PTS

[BBs]

Some of you may remember that I have been discussing having Bertie my 26 year old best friend PTS.

Some back ground....

I have owned Bertie for nearly 16 years, he is my first horse, ex pointer (so had a few knocks and wear and tear before we bought him).
For 10 years he competed and won loads of hunter trials, dressage, showing and unaffiliated ODE's.
He was diagnosed with navicular after only owning him for 4 years and we have maintained soundness by using aluminum shoes and navilox.

In his later years, we found him to have a heart murmur, arthritis in all his legs, weak back and more recently losing his sight in one eye.

Last winter he didnt cope very well, it was the first year i didnt clip him and although he grew a huge coat and was wrapped up in every expensive, xtra warm rug he still got cold and lost weight

Now he sounds a pretty much write off - but he is still full of himself, enjoys life and especially thrives on work! he has taken 3 years to get him to retire! however, this summer since moving to my new yard a young trainee vet has started to ride him - as she is living in the village and working there before going back to Uni in september.
Bertie has had a new lease of life, he is still slim but is muscling up and been pretty much sound, although now has to be aided with bute daily.

On and off for the last week he has been getting increasingly lame, no heat, no swelling - i can only think its his navicular or his arthritis is taking hold.

I spoke to the vet at the beginning of May whilst he was out seeing Winston, he said that perhaps it would be kinder to keep him for the summer and then have him pts before the winter (say october).

However, last night I had a quiet moment with him, i could see on his face he wasnt his usual - he had gone for a quiet hack and thoroughly enjoyed it but he was hopping lame in trot in the school - you could see on his face he really wanted to do it, but just couldnt, this is what upsets me the most. He still thinks hes the young ex race horse i bought all those years ago.

This morning I gave him a cuddle, he was stood quietly under his favourite tree and munched happily on a carrot.

I spoke to the girl who has been riding him, and she agreed that it wasnt fair to continue to keep him on bute, when clearly now its not really helping him.

So now, my question, I have never had a horse pts, ive never lost a horse. If I have him pts I want it done by injection only. I think YO would be happy for him to be buried in the wood close to the yard where her old pony is buried, but if not where can he go? I dont think although I like my hunting, I want him to go to the kennels.

Im sat here now with tears rolling down my face, as i have to make the decision and I dont want too, but i am only delaying the inevitable if i try another form of pain killer or get him thoroughly check out by the vet. If they can make him more comfortable it wont be for years will it?

Please, if youve had a horse pts before, can you tell me about your experiences and what happend afterwards. This may sound stupid, but I have no experience of any of this.

Thanks

Vxx

Here he is in all his glory aged 20! at the BHS Hunter Trial National Championships - he came 25th

 

[KatB]

I'm so sorry hon, its a horrible thing to have to do, but I think you're prob making the best decision.

I can understand where your coming from with the Injection side, but it does mean you can only bury or cremate him, and burying a big horse is one hell of a job. Your best bet is to try and find an equine cremation service, and they will generally collect for you to.

I hope everything goes smoothly for you, and my thoughts are definitely with you at the difficult time. xxx

 

[frannieuk]

I don't have any first hand experience of the situation but just wanted to send you my sympathies <hugs>

 

[CalliChristmasTree]

We had our horse PTS in Jan this year my mum had owned her for 26 years and she was 28.
I don't think i could really say anything as my mum has more of a similar relationship with you than i do.
When she comes back from the stables i can get her to PM you if you like. (shes mandy4727)
{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}

 

[Aleka81]

Have PM'd you Hun.
G
xx

 

[ihatework]

I really do feel for you, such a horrid but necessary decision to have to make.
All I can say is that I have decided, when the time comes for my boy, is that he will be cremated and that I will buy a nice potted tree and mix his ashes with that.

 

[CalliChristmasTree]

We still have Margo's ashes behind the sofa.
Not found the right place to spread them yet.

 

[Clodagh]

Hes a beautiful boy.
As KatB says, if you have him PTS with injection he can't go to the kennels anyway.
I buried my mare, but in many cases its not allowed, so you either try to get permission, or do it on the sly...
Its the one last thing we can do for them when they don't want to live anymore, and best to remember them happy than crippled.
Good luck, and lots of hugs.

