Putting a healthy horse down
- Thread starter smellydogjack
- Start date
fatpiggy
Well-Known Member
I don't think you can actually compare the life of a horse with that of a beef bullock. Meat animals are bred specifically for that - meat. They wouldn't exist at all if no-one ate meat, and there wouldn't be much milk available either since only goats don't need to breed every year in order to keep making milk. Leather would be a rare commodity too, and there are plenty of uses for animal hide glue, fertilizer etc still today. Horses are mostly pets so their life expectancy, barring disaster, is going to be longer. And that is why a great many people would say that a 10 year old healthy animal of normal talent and behaviour should be given the chance. I bought my mare as a rising 12. If her previous owner(s) hadn't sold her, I would never have had the joy, pleasure, heartbreak of owning her. She had had an abusive background, you could see all the whip marks on her flank in her summer coat and she had learned to detach herself from humans because they either sold her or were mean to her so she didn't risk trying to make a connection any more. Self preservation. She was polite and nothing else. It was 10 years before she let the final barrier down and was truly loving towards me although I had little glimpses of her real nature from time to time when she played little tricks on me or we played rear and chase in the field and then shook her ears at me with a cheeky grin on her face. I listened to a fascinating radio programme the other week about a girl of 18 who had been in care since the age of 5 and was now preparing to go solo with the help of her latest foster family. She had been fostered 3 or 4 times, often going from the frying pan into the fire, to people who were no better than her appalling mother who had got a new boyfriend who didn't like the children so gave her the option - her children or him and she chose him. But finally she landed up with a family who truly cared for her. She called them mum and dad and they introduced her to people as their daughter. She was a remarkable level-headed, intelligent, eloquent young woman who had been given the chance by an equally remarkable family. Should she have been left in a local authority run childrens' home, then turfed out at 18 and left to her own devices, so a prime target for pimps, pushers and less than desirable people in society? I realise this is NOT the same situation but it is food for thought.
Equine_Dream
Well-Known Member
Merrymoles
Well-Known Member
My thoughts on beef bullocks are that many of them have better, if shorter, lives than significant numbers of neglected horses. We do build relationships with horses and therefore we do consider them in a different way. I'd be unlikely to be able to eat a beef bullock happily if I had had a relationship with it, got to know its personality and its "quirks" as I don't believe they are any less "sentient" than horses. However, I am referring to the imaginary bullock as "it", whereas if it were a horse, it would be "he". My argument really is that, whenever we end an animal's life, age is a major emotive factor for many but doesn't really make any difference to that animal.
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
The Fuzzy Furry
Old Timer
Some people here need to take a LONG look at themselves! Read the posts back in the cold light of day, please!
Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world) earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.
There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be.
IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).
Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh?
Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world) earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.
There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be.
IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).
Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh?
Equine_Dream
Well-Known Member
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Indeed cattle are in many ways more sentient than horses . I hate to admit it but my suckler herd is carrying the odd older cow as a passenger even though I would not condone that for other herds. LOL
I agree on the age thing it is too easy to look on it with human values. They only die once and luckily for them they have no comprehension of how long they should live for however hopefully up to that stage they have the best life possible.
luckyoldme
Well-Known Member
Some people here need to take a LONG look at themselves! Read the posts back in the cold light of day, please!
Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world) earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.
There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be.
IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).
Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh?
thats so sad.puts the whole thing into perspective.
Like others have said we only have the ops version of this story and she has done a runner, in effect we are judging someone whos life we know nothing about, and might not evan exist.
ozpoz
Well-Known Member
I don't believe anyone considers PTS because "they can't bear the thought of it going to someone else" .
It is obvious that people do this because they can't bear the possibility of them slipping down the chain of ownership into bad hands, or worse. And no wonder - we hear daily of abandoned , neglected horses and witness poor, rough handling at many yards.
So don't be quick to blame - we don't know her, her horse, her circumstances, or the kind of people around her who are happy to take it off her hands.
It is obvious that people do this because they can't bear the possibility of them slipping down the chain of ownership into bad hands, or worse. And no wonder - we hear daily of abandoned , neglected horses and witness poor, rough handling at many yards.
So don't be quick to blame - we don't know her, her horse, her circumstances, or the kind of people around her who are happy to take it off her hands.
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Some people here need to take a LONG look at themselves! Read the posts back in the cold light of day, please!
Maybe I am just having a bad day - have been with a lovely lady with terminal cancer (not at all long for this world) earlier this morning, holding her 2 horses whilst they were PTS with her there.
There are lots of horses happy with owners, and more who do not have caring owners or good places to be.
