question about fatal colic/colic

I'm very sorry for your friend and her horse, that's rough. I think with colic we do what we can to prevent it but really sometimes despite the best care it just happens and there's nothing you can do about it.

I always try to have a kind of plan of what I'd do if a situation arose and the one thing I can't plan for is how I'd get my horse on our trailer and take her to the vet hospital in the event of colic, she doesn't load well at the best of times and I can't imagine that being in severe pain would improve that situation.
 
One of the horse's at the yard has just had colic op very touch and go. He's at New market and the surgry said he very luckly to be alive as they had another 2 horses that came in with the same and didnt surive!! He also got blood poisoing and lost quite a bit of gut though it dieing. I dont know much about coilc apart from it can come on so fast.
 
One of mine had colic before xmas. He was eating his dinner, tucking in as normal then just stopped, dropped his head then dropped to the floor where he stayed for 20 mins, got up and acted allthough nothing had happened. It came and went so quickly. By the time the vet came you would of thought nothing had happened. It makes you wonder if they ever have it and we never know!!.
 
I think the problem with colic is it is a broad term used to describe any sort of gut disorder when, in reality many occurrences and fatalities are due to other reasons - ie tumours, tears or previously unknown disorders a horse may have. I think people just use the term colic in a lot of instances.

I think as Fizzer says, there are probably many occasions our horses have 'stomach ache' and we never know about it. My sister's horse was acting odd a few months back and we could only put it down to him feeling a bit uncomfortable and gassy. Luckily the vet was at our stables as was vaccinating another horse so he checked him over. Within 20 mins the horse was back to normal. He was never particularly stressed, just looked like he was uncomfortable really.
 
As has been said on here by many people yes they can. My last mare was uneasy at 9 put in field with her chum and by noon she had been pts.
 
I've had two undergo colic surgery for unusual (non management related) issues.
If you look at the University of Liverpool's website on survival rates for colic - they are actually quite positive, so I would recommend surgery.
Of course, many of the horse owners who say 'I would never put my poor horsey through such suffering even if vets advise it has a good chance' really mean 'I can't be assed to pay the vet fee, muck out for the box rest period, and hey, I can buy a shiney new one cheaper!' Same people who PTS when their old horses can't be ridden any more to make space for a new one. :(
These people aren't horse lovers - they are riding lovers.
S :D
 
I am 7 months post op for my mare who had an epiploic foramen entrapment. She coped wonderfully with the surgery and the following box rest and was a joy to be around throughout. She is now fully recovered although I still have a panic attack if she looks a bit down or doesn't eat all her hay.

Having said all that, if she were to require an operation again i wouldn't. One reason is that she isn't insured for colic surgery anymore so I would be looking at a bill of around £5000 in total. Secondly, the form of colic she had is very severe and she was incredibly lucky to have recovered in the way that she did. The chances are that she wouldn't be so lucky a second time. I also think that going through a surgery like that once is enough for any horse.
 
I'm another who has lost a horse very quickly to colic. Last June, OH and I were car sharing, and I had a riding club committee meeting to attend, so OH (who is, by the way perfectly capable around horses) agreed to feed the gang if I would drop him off en-route to my committee meeting and pick him up again on the way back.

So I saw Polly's food put down, and saw her eating before I left for the meeting, and I can in all honesty say that she was as right as rain. I drove away, and OH went to get himself a cup of tea. Not half an hour later OH noticed Polly was down and he couldn't get her to stand. He ran to get help from the lady at the yard opposite (who by the way was an absolute rock that night!), then called me (by then I was on the way back from the short committee meeting). I called the vet while I was driving and the vet arrived about 20 minutes after I got there myself.

Even the four of us (vet, OH, neighbour and myself) together with rope harness, couldn't get Polly up. Upon rectal examination (done with vet lying on the ground) vet found that the intestine was displaced - severely.

Although it is the hardest decision to make to PTS, does it make sense if I were to also say it was easy? The vet reckoned that she had less than 5% chance of survival even with surgery, and she was 26 years old. It wasn't hard to make the hardest decision - and Polly was PTS there and then. I had owned her for 15 years and she had no previous history of colic (or illness) whatsoever.

Oh and by the way - Polly did have a forever home with me (as does my other elderly mare who will be 30 this year) - she had been retired for about 5 years and was living the life of Riley up until that last fatal day.
 