 

[riotgirl]

Hun, my heart goes out to you. This is without a doubt the worst part of owning horses. You are being incredibly brave deciding what to do now - I'm sure he'd thank you if he could.
If you have decided upon injection then I don't think the hunt would take him anyway, so burial or cremation are your options. As already said, you would need a very big hole for a burial, so perhaps cremation and then burying him in his favourite spot is the answer? It sounds awful, but whatever you decide to do you will wish you had chosen different. This is just the way it is I am afraid.
Big hugs to you. x

 

[racingdemon]

big big hugs vix!

i've had to make this decision a couple of times with old horses, and also lost a number, but i'm rubbish at keeping them alive, with my old 14.2, who was the same age as bert, had gone almost totally blind & couldn't hold weight we gave him one last really good summer & took him to the kennels, and he was shot by them, everyone else has gone to turners, its a diffcult descion which to have done but for me i prefer to use turners, they are very good at thier job and very nice people.

however that dosen't solve it for you, i would do as someone esle has suggested & look for an equine cremation place, then you can have his ashes back & plant a tree on top of them or something, the problem with injection is that they can only be cremated or buried (& burying has its own problems i think), we've only had 2 pts by injection, and then had problems getting the body collected.

 

[EllieBeast]

HUGE hugs BBs.
i had my old pony pts by the hunt, and they took her. i know it isnt ideal for most, but i would never have had the pleasure of her if it hadnt been for the hunt. she was bred by them, brought up by them, and so i felt that she should go back to her roots to finish her 'journey'. the man who came for her was the most compassionate man i have ever met, spent a good half hour just stroking and getting to know her, she was then given a huge meal, and that was the last thing she saw. i dont regret doing things that way, but these were my circumstances, and everyone's are differant.
Whatever you choose, you are giving your horse the greatest gift in the world - a peaceful, painfree and dignified end.
All my love
Sarah xXx

 

[clipclop]

Hi BB's,
Sorry to hear you have this horrible decision to make.

As you well know, this is the time when we have to put our feelings to the back of our heads and make sure we make all the decisions in the interest of the horse.

I have had a few ponies PTS, Most by injection and one by the Hunt. I have to admit the Hunt were the best at this (After all, killing is what they do best). No faffing, no hesitating just straight in there, the pony didn't have a clue what was coming, his last thought was probably "Oooh, nice scratch".

For me, I think it is very important to be there. It is important that you say goodbye properly, I think it helps with the grieving process. I had one pony PTS when I wasn't able to be there and it took me ages to get over her death. The other two I could have won an Oscar for my crying performance, laying on the floor cuddling them after they had gone, telling them how wonderful they are and how no one could ever replace them. I also feel it was important to bury them myself. Make sure they were all comfortable in their grave. GIve them a clump of grass etc, whatever it is you want them to go to heaven with

I just feel all those things, for me, are so important in the saying goodbye. You will never forget them, but I am sure by being fully involved and saying goodbye properly and having a bloody good wail, shortens the grieving process so you can get on with life again and enjoy the horses who are still in your life.

Everyone is different, but that is my experiences and what I have learnt from those experiences.

I don't think anything can make, making the deicsion easier but I do think it is soooo important to put our own selfish reasons to the back of our head and do what is absolutely right for your horse. After all, you owe him that

Thinking of you during this tough time.

Cheers
C x

 

[Halfpass]

Big hugs to you. Had my old boy PTS 1.5 years ago now and it was a similar story to yours. Retired him for a couple of years which he hated. He loved his work and reallt went downhill once fully retired. One day i was spending some time with him giving him a brush etc and i looked into his eyes and i just new that after a lovely autumn and before the real winter set in ( it was early december) i had to make that decision. He was 27 years old and loosing his winter coat and going bald. Rugs made the balding patches get worse but he needed something as was getting cold. I decided to have him PTS by injection. I groomed him and turned him bakc out as did not want to be there and he galloped up the field bucking i felt awful. When he got to top of firld he nearly fell over and just looked at me as if to say 'your right mum nows the time' the vet was great and my dad stayed he said the he looked as though he was going to sleep very calm and gentle. He was buried (but shh don't tell anyone

) and its lovely to know where he is and that i can go and visit / put flowers down. That decision is sooooo hard but you will know when the time is right. Thinking of you at this difficult time.

