myself and almost did last time until I found my cob but now I am really starting to consider my options. I am aware that youngsters are green and can need a lot of work but I have a good support network and a good instructor who is happy to help and whilst my confidence has been massively knocked, it is only with my current horse as have ridden others and been fine. A few friends have done it successfully and have lovely little horses now and I am happy to spend time doing all of the groundwork but just wondered what other's experiences are and if anyone knows of any dealers/people in the NW that deal with show cob types that would be worth speaking to. Just to clarify, by youngster I mean around 3 rather than really young. Thank you
 
It depends on why you are selling the other one. Saying he needs a competent teen makes it sound like you are over horsed?

My 5yr old is a dream 99.9999% of the time. Total novice ride, drives like shes been doing it for decades and is generally a sweet and loving pony who I am very, very lucky to own. Yesterday she threw her toys out of the pram. She didnt want to leave the yard for varying reasons and when I wouldnt let her turn back escalated it into a really dramatic display of airs above the ground. I know why it happened, and how to deal with it and I enjoy working with youngsters the good and the bad, but its not something everyone wants to or knows how to do.

My last pony was very established and I took him for granted a lot, with the current one I have to be on top of everything. Shes young and green and she needs me to drive properly and give her confidence. Gone are the days of bimbling about gossiping which I did quite enjoy. Now I have to make sure I am paying attention and giving her the support she needs while she learns her job. Again, its a sacrifice worth making and is balanced out by the pleasure I get from seeing her grow in confidence and skill, but some days it would be nice to take my eye off the ball for a bit!

Safe, sane, sensible horses are born like that to a certain degree but theres a hell of a lot of work between 3 and 7 to get them to be the finished article and it doesnt take much to ruin them in a lot of cases.
 
Sorry to sound negative but I think if you are suffering from lost confidence then a youngster is the last project you should be taking on. Safe, sane, sensible horses are generally not born but made through appropriate training. Which usually involves a tough patch or two along the way requiring a degree of confidence and persistence. Young horses need their riders to install confidence in them.
 
if you are not confident i fear that a youngster will not be the best idea. if you want safe and sensible why not look at something a little older who has been there and done it. it does depend on what size you need as big horses are more expensive but if you are happy with a 15 hand cob they are more reasonable and while looking for satans little helper i have seen some that would be suitable but she wants something about 16 hands....
 
Can your instructor not help you with the one you have?
Youngsters are green yes, but if you happen to buy one who lacks confidence themselves and looks to you, what happens then?

Pro and con, the problems are yours to sort out, the education is down to you, when they grow up all your hard work will have been worth it.
 
Thanks all, I did expect the responses and would probably advise the same! I am generally a confident rider and have always been but my current horse shoulder drops and spins (I’ve been told he also did this with the previous owner but she managed to get him out of it). I have been trying with help to get him out of it but there is too much water under the bridge now and just assume he is going to deck me when I get on and then create a self fulfilling prophecy. I’ve tried lots of different things but I am just not enjoying riding him anymore. My thought behind getting a younger one would be that it wouldn’t have developed habits through previous owners and I would work very closely with knowledgeable people around me if something did start to go wrong. I am very confident in ground work and long reining so that won’t be a problem. I don’t really want to consider an older one as looking for something long term and would prefer to start with a clean slate. Thanks all for the advice, I’ll have a look around but seem to struggle to find what I am looking for within budget..
 
I’m going to go against the grain a bit a day whilst in your position I might not actively look for a youngster, I wouldn’t rule one out if the right one came along. I’m not the most experienced/confident rider in the entire world but have a good support network around me.

I bought my horse at just over three and a half years old and apart from some teething issues like with any horse (but mostly undoing a bad backing process) we have gone from strength to strength and he really is super. We’ve hacked a ton, got out and about to clinics and lessons and whilst he is most definitely green, he has the most willing, generous attitude and even in his baby moments I have never felt uneasy or unsafe with him. He’s rising 5 now and we have a long way to go of course, but I’m loving the journey and progressing together. So in short, if you find a good one then I wouldn’t rule it out!
 
I've bred and bought a number of foals over the years. I have found that some are easy and some are not. They have been brought up in a very similar way but it is largely down to the individual horse rather than some-one else having 'mucked' them up. If you are buying an unbacked youngster you may end up with a horse that you don't particularly enjoy riding and might want to sell on but then you might also end up with a horse that you really like.

It might seem like a cheaper option but generally it isn't particularly if you have to pay for a lot of help. Very often with youngsters the price reflects that often used term 'potential' and there is no guarantee that they will ever realise it.
 
With a youngster, if you've got one that's been well backed and brought on, and has a nice temperament underlying it to boot, then it can be a very fulfilling experience.

OR it can be a total nightmare and you've just got a totally ruined horse that someone else has to sort out.............

