Protein-related Lymphangitis

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ChezandRisk

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Hi,
I'm new, so apologies if this has been covered already / if I post incorrectly.
I have a 17 y.o. TB gelding whom I keep at home. I feed him haylage (lovely quality, has been on it for 4 years with no problems) and have been feeding calm and condition during the summer. He hates it as it's particularly unappealing to his palate, often leaves it.
As the winter approaches, I have gradually changed his feed to try to help him keep his weight. I changed to the Bailey's Topline 17 mix, and was feeding in the usual weights. He loved it as it was a typical flake / mix feed.
Suddenly, he developed Lymphangitis (apologies for the spelling), and he's had to have a course of antibiotics. My vet told me this is protein related, yet when I look this up on the internet everything tells me this is a fallacy.
Well, he's back on the C&C now, and is not really enthusiastic about his food at all; he is getting to be very fussy.
I know the problem is not that he's not eating it's because he's not hungry, or that the haylage is enough; he's a 17.2 TB who needs hard feed to get him through the winter and has always tolerated it before.
What can I do? Is the protein thing a myth? What can I feed him that is vaguely mix-like that won't make him look like the Elephant man?

Thanks in advance,
ChezandRisk.
 
Hi

My horse is very prone to lymphangitis (now excluded on insurance), and i find if he gets the smallest cut, nick or anything this is enough to trigger it, it can be a case of him even getting sweaty under his boots!!! def not anything to do with what he eats and he is on conditioning feed too

I would contact the feed comapnies and see what they recommend as there is no point feeding him something he wont eat (i do have to say i would not eat c & c), and loosing weight, i hope you sort this
grin.gif
 
Wow! Someone replied! Thank you so much :-)
I think I will try the feed companies, I just wonder if they are likely to tell me a totally different tale...so far I can't make my mind up WHAT to think.
Had horses 25 years, always looked after them myself, and have never felt so totally ignorant about something.
 
I have recently had a yearling with this in all 4 legs for no apparent reason whatsoever, it came up very quickly overnight and like yours had anti b's
I have no idea what brought it on, she had a tiny nick on one leg but for it to flare up so quickly in all 4 is a mystery to me.
She hasnt had it since.(Touch wood!)

My vet said it was quite possibly a reaction to something she had eaten and I had moved them onto some new grazing that we don't usually use so it could have been that?

The only other time I have known it is in a mare that had surgery on an annular ligament and got it then but only in the one leg and it was almost to be expected the vets said.


"Nailed" a HHO member on here is the expert on it and she was most helpful bless her when I had this problem.
 
The problem with lymphangitis is that once it's happened once it can happen again and again. My understanding is that damaged vessels and valves in the limbs are unable to return the fluids back towards the heart. Swelling occurs which can then cause further damage. Not sure about the link with protein intake. A friend has a horse who gets bouts of lymphangitis for apparently no reason at all and he is always immediately prescribed antibiotics. Why prescribe antibx if it's protein related? Antibx are to fight a bacterial infection. Strange.

On the feed front, have you tried the apple juice trick? Couple of cartons of Tescos best El Cheapo apple juice - mix neds feed as normal - after thoroughly mixed slop in a good cupful of apple juice but don't stir it so the concentrated smell wafts up to ned's nose and he can't resist it. I've had a 99% success rate with this.
 
Thank you so much, all three of you.
I quite agree Box_of_Frogs, why prescribe anti-biotics if it's a feed related issue. I normally trust my vet 100% but this has thrown me a little. She did reassure me though that there was minimal damage to his vessles and valves as i called her the second he started to swell. (Being a TB you can spot it straightaway due to his stick-legs).
Lord knows. I have submitted an enquiry to the feed manufactureres to see what they think about what to feed him.
Thank you all again so much for your time spent helping me with this.
 
I think you will find that the antibiotics are to prevent a secondary infection in the leg . The swelling and poor circulation leave it prone to a range of potentally deadly bacterial infections.Trust your vet.
 
I think it is true that protein can cause filled legs, but lymphangitis causes legs of elephantine proportions and it is incredibly painful. My mare has a thickened back leg from previous bouts, and has had it twice in the 15 years I've had her, only affecting that leg. The scarring makes the lymphatic system less efficient, and even the tiniest graze can introduce infection that the drainage system then can't clear. You may not even find the entry point.
 
My older horse has suffered from this twice now - both times when on less feed than normal and vet advised me the protein link is a myth and most likely to be a small nick/cut/rub that has allowed bacteria in

They are more prone to it once the vessels have been damaged, my lad still fills overnight on the one affected leg (same leg both times but cuts in different places) and I have a bottle of Baytril at home to start as soon as it looks like he is flairng up with it - touch wood he hasn't since I've had the antibio's at home
 
You may or may not have already seen this one.

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/horse-care-index/1370/44740.html

I find protein can be a bit funny, my tb gets alfabeet to keep her weight on as it doesn't fizz her up and keeps her ribs covered, however she will usually break out in lumps as an allergic reaction to the protein. These go after a couple of days and its quite random when they turn up.

I would definitly recommend talking to feed companies starting with Baileys as I have known them on more than one occasion recommend other companies feeds- thats who recommended the alfabeet and it does work. If he is as fussy as you say ask them for samples of whatever they recommend to chech if he likes them. Mine is fussy so I always ask for a sample before I shell out for a whole bag.
 
also dont despair, my 16 yo had lymphangitis at 10 and after a couple more flare ups, touch wood he hasnt had an outbreak for 5 years now.

If you get a minor flare up, thermatex leg wraps overnight and cold hosing twice a day can help, no muddy field if poss and if vet recommends it a little bute to reduce inflammation. Also if they are not a great drinker, and dont like sloppy feeds, try adding a bit of salt to their feed - 1 teaspoon enough, to make sure they are drinking enough to flush the fluids through.
 
Hi everyone,
First of all, can I thank you all for taking the time to help me with this issue. I can't believe the response I've had as a newcomer to this forum.
I took your advice and spoke to Bailey's today, they were absolutely brill and I was on the phone to them for the best part of half an hour.
They have recommended Bailey's no. 6 Endurance mix, which is a flake and mix-type feed with the same amount of protein in it as Calm and Condition, so hopefully I will be able to get bigger quantities of food down his neck now (he's only eating 1.5 scoops per day atm and he needs to be on 3) without aggravating his legs.
Thank you all again, I will let you know how Risk is doing :-) xx
 
Hi everyone,
Further to my last post, I have put Risk on the Bailey's No.6 Endurance Mix which has the same amount of protein as the Calm and Condition, and he's doing brilliantly. Eating all of his tea, and generally very happy (and VERY shiny!!)
Thank you all so much for your advice, he's a difficult lad to keep well so I may well be back here at some point later :-)
 
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