pts or not-feeling guilty

Yes, the pony may well be able to be taught not to kick, however you've also got to be a realist in these situations.

The sad reality is that even good ponies with no behavioral or health issues are being destroyed daily because there aren't enough homes for them, so the chances of a pony with issues finding a home are slim, especially one where it won't be passed on and finding the right person with the time, money and ability is another issue.
 
Probably won't be popular for this one but "better a day to early than a day too late" by that I mean a)before she does some serious damage to your children and b)so she has her future safeguarded, she doesn't deserve to be past from pillar to post. I hope you find the right answer for your situation and I wish you the best of luck whatever you decide. Just remember you know your situation best not anyone on this forums or your friend who is making you feel bad. Just go with your gut. Big hugs
 
Pigeon said:
Am I the only one here that thinks a pony can be taught not to kick?! And very quickly at that...

That said, OP, I would be 50/50 in your shoes, so whichever way you go, I totally understand.
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Agree with this and what Spring Feather has said. Reading threads like this make me reluctant to ever sell one of mine again! Don't mean you OP, whose dilemma I completely appreciate but you just cannot compare a kicking pony with a biting dog!
Those of us with horses know that at some point we are definitely going to be hurt by a horse, whether riding or on the ground, whether intentional (on the horse's part) or just by being in the wrong place at the wrong time. When we encourage out children to ride we are accepting that they will, at some point during their riding 'career' be injured by a horse. I do not expect my dogs to EVER harm me or my children. A dog is not a prey animal with a flight instinct. I am not justifying this pony's behaviour as I don't know the exact circumstances or background. What I do know is that it is simply ridiculous to compare what this pony has done to a dog attacking a child within the family!!
 
So, this pony is
a) not suitable as a companion,
b)not suitable as a child's pony - the purpose for which it was bought
c)seriously injured and difficult to treat

And all the 'rescue centres' in the district are full.

I really can't see the problem, the answer is obvious to me -pts.

And just to put this into context, in the past I have kept a mare with behaviour problems which became unrideable and very difficult to handle, at livery, then worked out what was causing her problems and over time sorted them out, so never rush to pts - and we keep all our horses for life. However, we have no children to get hurt.

However I have some advice to OP about her next purchase - take great care to buy from someone you can trust, either because you have known them well for a long time or because they have been recommended by someone you have known well for a long time or because you have researched them carefully.

Actually I blame the person who originally sold a broodmare on to an uncertain future for this poor pony's plight.
 
YouOnlyLiveOnce said:
I understand it may not be simple to find a home for her but its got to be worth a try before coming to the decision of pts. Don't get me wrong I am not against putting a dangerous horse to sleep, I would never want to see one passed on and yes there are fates worse than death. Maybe I'm just naive, or maybe I just don't like to think of a pony being pts when it could have the chance to go to a home where people will spend time with it to build trust again.
Personally - No I wouldn't respond to the advert now because I'm not looking to buy; however if someone was looking for a companion then I don't see why not (I'm assuming the wound would not be mentioned as would like to think OP would have that treated prior to moving on.)
If I was looking for a companion, then I possibly would look at it but I am the sort of person that wants to save the world! Also I'm thinking having them at home and only one or two people handling it, not on a livery yard. I would be happy to take a chance on it and spend the time with it, but no I don't have children.
There are plenty of horses out there that are known to kick. Yes it is dangerous around children but lots of people that don't have children keep shetlands as companions. All I am saying is its got to be worth a shot at an honest advert first.
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Of course the wound would have to be mentioned when selling. The OP can't treat it before selling. The pony lives in what is essentially the OPs back garden (field/stable for those who haven't read the thread, not a patch of grass and flowerbeds) where her children play. She needs the pony gone *now* for her children's safety.

The wound isn't responding to basic vet treatment (bute, antibiotics and cleaning - infected wound down to bone) and has likely already cost a few hundred pounds, it could easily run to over 1000 to *attempt* to fix, perhaps unsuccessfully. Why would anyone want to spend that kind of money on a pony that kicks and has possibly never been broken to ride (despite being sold to OP as a child's pony) and which they may end up PTS anyway?