When I was thirteen (and VERY much a novice) my parents bought a little 5yo pony for me. He had at that tender age, apparently been ridden by a disabled girl in a built up area, and had been fine. Everyone said "green on green" won't work. It did, it worked beautifully, he was a lovely safe little chappie and carried me safely for many years.

Roll on a good few years, and having failed to find anything remotely suitable in the "cobby-14hh'ish-safe and sane" range, on the recommendation of a friend (who'd backed the pony concerned) I broke all my own rules and went to look at this little youngster. She'd been lightly backed, and ridden on gently, but that was all.

To cut a long story short, I bought her! For the first few months I kept her at the yard where she'd been backed, to give us both confidence, and so there was always someone around if we needed help.

Since bringing her home, I've still had the benefit of professional help with her - this is VITAL - on an ongoing basis. My profile picture shows us both on Easter Monday, on our first Fun Ride with the local hunt!!

Contrast this with my other horse - 7yo - who basically has had her head totally f'd up by someone else's bad handling and horsemanship, and I'm having to do "remedial" with her............

Having said all this, I know that I've been lucky in that I found a cracking little mare with the right temperament, who'd been nicely backed by a friend (professional) who was able to help me. I have had to "raise my game" considerably, and yes there have been one or two issues, namely getting youngster used to the farrier - and finding enough pluck to go on a first Fun Ride!! Plus stuff like solo hacking and meeting tractors etc. You have just GOT to conquer your fears and go for it.

IF you can find one (not easy I know), I would suggest OP ask around for a reputable dealer in her area. Yes I've been lucky with my little girly, but I would go with others' advice re. avoiding a youngster for someone lacking confidence. A youngster will take their confidence from the rider, and what you don't want is to take on something which doesn't work out, and then you've got the problem of what to do with it. There are way too many horses on the market like this unfortunately.
 
The problem with youngsters is you never quite know what they wil become and what they might chuck at you and unless you can absolutely guarantee that you can do all the work yourself, they are not a cheap option in the long run. We've bought several youngsters (not for me) and they have all turned out well but goodness they have all had their moments and if handled badly they could have ended up as a problem. I was happy to bring in a professional I trusted to nip unwanted behaviours in the bud. None of these horses ended up as cheap but we didn't have to deal with ingrained behaviours or put right poor training but it is not a cheap way of getting the horse you want.
 
although i said not a good idea. i did it myself many years ago, i bought a 15 month old filly as my existing horse had lots of problems with men and it took me a long time to get him to accept male farriers, male vets or even a male groom, i decided that i would get something untouched and any faults would be mine. i was a confident rider then and did everything myself with the aid of books, not the best idea but i was lucky as she had an excellent temperament and by the time i backed her she trusted me and i had done lots of leading out in hand and long reining so she was used to traffic, dogs, kids, horses cantering away and back past us (my friend obliged) and she was always an easy horse to deal with, so it can work but confidence is very important for the person who is going to ride...
 
Think I will also upset the apple cart because I never buy anything over 2 and prefer weanlings or home bred. I find if someone else has had a hand in it the horse had different habits to the ones I want not all bad but different. So All mine have been home handled yes they are all different to ride but that was obvious right from the start. A kind well bred (as in raised well and with good conformation) youngster handled the way you want it brought up will always be your horse including any mistakes you make along the road
As to being a cheap way it is only the initial outlay that is cheaper by the time it gets to the age you might buy at it will have cost you a lot of money but not all in one go
 
Some more food for thought! Just to clarify I’m not looking for a youngster due to it being the cheap option, I’m fully prepared to spend the money on help if I need it and have plenty around me who have/are currently bringing on youngsters. I just want something that I can put my own stamp on rather than dealing with other people’s issues. I think I do need to go with a reputable person though, does anyone have any recommendations in the NW?
 
It is a bit hard as I don't know anyone deliberately breeding cob types apart from the obvious most of mine have been papered natives
 
I have had good experiences generally with youngsters. The easiest pony ever was pretty much unhandled (born and raised on the fells) Fell pony mare. She was calm, curious, confident and trusting. A Shetland from 18 months who was the twins LR/FR. She was angelic. Also an ISH from 3 (unbacked). Dolly from 4 but she was very well started by a pro. And my first pony was only 4. I was too clueless then to know that was a bad idea but he never put a foot wrong.

I think I was lucky in that they ALL had lovely temperaments. In my admittedly limited experience basic temperament does not change much. A nice 4 year old is a nice horse. As long as you don't actually screw them up!! And from what you have said, you have the experience and confidence not to do that. But maybe I have just been lucky.
 
Well I love youngsters, and without exception they are all incredibly rewarding in their own way. But....if you want something specific at the end of the process then it's probably not the best option. Particularly if you are specifically looking for a 'quiet' youngster, because it can be quite hard when you don't know them to tell if a youngster is calm because it is confident and unfazed by life, or because they are the type to internalize stuff. And a youngster that's chillaxed in a field that it's been in all its life won't necessarily be so emotionally resilient to loading or hacking in strange environments etc.