IMHO there are NO rights or wrongs, but people doing as they see best AT THE TIME.
They are probably not in a good place once decision has been made - none of us are (and anyone who is otherwise, is a liar).
Guys, enjoy the horses you have, listen to others, dont be so quick with opinions eh?
All I will say FF is you did a wonderful thing today for that lady! God bless you
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Agreed we rarely can be sure for certain.
Damnation
Well-Known Member
I think people should agree to disagree and let this lie.
There is no right answer.
There is no right answer.
Equine_Dream
Well-Known Member
I understand that but why not use a rehoming charity where the horse is offered for lifetime loan? There are options.
This thread has actually really upset ans angered me. So I am going to respectfully bow out at this stage.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
There is some right dodgy quoting going on in this thread now.
I think with no info other than that given in the OP no one has sufficient information to judge.
I think with no info other than that given in the OP no one has sufficient information to judge.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
have you ever tried to find space in a good rehoming charity?
smja
Well-Known Member
This thread has been playing on my mind again - our old pony is having another setback in his lameness, and we've done an awful lot of weighing up options.
All I can say is that in these kind of situations, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' answer. The owner's responsibility to their horse comes first, above their personal feelings. Other people's input may be valued if asked for, to provide alternatives that may not be immediately obvious.
However, the decision remains with the owner. We have a duty to our horses that I for one take very seriously indeed.
Once someone has made that decision, it's up to the people around them to support them if they can, and refrain from commenting if they cannot.
All I can say is that in these kind of situations, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' answer. The owner's responsibility to their horse comes first, above their personal feelings. Other people's input may be valued if asked for, to provide alternatives that may not be immediately obvious.
However, the decision remains with the owner. We have a duty to our horses that I for one take very seriously indeed.
Once someone has made that decision, it's up to the people around them to support them if they can, and refrain from commenting if they cannot.
YorksG
Over the hill and far awa
The level of judgemental sentimentality of some posters views is beyond belief! Unless they are vegan, then I don't think they have the moral ground to shout about selfishness.
The only problems I can see is that the OP put this thread on here and the owner shared her plans with other people.
The only problems I can see is that the OP put this thread on here and the owner shared her plans with other people.
Llanali
Well-Known Member
I've stayed out until now, but I feel o compelled to mention a parallel story.
I bred a litter of puppies in spring 2012; well thought out, well planned puppies, all their homes lined up. They were born, and at four weeks my mother was diagnosed with a terminal aggressive brain tumour.
Pups A, B and C were sorted. Pup D was supposed to be mine, and pup E for my mum to keep.
When she died, six weeks after diagnosis, my father dropped all the dogs off at my semi terraced house. I could not afford them all or house them. I had an older but fully fit bitch, the bitch who had just whelped and two pups. I did what I feel most on here who have commented that the owner here is selfish, would probably do; I homed puppy D, through our breed welfare, to a respected home.
18 months later, I rescued that puppy back from a totally inappropriate setting, and though he has made great strides, he will never recover from the trauma of that home.
In hindsight, I wish I had put the older, but not ancient, healthy bitch down to make room for both puppies. But had I done that, half this forum would say I was selfish, vile,narcissistic. Getting rid oof older, for a youngster, thinking no one could care like I do.
Until you find yourself in the mouth of your personal hell, and I pray you don't, please take a care with your judgement. I adore my animals, they are my pridv and joy, and Imake many sacrifices for them, but human life tops out I'm afraid, and sometimes, decisions made that we can never be truly peaceful with, but that are absolutely necessary at that time.
I bred a litter of puppies in spring 2012; well thought out, well planned puppies, all their homes lined up. They were born, and at four weeks my mother was diagnosed with a terminal aggressive brain tumour.
Pups A, B and C were sorted. Pup D was supposed to be mine, and pup E for my mum to keep.
When she died, six weeks after diagnosis, my father dropped all the dogs off at my semi terraced house. I could not afford them all or house them. I had an older but fully fit bitch, the bitch who had just whelped and two pups. I did what I feel most on here who have commented that the owner here is selfish, would probably do; I homed puppy D, through our breed welfare, to a respected home.
18 months later, I rescued that puppy back from a totally inappropriate setting, and though he has made great strides, he will never recover from the trauma of that home.
In hindsight, I wish I had put the older, but not ancient, healthy bitch down to make room for both puppies. But had I done that, half this forum would say I was selfish, vile,narcissistic. Getting rid oof older, for a youngster, thinking no one could care like I do.