Shilasdair said:
I've had two undergo colic surgery for unusual (non management related) issues.
If you look at the University of Liverpool's website on survival rates for colic - they are actually quite positive, so I would recommend surgery.
Of course, many of the horse owners who say 'I would never put my poor horsey through such suffering even if vets advise it has a good chance' really mean 'I can't be assed to pay the vet fee, muck out for the box rest period, and hey, I can buy a shiney new one cheaper!' Same people who PTS when their old horses can't be ridden any more to make space for a new one. :(
These people aren't horse lovers - they are riding lovers.
S :D
Click to expand...

That's a bit harsh Shils' as many will be doing it, not for the money or the need to spend it but in consideration of what each horse can go through or can't, as the case may be.

My vet spends a lot of his time operating with colic cases and he says it is getting a bit better, other vets are more ready to refer to them earlier than used to be the norm, but many that are sent should not have put a foot on transport in the first place as they would have been in agony and because it was so advanced, would not have survived surgery at all. It's as heart breaking for him as the owner when they draw up and the horse has either died in the transport or is so badly affected that they have no chance to help and it has to be put down immediately' all that suffering of a journey for nothing. I know which I would prefer and being transported at that time is not it.
Incidentally, research is showing that unless you have a very short journey to horspital, recovery is of quite low expectation unless your vet is on the ball and sent you in quickly. Those that have a mild grade rumble for a few days which doesn't seem that bad are just as likely to be fatal as a severe colic because the tissues around the gut are compromised. In other words, each colic should be regarded as dangerous but some are relieved by pain relief, others aren't.
For me, I'd go down the pain relief route first if it was suitable; if it was too severe, I would put down purely because I have too much 'inside' information from my vet and I trust him implicitly plus I have too much compassion for my horses and would never knowingly put them through hell, sometimes only to have the same result; I would always regret that.
 
I hate colic :(

Nearly lost my boy to it in Dec 2007, he was operated on within 25 minutes of being at Leahurst- those vets saved his life and I'm so thankful to them every day.
It was a hematoma in his small intestine- apparently this is not usually heard of.

Always feed related my ass! Thats made me angry!

So sorry to hear your experience x
 
Shilasdair said:
I've had two undergo colic surgery for unusual (non management related) issues.
If you look at the University of Liverpool's website on survival rates for colic - they are actually quite positive, so I would recommend surgery.
Of course, many of the horse owners who say 'I would never put my poor horsey through such suffering even if vets advise it has a good chance' really mean 'I can't be assed to pay the vet fee, muck out for the box rest period, and hey, I can buy a shiney new one cheaper!' Same people who PTS when their old horses can't be ridden any more to make space for a new one. :(
These people aren't horse lovers - they are riding lovers.
S :D
Click to expand...

I don't think that's true Shils. I know a surgical vet who is undecided if she would even put her own horses through colic surgery because it is so traumatic. That speaks volumes to me about what a huge decision it is. If anyone is in a position to question the wisdom of it surely she is? I wouldn't go through with it myself and her attitude is a large contributing factor to that. My horses are both insured so money no object and I certainly don't object to giving them my time whilst on box rest. As it happens I don't think my youngster would cope at all with box rest of a prolonged period and that is another major factor which goes towards the opinion I have.

ETA Sorry maesfen. I've just said exactly what you said already. I didn't really read the replies properly before I typed this out.
 
Last edited:
vikkic said:
Colic is not always feed related! I lost my gelding to colic last year. He had a lyphoma wrapped around 20 foot of his gut, there was no way of anyone knowing this could have happended. Why do some vets come out with such rubbish!!
Click to expand...

I quite agree, I lost my lovely mare who I had owned for 20 years with never a days illness (she was 21 when she died) she had a lyphoma the same as your horse. I found her on the Friday morning very distressed, her bed was all over the place, summer sheet torn off looked like a puppy had got hold if it. I rang the vet straight away and they came out gave her Bascopan, she eased a bit but in the afternoon had to get vet out again, they put a tube up her nose and drainied her stomach.

I stayed up all night with her and she was up and down all night and we both had a dreadful night. At 5.30 am she gave a huge groan as she lay back down for the umpteenth time and I decided that enough was enough and rang vet again. They came out and said that she now had circulatory problems and must go to hospital.