 

[cheeky girl]

V I'm so sorry your post has bought tears to my eyes Bertie clearly means alot to you

I can't really offer you any advice as I'm the same as you and although I love hunting I couldn't send my horses there. Rightly or wrongly mine have been put down at home, and we've hired a JCB and we've buried them. My friend had to make this decsion last week, and she did the same as her YO was willing to let him be buried.
(((( hugs )))))

 

[Bossanova]

Aww sweetie such a hard decision to make but sounds like he knows and is letting you know.
Tough choice with what to do- you want to think long and hard about whether you want to be there or not- sometimes it's nicer just to have a quiet good bye and walk away, ask a friend you trust to hold him. This is what I'd do with mine, it's not nice when they go down.

 

[ruscara]

I have never had to go through this, but I inevitably will. My horse is 20, and OK at the moment, but I know I will have to make the decision sooner or later.
I just wanted to say that I really feel for you. I am certain you will do the very best for Bertie. I do hope that the vet can suggest something to make him more comfortable and give him some more time. This is the price we pay for caring so much and getting so much love and reward from our horses. It is horrible and hurts so much.

 

[Maesfen]

I'm sorry to hear this, he seems like a real character, but I'm sure by now, awful and hard that it is, you have made the right decision. I just wish all owners could be as responsible as you are and end the suffering for their own animals, particularly before winter sets in.

As already been said, the kennels won't want him if he's been done by injection to feed to the hounds but if you are on good terms with the hunt staff/masters, there might be the possibility of them removing him either to go in the skip or to imcinerate but not all hunts are able to do this and they would make a charge for this I'm sure; so you would have to check.
The other option is cremation and there must be one near you by now, they are springing up everywhere particularly now you have to have permission to bury, even on your own land unless you can do it on the sly; but it can be quite hard to hide a JCB digging a big deep hole; also the JCB driver might be implecated as he is breaking the law too, not a fair situation to put anyone in to my mind.
I have always had mine shot and sent to the kennels because then, as much as it hurts to lose them, I do not regard it as a waste of a life but I'm sure others on here will be able to go through the whole procedure of injections for you.

From what you have said before, I'm sure your horse will thank you for protecting him from further pain; you really are being there for him when he needs it most.
Chin up Hun' and virtual hugs to you.

 

[juliehannah58]

Oh Vix I am so sorry for you hunny.

I had my 24yr old pony (who we had for 11 years) PTS just over a month ago. I arranged for her to be buried on our land, my vet said he could prove she was a pet it would not cause any problems. We had her injected as both Mum and I wanted to be there with her till the end and I don't think I could of been there if it was done any other way. I arranged for a local man I knew who could hire machinery to come early that morning, it took him about 1 hour with a 5tonne digger to dig a hole, it has to be very deep and I think they put limestone or similar in the hole. Vet then came at 9am, she was always very spunky so I had spoken to my vet as I had heard horror stories of horses being injected then getting down then back up then down again and it taking a long time. He said this really never happens and the worst thing I could see would be her rearing up then falling or running a few paces then falling. He assured me by saying their heart actually stops beating quicker with the injection that if they are shot - that says something to me. It anaesthetises them before it does anything so if they do fight it a little they are fitting not sleeping, not fighting dying - it's important to understand that.

So vet came, we sedated her first as I wanted her to be calm and not worried about anything. Then we quickly lead her out of the barn and to a grassy spot, said our goodbyes, then the vet injected her. It only took about 5 seconds after she was injected, she took a couple of deep breaths, then the vet took her leadrope from me incase she fell forwards, but she just sat down then rolled onto her side and she was gone. That was it, her heart had stopped immediately and it was so peaceful, she had just laid down to sleep then died, with all digity intact. Obviously I was still in pieces, we all were including my vet (we had all tried so hard to keep her happy and get to the bottom of her problems) but Mum and I agreed there and then we will never have one shot again. It was a lovely way to go and no pain or shock or anything, she just slipped away.

Now I am crying my eyes out again but it's just because I miss her

and I know how you are feeling.

I look back and I don't remember that day, I remember Twilight in all her glory and spirit.