Until you find yourself in the mouth of your personal hell, and I pray you don't, please take a care with your judgement. I adore my animals, they are my pridv and joy, and Imake many sacrifices for them, but human life tops out I'm afraid, and sometimes, decisions made that we can never be truly peaceful with, but that are absolutely necessary at that time.
hairycob
Well-Known Member
We don't know what is happening to this owner e.g. if you are not going to be in a position to take a horse back putting it out on loan is not a realistic option. And don't bother to come back with "she can always find cheap grass livery" 1) grass livery, cheap or otherwise is flipping scarce in some areas 2) if she is facing severe health problems (e.g. life in a wheelchair) even that might not be a practical option.
We don't really know what the horse is like. I've known plenty of people describe chronically lame, bad tempered or generally difficult horses as lovely so it may be that finding the right home is going to be nigh on impossible or not in the horses best interest to rehome.
It may be that the horse is really sound & lovely but the owner is facing months of difficult chemo/open heart surgery or similar & can't face the stress of worrying about finding a good home.
So sad that so many posters on here have so little imagination about what may be driving the owner to this. Sure, she may be a right bitch who changes her horses as often as her knickers but it's far more likely that she is struggling in a dark & lonely place.
We don't really know what the horse is like. I've known plenty of people describe chronically lame, bad tempered or generally difficult horses as lovely so it may be that finding the right home is going to be nigh on impossible or not in the horses best interest to rehome.
It may be that the horse is really sound & lovely but the owner is facing months of difficult chemo/open heart surgery or similar & can't face the stress of worrying about finding a good home.
So sad that so many posters on here have so little imagination about what may be driving the owner to this. Sure, she may be a right bitch who changes her horses as often as her knickers but it's far more likely that she is struggling in a dark & lonely place.
Tiddlypom
Carries on creakily
^^^ Very good post, hairycob.
So many people pontificating from their moral high ground whilst knowing eff all about the real back story.
So many people pontificating from their moral high ground whilst knowing eff all about the real back story.
Pigeon
Well-Known Member
All the other liveries kicking up a fuss - are they offering to take on the horse?
Regandal
Well-Known Member
Lol! How true!
MagicMelon
Well-Known Member
Thing is, I think the owner is selfish to assume that only she can look after the horse well (which she clearly can't which is why she is now thinking of PTS). If it's only 10 and possibly rideable (??) then there's no reason why she can't find a decent home, there's plenty out there you just have to look and weed out all the nasties. I personally would never put down a healthy horse, why can't she loan it out and keep a close eye on it to make sure all is well?
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
We don't know anything from the owner, so it is entirely spurious to assume that she thinks 'that no-one else can look after the horse.'
fatpiggy
Well-Known Member
Hmm, not all the beef stock do unfortunately. I grew up in beef land and we let our field to a local farmer. The boys were out on beautiful grazing, doing what beefy boys do until they went to market at 18 months. The farmer took them himself in his small lorry. The local abbatoir was only 8 miles from the market. I played out with the boys constantly as there weren't any other kids around, gave them names, sat on their backs and generally enjoyed their company. But I still ate my roast beef on Sundays. Contrast this to the poor little souls which were kept by a local gypsy in a pen on the farm where my horse retired to. They arrived at just a couple of weeks old, put into a concrete pen with no bedding, just slats (I don't think that is legal actually) with just straw and nuts to eat. As they grew the space around them shrank until they could barely turn around. They lay in their own filth and crapped on each others backs because they were wedged in so tight. Out of one batch, two died of bacterial pneumonia due to the terrible air quality, they were all alive with ringworm and one went down and was trampled to death by the others. These were the lucky ones, their suffering was over. As they got bigger they became more sexually active so were fighting and mounting each other in their matchbox of a pen. Then one day the lorry came for them and the evil creature that owned them beat them into it with a thick stick. Those poor animals never had so much as a day of having grass under their feet, to run and kick as all baby animals like to do. Their short lives were absolute misery and the whole set-up was a total disgrace.
Luci07
Well-Known Member
The original post said the owner couldn't bear to sell the horse on. People are judging but we are basing our responses on what we were told in the first post. No, we don't know the whole story, we weren't given it. All we were told is that she can't keep the horse and chooses to put down a healthy young animal who has no issues. I sincerely hope there isn't an awful back story but people are only responding to what they have been told. Anything else is just guesswork.
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
Second hand information just isn't as trustworthy as first hand information.
Luci07
Well-Known Member
True....hope this post is just theoretical for both the owners and horses sake.
jrp204
Well-Known Member
Is it me or is the quoting really odd?