Once there (Bell Equine) they scanned her and she had 3 loops in the intestine, the vet there said she could operate but would probably have to put her to sleep in the operation. I decided to do the decent thing and have her put down as she was 21 years old

They said that they were certain that is was a lymphoma and it strangles the small intestine and cuts off the blood supply. This was in no way food related and there was nothing that I had done wrong or different it is just one of those things that happen to horses. Apprently one vet told me it is very common in ponies - I dont no why though.

OP I am very sorry to hear about your friends horse that must have been a terrible shock for both of you. My mare was perfectly alright the night before when we rode her and she had eaten all her food and her hay.
 
fizzer said:
One of mine had colic before xmas. He was eating his dinner, tucking in as normal then just stopped, dropped his head then dropped to the floor where he stayed for 20 mins, got up and acted allthough nothing had happened. It came and went so quickly. By the time the vet came you would of thought nothing had happened. It makes you wonder if they ever have it and we never know!!.
Click to expand...

That's quite possible as one night I was on the phone in the tack room and when I had finished I went to look at my mare before I went home and she was acting a bit odd. She looked at her sides and got down and then got up and I was thinking oh no you look like youve got colic, she stood for a minute or two and then seemed to brighten up and starten eating her hay. I stayed for a while and then went home and popped back up about half hour later and she was fine. She was fine the next day and thereafter but if you read my later post on her I did lose her eventually to colin but that was sometime later.

the interesting thing about this first time was that at the time she was on a 5 day course on Panacure Equine Guard wormer and I think this had something to do with it.
 
:D Oh dear, I seem to have upset a few of you yet again. :D
I suppose there are a few key points which I should add;
1. Only opt for surgery after discussing your individual horse's chances with the vet - ask them what they rate the percentage survival chances to be (often they don't know and have to open them up to see, but being put under general is no worse than being PTS and you can always PTS if it proves to be inoperable). Also ask the likely fees.
2. Consider the horse's future - short term (box rest) and long term (working life, years left). Regarding box rest - if you manage them properly, horses can be pretty happy in the recovery period - but the care is time consuming. I walked mine in hand, grazed mine again in hand for hours each day, built them electric fence enclosures, paid people to give them different forage at lunchtime, used radios, bought toys, OH did night checks, and I work more than FT. I don't approve of 'shut them in a box for three months' box rest, though, so if you can't be bothered to do it properly (and be jumped on by idiot horses when they start to feel better :p) don't do it at all. :D
3. I would not ALWAYS opt for surgery - it depends on the circumstances. And if you look at the stats, the survival rates after a second surgery are pretty poor, so to me it doesn't seem like a great idea.
4. If you ARE going to opt for surgery - move fast. Go with your gut (sorry :p) instinct, and after the first lot of Buscopan and bute don't work - transport them to the vets asap.
Anyway, I hope you are all luckier than me, and never experience a colic.
Condolences to those of you who have lost horses this way.
S :D
 
Maesfen said:
That's a bit harsh Shils' as many will be doing it, not for the money or the need to spend it but in consideration of what each horse can go through or can't, as the case may be.

My vet spends a lot of his time operating with colic cases and he says it is getting a bit better, other vets are more ready to refer to them earlier than used to be the norm, but many that are sent should not have put a foot on transport in the first place as they would have been in agony and because it was so advanced, would not have survived surgery at all. It's as heart breaking for him as the owner when they draw up and the horse has either died in the transport or is so badly affected that they have no chance to help and it has to be put down immediately' all that suffering of a journey for nothing. I know which I would prefer and being transported at that time is not it.
Incidentally, research is showing that unless you have a very short journey to horspital, recovery is of quite low expectation unless your vet is on the ball and sent you in quickly. Those that have a mild grade rumble for a few days which doesn't seem that bad are just as likely to be fatal as a severe colic because the tissues around the gut are compromised. In other words, each colic should be regarded as dangerous but some are relieved by pain relief, others aren't.
For me, I'd go down the pain relief route first if it was suitable; if it was too severe, I would put down purely because I have too much 'inside' information from my vet and I trust him implicitly plus I have too much compassion for my horses and would never knowingly put them through hell, sometimes only to have the same result; I would always regret that.
Click to expand...