Even if given away for free, this pony's wound would cost the next owner. For that kind of money you could buy a pony that doesn't have a serious injury and doesn't kick. It would probably have some other plus points too!



OP beware those offers of homes via PM as there is someone on here who seeks out free horses offering a forever home, then sells them on with lies. If you do a search on the username (I think) "Buddy's Mummy" there is a thread about "Buddy's" lameness where it all came out recently. I expect the person concerned has changed her username by now. Hope I've got the username right too, there is another one (I think) "Buddy's Mum" who is a genuine poster, so appologies to the genuine one if I've got the usernames the wrong way round.
 
I would without hesitation have her pts quietly and without fuss

Putting her out of her misery as she is obviously NOT a family pony that you bought her as.

The welfare charities are FULL to bursting with plenty of rehomeable horses and ponies as is, let alone a kicker that may or may not come round.

The pony is obviously frightened and defending herself as does not understand who children are and what fun for the most part they can be.

And the fact shes not only kicked your children but injured another pony also causing vet bills I would without a doubt save her from herself and kindly PTS.

Do not let anyone sway you otherwise! If a dog had attacked your children and pony you would be looking at this a whole lot different and no one would be making you feel guilty!
 
minesadouble said:
What I do know is that it is simply ridiculous to compare what this pony has done to a dog attacking a child within the family!!
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I disagree in this situation and thank you for calling me ridiculous. Yes, we take risks around horses, we take risks around all animals that are strong enough/teeth or claws are sharp enough to cause damage. However, this doesn't appear to be a one off. A pony repeatedly kicking out, knocking a child to the ground the, trying to kick is, in my opinion, as much of a risk to those children as any other animal that would display repeated signs of aggression. Dog/cat/parrot - the type of injury they could cause may be different but as a parent your first responsibility is to safe guard your children and remove the threat.
 
Spring Feather said:
The pony is dangerous to the people in her situation at present. The pony may not be dangerous in a totally different environment. And no-one has slated the OP from what I've read; everyone has simply given their opinion on how best to resolve the situation. The only people I've read who appear to be slating anyone are those who are vehemently pro-PTS to the people who are offering up other suggestions rather than just having the pony PTS. Either way, it makes not a jot of difference to any of us; it only affects the OP who has to make the decision, and obviously the pony who either lives or dies.
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You know something if anything happened to this persons children because of this pony, a there would be should grief that no one should ever know . I have no doubt that her children's welfare are her main concern but if its passed on unless you have it tagged and monitored you have no control of where it ends up and who with. There is a rig near me that has been advertised so many times on Facebook in the last few months with everyone thinking they know better when really when after it landed its first victim in hospital it should have been shot.
Its not the ponys fault its the way it is but once you know there is a potential for harm you have a duty to protect others and there is only one way realistically to do that. I just wish her well and the pony peace
 
LadyRascasse said:
Probably won't be popular for this one but "better a day to early than a day too late" by that I mean a)before she does some serious damage to your children and b)so she has her future safeguarded, she doesn't deserve to be past from pillar to post. I hope you find the right answer for your situation and I wish you the best of luck whatever you decide. Just remember you know your situation best not anyone on this forums or your friend who is making you feel bad. Just go with your gut. Big hugs
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Where's the 'like' button??

There are FAR WORSE things than being PTS or shot. A Shetland kicking and meaning it isn't just a danger to a child, it's also a danger to adults and other Horses. How many healthy horses with no temperament issues are destroyed every year?? I'd hate to know the actual figure but it's a big one that's for sure. Providing it's done humanely then that is all that matters. Animals live in the moment, you simply cannot factor human emotion into the decision.