Afterwards I knelt down at her and stroked her / kissed her face and it didn't upset me at all because I could just see that spirit was long gone, just her shell was left. She is buried in a nice sunny corner and she now has her own little headstone and everything. I am also planting a rose bush called 'Twilights Mist' come Autumn.

It's such a hard thing to do but you are doing the right thing, you just know don't you? When the time comes you just know, and so do they I am sure of it. I was so worried afterwards that I would think I made a mistake, but I have no regrets at all, I just miss her.

If you need to chat about anything please do PM me.

Big hugs to both of you

xxxxx

 

[Nic]

Huge hugs hun. Mum & I had a "wait & see" summer with our little pony this year but last week made our final decision that it will be his last. I know how you feel.

We have lost 3 horses now, though I was young at the time so didn't get involved in the decision. All of ours were shot & although I think it is more upsetting for the owner, it is instant oblivion for the horse, they know nothing & don't get distressed as sometimes occurs with injection.

It is so hard a desicion to make when they still have good days. I couldn't catch the little git the other night & he reared up & whacked me in the chest - makes you think that mabe they can go another year.

Ours were all shot at home then taken away, not sure if the injection has any implications on them being buried at home. They can be cremated so you can scatter their ashes somewhere special.

Huge huge hugs hun but you are doing the final act of kindness for him xxxxx

 

[GinaB]

I'm so sorry you have to be going through this and I hope you can make the right decision on what you find is best. Hugs to you and you beautiful Bertie.

 

[Claireg9]

So very sad... My heart goes out to you!
I had to have my best friend and once in a life time pony PTS after owning her for 15 years. It was the hardest thing i have ever had to do, unfortunately she went from being her usual nutty self to a barely walking skeletor in the space of two weeks. the worst thing was it was over christmas and everything was shut! My vet reccomends that shooting is best for them as its so quick and pain free so thats what we had, but i would have like to have her buried in a pet cematory! But as timing was Christmas everywhere was shut! I was so gitted and still regret it to this day!
You are doing the right thing for your boy he's had a lovely summer and had fun now your setting him free to the big paddock in the sky, at least you have time to sort out a nice burial for him, i would have thought if your YO has already had one buried there she has permission to do so, if not try pet cematories, i beleive its worth it and by the sounds of it, its what you want too!
May the strength be with you through this horrible heart breaking time!
Big (((((((((HUGS))))))))) PM me if you ever need a chatt xx

 

[katelarge]

A good friend of mine had her veteran PTS recently, he was euthanased by injection and she had him cremated. The ashes were given to her in a really nice (and quite big) wooden box with a nice card. The box does not open so she can't scatter the ashes but is happy to keep them.

You'll hear different arguments for and against injections, just keep an open mind, talk to a vet and do what you feel is best for the horse. Like I said, cremation is an option my friend took, but my yard manager recently said a very interesting thing about feeding horses to the hounds. She did this with a youngster she had to have PTS, she said "feeding the horse to the hounds is like the spirit of the horse passes into them. When I go hunting, I can watch the hounds and feel the spirit of my horse." Now, I'm not a hunting devotee like her but I found that really interesting.

I do feel for you, you have some tough decisions to make because your horse sounds like a total star to have around. Keep us posted xx

 

[Ferdinase514]

Poor you. It's a really hard decision to make.

I had my 14.2hh pts 3 years ago. I found it really difficult, that I knew when it was going to be done and she had no idea. Does that make sense?

I'm afraid I had her shot by the vet. Vet felt this was most favourable method. Last thing she thought about was the packet of polos she was eating. She was collected in similar way to hunt, but went elsewhere.

I didn't stay for it. I couldn't have that as my last memory.

People I spoke to said that If you stay, it's best to be gone by the time they are collected as this is not very nice.