Quite agree Maesfen my sister in law's horse went down with colic 75 degree twist apparently, they operated and it was doing its 6 months in the box. One morning she went into the yard ( about 5 months down the line) and the mare was colicing again, they had the vet out and had her put down straight away. I can always remember hearing my sister in law saying "I wish to God I had never had it done in the first place" (the operation she meant). It cost her £5,000 she ended up with a dead horse.
 
amymay said:
I think it's irrelevant - you will always do what you consider is best for your horse.

I would never put a horse through that sort of surgery - and would forgo any insurance payout.
Click to expand...

With hindsight I would have had my boy pts at home rather than travel him 100 miles and put him through the surgery that ultimately killed him. The other day I was thinking about what I would do if my mare (who is the love of my life horsewise) came down with colic. My immediate reaction was that no way would I put her through surgery especially as she is 16 and retired through injury. But when I thought about it, knowing her, and her love of life and her tough constitution, I think that could she talk, she would beg to be given a chance. She has such spirit, and I don't think that unless it was a cut and dried case of her having to be PTS that I could make that decision to take her life. I hope that I never have to.
 
Have had one die through lymphoma wrapping itself round gut, he went down with colic two Novembers running and in between never really picked up, the second time he had had enough and he was pts. My present horse regularly gets colic even though I am really careful with him. I also wonder if he gets it when no one is about and gets over it.Always worry about him being in the stable over 15 hours with no one looking at him as he is on DIY livery some way from home. Also have no access to transport so if he did need to go to horspital by the time I managed to organise something it would be too late. I try not to worry too much but yesterday found him lying in the field and panicked, luckily he was in the middle of a roll and had just decided to rest for a bit!
 
Shilasdair said:
:D Oh dear, I seem to have upset a few of you yet again. :D
I suppose there are a few key points which I should add;
1. Only opt for surgery after discussing your individual horse's chances with the vet - ask them what they rate the percentage survival chances to be (often they don't know and have to open them up to see, but being put under general is no worse than being PTS and you can always PTS if it proves to be inoperable). Also ask the likely fees.
2. Consider the horse's future - short term (box rest) and long term (working life, years left). Regarding box rest - if you manage them properly, horses can be pretty happy in the recovery period - but the care is time consuming. I walked mine in hand, grazed mine again in hand for hours each day, built them electric fence enclosures, paid people to give them different forage at lunchtime, used radios, bought toys, OH did night checks, and I work more than FT. I don't approve of 'shut them in a box for three months' box rest, though, so if you can't be bothered to do it properly (and be jumped on by idiot horses when they start to feel better :p) don't do it at all. :D
3. I would not ALWAYS opt for surgery - it depends on the circumstances. And if you look at the stats, the survival rates after a second surgery are pretty poor, so to me it doesn't seem like a great idea.
4. If you ARE going to opt for surgery - move fast. Go with your gut (sorry :p) instinct, and after the first lot of Buscopan and bute don't work - transport them to the vets asap.
Anyway, I hope you are all luckier than me, and never experience a colic.
Condolences to those of you who have lost horses this way.
S :D
Click to expand...

I agree with everything here!!
I lost my old boy to colic at 25yrs old. The vet thought he might have a chance if he had surgery and was making the arrangements to transport him there when i made the decision to have him PTS. My decision was not based on the surgery, recovery etc but purely on the fact i did not think he would get there. I knew my horse and he was dying, no doubt about it. He was in extreeme pain, couldnt stand up and i know he would have either died in the box, or killed us all on the way. So I respected him and had him PTS where he was, and with me holding his head saying goodbye.

I would have given him every chance even at the age of 25 if i thought we could have got him there.
 
jesstickle said:
I don't think that's true Shils. I know a surgical vet who is undecided if she would even put her own horses through colic surgery because it is so traumatic. That speaks volumes to me about what a huge decision it is. If anyone is in a position to question the wisdom of it surely she is? I wouldn't go through with it myself and her attitude is a large contributing factor to that. My horses are both insured so money no object and I certainly don't object to giving them my time whilst on box rest. As it happens I don't think my youngster would cope at all with box rest of a prolonged period and that is another major factor which goes towards the opinion I have.

ETA Sorry maesfen. I've just said exactly what you said already. I didn't really read the replies properly before I typed this out.
Click to expand...