So yes, if you're prepared to just get completely immersed in the process, without putting too much pressure on you and the horse, and have the emotional resilience yourself to be able to step back and be objective when stuff doesn't go to plan, then it can be an amazing option. Only you know the answer to those things. Good luck, whatever you decide.

The other thing that's worth considering is looking for an established but somewhat scruffy looking cob, rather than something presented as a show cob. There can be some real diamond in the rough cobs to be found.
 
I just want something that I can put my own stamp on rather than dealing with other people’s issues. I think I do need to go with a reputable person though, does anyone have any recommendations in the NW?
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I always think that 'putting a stamp on it angle' is an interesting one. If you don't speak french very well, then you aren't going to put 'a stamp' on a child by teaching them bad french. You both might eventually bash out how to do a conversation between the two of you after a lot of time and effort and probably professional input. There can be pleasure and fun in enjoying that process and figuring it out, but you have to accept that that child could have had a better start by going to someone who is fluent in french and is a good teacher.

And even the nicest youngsters will still throw in a spin, buck or rear when they are testing limits and finding their feet. And most do go through a teenage phase at around 7. So hoping you get a quiet one just isn't enough. you have to either accept you need to cope with any stroppiness or else be ready to get a pro to get them over that period

I know some horses are born broken and just nice characters who acept a rider and are tolerant. But they srtill need to learn correct balance, how to use themselves, how to understand a contact and aids. And teaching that correctly is a skilled process, but doing it righ benefits the horse physically and mentally and gives them the best start. It can be SO hard at times when you get horses in that have been taught stuff incorrectly at the start.
 
I love youngsters and the only equine I have purchased over 6 in the past 25 years was my son's 1st pony.

I wouldn't advocate getting a youngster to gain one's confidence but I did and it was great. I had a 4yo when I was 15. After 4 yrs I ended up selling him, as due to a couple of accidents, I lost confidence with him.

I got a NF yearling as a companion for a schoolmaster that never materialised. The yearling became a great all rounder who turns 26 tomorrow. He gave me my confidence back and having built up a fabulous relationship on the ground, this was transferred to the saddle.

I guess it depends on the animal and how long you are prepared to be out of the saddle.
 
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I think it will be hard ,within your budget , to find a 'proper' show cob type. Its even harder finding them as youngsters! In the N W you have some well known show riders that may have contacts. I have certainly found the show world to be very helpful.
The horse in my profile picture came, as most of the young cobs do, from Ireland. We specifically wanted unbacked, as OH and myself prefer to back our own [ and BTW, have never our found horses to have a so called 'teenage phase'] but he was in fact older and backed. I have advertised for a coloured show cob and was nearly successful- but 2 failed the vet![ aged 5 and 8] It believe here is someone who tries to breed show cobs in Derbys- I say tries because they are hard to breed to type .
 
I think my issue with the 'we will just figure it out together' thing is that at the end of the day you have a young animal whose musculature and skeletal system is still forming. Being ridden hollow, unbalanced or falling around corners is physically damaging to them. Being ridden incorrectly, or with the wrong contact is sore, confusing and detrimental to them physically and mentally. Even simple stuff like a baby absolutely leaping over a ground pole at the start needs to be handled correctly. You don't need a rider getting a fright and scaring the horse further or catching it in the mouth, or unbalancing and scaring it. It;s really a case of stepping back and analysing what you can cope with and what you can teach the horse.
 
Going to go against the grain a bit. I'm not the most confident or the best rider, I'm on a very basic yard with fab hacking and that's what I like to do.

I've had two youngsters as my first proper horses after loaning and riding other people's for the past 10 years.
First youngster bought for £400 in 2016. 3.5 year Welsh x cob with a massive attitude and many issues due to being in horrible homes and passed around. I made the best of a bad situation and got her out hacking and riding beautifully within 6 months. She was wonderful to ride but a real handful on the ground and sadly lost her after 11 months due to a horrendous field accident.

I was convinced I didn't want another youngster, but ended up coming home with a rising 3 year old who was in horrible condition because I felt sorry for her and she cheap. Good food, wormer, grazing in a herd and some gentle handling I backed her myself and now have a wonderful 4.5 year old who is the quietest and most gentle pony I know. She hacks out alone and accompanies other babies out for their first hacks and we've just started lunging and schooling. She was a massive learning curve but my scraggy 13 hand gypsy cob is now 15 hands and chunky. She's spent this afternoon being groomed by friends kids who rode her around the paddock and she plodded around happily loving the attention.