OP please do not allow others to make you feel bad. You have given this pony a chance and it hasn't worked. I would definitely get the hunt out. There are plenty other ponies out there needing a good home who don't have the same issues. It is NOT your fault. Someone else has caused these issues and whilst it's a horrible situation that's what happens in life. If you give away or sell for cheap there is no telling where the pony will end up because there are so many people out there who will try and make money from it. Think how many 'free to good home' dogs end up as bait dogs in dog fights. I would rather PTS than give away unless I actually knew the person really well and had a clause that the animal came back to me if the new owner changed their mind.

I have seen ponies kick with aggression and mean it (not mine may I add), which sounds like what the OP's pony has done. One kick from even a small pony could kill an adult let alone a child or fatally injure another Horse. It is a very dangerous trait.
 
mairiwick said:
I disagree in this situation and thank you for calling me ridiculous. Yes, we take risks around horses, we take risks around all animals that are strong enough/teeth or claws are sharp enough to cause damage. However, this doesn't appear to be a one off. A pony repeatedly kicking out, knocking a child to the ground the, trying to kick is, in my opinion, as much of a risk to those children as any other animal that would display repeated signs of aggression. Dog/cat/parrot - the type of injury they could cause may be different but as a parent your first responsibility is to safe guard your children and remove the threat.
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I agree as a parent that the safety of the children is paramount. It is easy to keep a child away from a pony which obviously does not share your home as a dog does. Once the pony had shown signs of threatening behaviour none of my children would have been allowed within kicking/biting distance until the behaviour was ironed out.
Maybe this pony does not deserve a second chance. I don't know enough about this particular pony to comment. But I stand by my statement that it is not comparable to a dog biting a child.

As I said in an earlier post on this thread I had a young Lead rein pony which displayed a tendency to lunge at humans, and she meant it too. Once broken she was an absolute joy and a genuine kids pony, and remained so until her retirement to the paddocks, this turnaround took a matter of months. I trusted this pony implicitly.
If a dog bit my child I would never trust it again.
 
She might not be suitable for you because you wanted a child's pony but is that a reason to PTS -I don't think so personally.
After what she's been though, I think you should try and get her injury fixed and advertise her as a companion. A friend of mine took a Shetland on last year to keep her horse company and he's adorable but not suitable for children.
 
Tiffany said:
She might not be suitable for you because you wanted a child's pony but is that a reason to PTS -I don't think so personally.
After what she's been though, I think you should try and get her injury fixed and advertise her as a companion. A friend of mine took a Shetland on last year to keep her horse company and he's adorable but not suitable for children.
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This pony is aggressive to other horses and also has a serious injury that needs ongoing treatment. It's just not as simple as finding a companion home.
 
_GG_ said:
This pony is aggressive to other horses and also has a serious injury that needs ongoing treatment. It's just not as simple as finding a companion home.
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The previous owners state that the pony was very sweet natured with them. The living environment for this pony is certainly unsuitable for all concerned, no one is disputing that. The injury needs tending correctly for sure, but it will heal with proper care. As I said before, whether OP has the pony killed or rehomed or rehabbed or whatever, it doesn't make any difference to any of us. I've had countless horses in far worse shape than this one, both physically and psychologically, and I'm sure plenty others have too; not everyone makes the same decisions in life, and my choice has always been to work with the horse to help it. OP may not wish to do that, and that's fine, we all do what we are capable of and go as far as we choose to go with horses who need help.
 
I'd probably try to treat the injury within my means, no way I'd spend thousands on it, not a chance I'm afraid. Since it looks like the injury had turned nasty I think putting her down is the most realistic option unfortunately.

There are SO many small ponies for rehoming/given away as companions etc, I have a Welsh on permanent loan soon to be gifted to me and she is healthy, sweet and easy to handle, I just don't really think there will be many people wanting to rehab this troubled pony when they can have one of those instead..
 
A pony when I was younger jumped a 3 foot fence to run into the arena where my baby brother was playing to kick him! Lucky he had a nappy on so it didn't cause to much damage!
It's owner was told if it was not gone by the end of the afternoon the kennels were coming out!
That thing was pure nastiness.

I would PTS this pony. And I'm a bunny hugger!
 