XXXX

 

[H's mum]

Aw Vix I'm so sorry - you must be heart broken

When I had Jasper PTS - he'd only just turned 13 and looked cracking on the outside but was riddled with arthritis on the inside and just couldn't cope

I was lucky in that my instructor handled things for me as I was an emotional wreck

Jasper was PTS by bullet - he was destroyed and taken away and incinerated - I didn't get his ashes back but he didnt' go for meat - I couldn't bear that

Just remember all the good times Vix - he's telling you he's ready to go - and you must be strong for him
Kate xxx

 

[the watcher]

I have always used the local hunt kennels, they are quick, effective and very quiet and sympathetic and of course will deal with taking your horse away afterwards, which can be expensive and tricky otherwise. I feel, like another poster, that some how my horses have lived on through the hounds (most of them had hunted after all).
I have never been organised enough to keep anything, but have always regretted not keeping tail or mane hairs from my first pony, you can get them made into a piece of jewellery.
It is a horrible time, you have been with this horse for so long and I really feel for you.

 

[BBs]

Guys thank you.

I havent read all the replies yet including pms as they are reducing me to tears and obviously being at work trying to answer the phone and seeing customers .....

You have all be so kind and supportive. I suppose its a subject that just doesnt get talked about too much.

Will reply to everyone later - but atm i just cant do it

Thanks

Vxx

 

[Pidge]

Oh honey my heart goes out to you. I had Higgins put to sleep in May 2005 as he had Grass Sickness. It was by injection at Leahurst and I had him cremated (he's in my spare room at home). I was absolutely devastated when I found out he had GS and took the decision to have him put down as there was just something different about him and I didn't want him to suffer anymore. I made the hard decision not to be with him as I was so upset anyway and if I got upset when with him it just upset him so I had to put a brave face on when with him. They took him outside in the sun and on the grass and put him to sleep. If I had been there he would only have been upset because of me. Some people may not agree with what I did but I tried to put Higgins first. You will know when the time is for him to go, at least with animals we have that choice. My husband died of cancer and there was nothing I could to do to allieviate the pain and suffering. xxxxx

 

[0]

I have tears rolling down my face reading this......
I don't really have any suggestions for the decision you have to make as i had to make it with the horse i had before the one i have now (this was nine years ago now) and it was the hardest decision of my life and i still to this day cry for her and wonder if i did everything i could and if she thinks i made the right decision.....i do however take comfort from the fact that i knew her and i knew she wanted to go.....she didn't want to battle anymore and like with your horse it was as if her soul was dying because her body couldn't do what her brain could. From what you've described i think you will have this comfort too. I know that this doesn't help at the time though because there is no easy way or right time to loose a best friend.
I did however on reaching the point your at decide to try a few more things.....they didn't work and three months later she was pts anyway. This i don't know if i would do again because on one hand i gave her every single chance i could and this helps me to sleep at night but on the other hand she suffered for three pointless months and this keeps me awake on other nights (because of what i said above...i think she didn't have that fight left) so in all i'm not sure... but then its like 'welshiesrock' said - you always wish you'd done differently, if i had, i'd have the same dilemma but flipped (she didn't suffer but i'd always wonder if i could have done more).
I had her pts by injection, she was then cremated and the ashes were planted with a tree i got for her....there is a little plaque on the fence by it with a few words for her. I too could not have sent her to the kennels.
It's an impossible decision but if you make it thinking of his best interests then you've done the right thing....
Huge Hugs, he is a beautiful horse and i'm sure your friendship will have created millions of happy times you can keep forever.

 

[guisbrogal]

I doubt that their is a dry eye on anyone reading this post. Unfortunately we will all have this awful dilemma to face one day and my heart aches for you to have to do it now.

Earlier in the year we had an old boy at our yard PTS (he was in his late 40's)

He was injected and then cremated and his ashes scattered over a field next to the one he grazed in. He had taken to falling over in the field and getting stuck in his stable because he couldn't get up

In october this year we face having another 3 PTS. They are 28,29 and 46yrs old and had dreadful winters last year. They have all thrived during this summer but we know that in the winter they will be crippled by their arthritis again and will struggle with their weight and the cold. I feel sick at the thought of losing them (even though they are not mine), especially one of them as I had her on loan for 2 1/2 yrs

No decision that you make will be nice for you but I am sure Bert will not know one way or the other and will be grateful to be free from his pains.

Huge hugs to you. We are all surrounding you in love as you make your decision
Amanda

 

[Weezy]

Love you honey - you know I sent Stan to the hunt, and I have no knowledge of what else to do over here - there has been some sound advice above

You know you only have to say the word and I will come and give you my support whatever you choose to do

Big huge squeeze xx