A youngster wouldn't have been what anyone would have advised me to buy but luckily it went well and I've made a lovely horse out of something that has cost me very little. I buy youngsters because I can't afford to spend £3k outright on a horse. I'm prepared then to shoot or sell if the worst came to worst, but I'm very happy that I've been able to give a good home to a lovely horse who will be with me for life now.

Some horses don't work out, you don't know what you're going to end up with with a youngster and don't know if you'll gel as they grow up and go through their Kevin stages. But it is rewarding if you're willing to put the time and money in. If you can't dedicate yourself for whatever reason there are some great horses out there over 6/7
 
I’ve always had broken 4/5 yo’s in the past but have recently had 2 unbroken 3yo. They were both Irish and a bit scared, not well handled.

Both of them have always been angels to handle. I’ve had them professionally broken and they have both been such good girls to produce. I think I’ve been lucky! But I’ve still hit the deck, ive had massive wobbles about my ability etc etc. Rewarding but hard I would say. A bit like having kids!
 
As someone who bought a youngster without really understanding what I was getting into I would advise against for what you want. As LW said you really do have to be switched on all the time to make sure there's no naughty habits brewing, carefully thinking about ridden experiences to make sure it is all as positive as possible for both horse and rider, and instil confidence in them throughout their education.

While you obviously have to watch out for all of this with older horses as well, with a youngster it is your job to make sure they end up a productive member of society should anything happen and they need to be sold on. While really rewarding at times, it's a lot of pressure!
 
I really think the questions you need to ask yourself before taking on a youngster are
1) Am I 100% sure that I will have the ability and confidence to deal with every single situation in the way that will benefit the horse for the rest of his life? Even if my instructor is not there? You can't wait a week until the next lesson to fix an issue with a baby, it needs done then and there.
2) Am I happy to be the first person to do everything with the horse - take him out in company, hack, etc- and make that a positive experience in every way?
3) Can I spot the 'beginning' of something before it even happens and make the correct decision in an instant to send the horse on the correct path instead of allowing that bad thing to happen?
4) Do I want to spend every single moment I ride and manage the horse 'training' it. Because with a baby every day is a school day, there's no such thing as just going for a leisurely pootle about, no such thing as dragging them in from the field with a hangover and not ensuring that correct leading protocol is being followed, etc etc.

The reason that horses develop issues such as your current one had is because someone thought they could take on a youngster, and somewhere along the way a situation or two were not addressed appropriately and the horse learned a very effective evasion.
I'm not saying definitely don't do it, just be very very aware of what you are taking on.
 
great post sportsmansB
All that takes a lot of emotional energy at times too, constantly being switched on and coping with the moments of self doubt that you can't afford to have when faced with a big challenge from a horse that is entirely your problem to sort out, right this second o_O

the problem is that you don't know until you're way down the line, whether the one you choose is the super easy straightforward horse that you'll just love training, or whether it's got a tricky side that you then have to deal with day after day. Some people enjoy that process (I do, but I still find it can be quite draining on a difficult day) and some people don't :)
 
I love taking on youngsters and "projects". As a result, I have seen what happens when someone tries to 'put their stamp' on a youngster, but doesn't have the experience or temperament for it. The horse quickly learns unwelcome tricks like napping, snacking, barging, and even nipping and kicking, and if your aren't happy sorting out your current horse's problems, what makes you think you will be able to nip them in the bud in a youngster? (sorry if that sounds mean, I don't mean it to be).

My current ride is a lovely 15hh welsh cob. Once, he would have been a kind, quiet £5k youngster... he's been with me as a FTGH from aged 6 because he learnt how big and strong he is from an inexperienced owner. He's just coming right after 18 months of dealing with kicking, barging, shying, napping and fly-bucking.

PS. I think your budget will get something nice and well established unless you insist on a showing record (which a youngster won't have anyway).
 
sportsmansB said:
I really think the questions you need to ask yourself before taking on a youngster are
1) Am I 100% sure that I will have the ability and confidence to deal with every single situation in the way that will benefit the horse for the rest of his life? Even if my instructor is not there? You can't wait a week until the next lesson to fix an issue with a baby, it needs done then and there.
2) Am I happy to be the first person to do everything with the horse - take him out in company, hack, etc- and make that a positive experience in every way?
3) Can I spot the 'beginning' of something before it even happens and make the correct decision in an instant to send the horse on the correct path instead of allowing that bad thing to happen?
4) Do I want to spend every single moment I ride and manage the horse 'training' it. Because with a baby every day is a school day, there's no such thing as just going for a leisurely pootle about, no such thing as dragging them in from the field with a hangover and not ensuring that correct leading protocol is being followed, etc etc.

The reason that horses develop issues such as your current one had is because someone thought they could take on a youngster, and somewhere along the way a situation or two were not addressed appropriately and the horse learned a very effective evasion.
I'm not saying definitely don't do it, just be very very aware of what you are taking on.
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Brilliant post.
 
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