PolarSkye said:
Which is about upper torso/head/face height for a small child.
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Exactly why I'm saying to keep the pony away from children? Loads of people who do not have young kids own horses... that's the home OP should want for this pony. I had a shetland up until a few months ago (who I had to PTS for health reasons) - had her the past 18 years! She's only ever been a companion and never been around young children until last year when my now 2yo son sat on her a few times. There are plenty of homes out there suitable for this type of pony. I pointed out the kicking height thing because in a shetland, that can be avoided but in a big horse it couldn't be since you can't really have a large horse in a home avoiding adults.

dunkley said:
It is all well and good saying find her a home as a companion, with no children. However it's not THAT home you have to worry about, but the next, and the next. By their very nature and size, ponies like that end up with smalls around them.
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I disagree. Shetlands are probably one of the few breeds that are often kept as PURELY companions, I bet the vast majority of shetlands in this country have never ever been sat on! Their main purpose is NOT as a riding pony like other breeds so IMO they dont get passed around nearly as much. ANY horse has the ability to kick so if you want to minimise risk then nobody should own a horse by your theory!
 
nicolenlolly said:
I have just been back out to her and the first thing she does is turn her bum on me, I am not inexperienced or stupid, (I feel I should explain myself to those that questioned it) my daughter was leading her on one side and me on the other when she knocked her and spun around on her. My littlest one was in the stable with my husband (who is horsey too so not stupid either) who was putting a headcollar on her whilst the baby stood in the opposite corner but grumpy mare that she is buggered off around the stable and gave her a barrel for good measure on the way round. She is a spiteful pony, she wants to hurt people when they dont antagonise her
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OP, I'm afraid I don't really understand why you're letting your kids anywhere near this pony let alone getting hands on putting a headcollar on her etc. when you know you have a problem with her. Personally, if it were me then I would be the absolute only one handling her until she showed massive signs of improvement. This pony clearly needs one to one attention and work to get her to trust humans again as clearly she's been seriously screwed up by them in the past which is a real shame. No pony IMO "wants" to hurt people, people have caused her to behave like this. You say some people have offered to rehome her through this forum - why not go and meet these people and see what they have to offer? There ARE decent people out there who may easily be willing to give her (at 12 especially) a home for life just as a companion. I hate people saying they worry the pony will be passed on, yes it could be but ANY horse could be, all you can do is try your very hardest to find the best home.
 
Horses are never spiteful.

The pony is obviously fear aggressive. I would not be letting children anywhere near it. However, I would not PTS in this situation. I feel very sorry for the pony. But, as a mother, I can understand the OP's dislike of her. I had a dog PTS immediately when he bit my baby on the face. He was not a nasty dog. We had seen him being thrown out of a car window six years earlier and he was a bag of bones. We nursed him through it and overcame his nervousness of men. But when I had my first baby he was obviously nervous around babies. He only snapped because my son crashed into him in his walker. We were not set up to ensure the baby and dog were always separate and so the dog had to go. I still feel desperately sad for him when I think about him now. However an animal that is sharing your home is different to an animal that is kept in a stable or field. In the OP's situation, if I wasn't prepared to put in the work, I would try to rehome but be absolutely honest why.
 
Agree with magicmelon and wagtail, why are your children standing in corners of the box, they shouldnt be standing in corners of any box with a horse in it. My shettie can be a handful to lead and turns around and gets excited, but its just him and his shettie nature, they are not all plods on leads, she is scared of humans we are prey and she is protecting herself.

We need to learn how to approach horses so they dont see us as a predator. Look down dont look straight at them, drop hands down to side, talk, it can be turned around. I do believe in horses being pts when ill or injured but not when a lil shettie is just being scared.

Horses dont think like humans and make a plan to go over there an kick a little person, sorry, it doesnt happen, she knocked the lass down but she didnt work out a plan to do it.
 
What does the vet say about the injury? If the wound isn't improving then in all likelihood you've either got a very deep infection which may need surgery or she may have chipped the bone.
 
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