That's what my vet says too but you wrote it so much better than I did!
 
Shilasdair said:
:D Oh dear, I seem to have upset a few of you yet again. :D
Click to expand...

Well you definitely didn't upset me. I see no reason at all why people shouldn't have conflicting opinions. That's what makes the world go round after all. You're reasoning is pretty sound as is mine and we have just reached different conclusions. No need to fall out over that is there?
 
Grr, I'll get this right one day! Jess, you've also just added the bit I missed about answering Shils', and with the right words too, again, thanks.
_thanks__by_Seraphim_Enraged.gif
 
I think it totally depends on the individual case as to whether you'd opt for surgery. With my horse I would if he stood a chance, even though he's 20 next year, he'd be a good patient afterwards which would help. Same with the baby as at almost 2 he's got many years ahead so it'd be worth it from my point of view. i think even with my 23 yo pony I'd even try it as again, he's a good patient so aftercare would be easy. However, our 26 yo TB i am not sure, he's a whole different animal - much more stressy in general and his age would have to be taken in to consideration. Then again, it's easy to say one thing - when you find yourself in the situation it's a whole lot different!
 
I agree with Shils, it is about the welfare of the horse and the comment about being rider lovers unfortunatley imo is also true.

I lost 2 horses last year with synptoms of colic and have one on box rest now - different causes!, the first was a mare that we had only had for 18 months, she was a well bred TB and we had a lovely foal from her, she started with colic and over a period of 1 month we probably didn't have much quality time with her and finally we made a difficult decision that operating wasn't the right decision for her. We took into account age and the fact that she was leaving a 3 month old foal behind to wean. However the probable gut damage wasn't even worth considering - this was a case of long term damage to her, previous to her being with us. Please notethis was after £3500 worth of bills - uninsured.

Anyway we lost her in August, in October her now 6 month old foal was having colic, should we operate, well this is a foal with a good chance of an outcome. On 23rd December she required further surgery for a ruptured hernia. We aren't out of the woods yet, however we are over our insurance for a probable bill of about £3-4k assuming nothing else goes too wrong!!

Our 3rd case of colic was an old mare that I had for about 25 years and in November at the grand old age of 45 and within 1.5 hours of her banging her stable door to say something was wrong she was most definately leaving us. We couldn't put her through surgery and probably wouldn't have got there anyway. Yes she wasn't insured due to age either but her bill was considerably less.

Colic is only stomach ache and it really is down to the cause or what the symptoms imply. I have sleepless nights and get up to check our foal every night during the night. I am incredibly skint and have another 5 horses (2 of which over the age of 20, one has liver problems) that also have to come into the equation.

The surgery is the easy bit, its the after care and what happens if the wound breaks down that is the problem - we've apparently been unlucky. The foal has had other problems too which almost made us make another decision. I'm lucky as I run my own business which has some great people who just let me drop everything and go. My foal would not be alive if I had to work a conventional job, or i'd be unemployed!

With regard to colic, it frustrates me that people post - should I call my vet, is it fatal or they should have put their horse down. The answer is simples, if your horse has colic it can be fatal, call the vet, do the best for the horse and take Shils' point number 4 to heart, if you are going to operate or have a chance of operating do it fast!

Sorry to anyone who's lost a horse or even two to this horrible symptom, but rant over.
 
jesstickle said:
Well you definitely didn't upset me. I see no reason at all why people shouldn't have conflicting opinions. That's what makes the world go round after all. You're reasoning is pretty sound as is mine and we have just reached different conclusions. No need to fall out over that is there?
Click to expand...

No need to fall out? That depends - what IS your stance on the cob issue? :p :D
S :D
 
Shilasdair said:
No need to fall out? That depends - what IS your stance on the cob issue? :p :D
S :D
Click to expand...

Well, from what I can gather it isn't entirely a cob? More like the most mahoosive TBx in the world? TBx anything does not, I suspect, a cob make. If you would post a photo though it would make it much easier to decide where exactly I stand!
 
Yes, we left my daughters pony one lovely summer's evening at 6pm happily grazing out in the field. Next morning we found him close to death, he had run through the electric fence and found his way into a field shelter where he lay. It was one of the most distressing days of our lives.

The other incident was that of a fellow liveries horse ( different yard) Fine at 7am in the morning, Dead in the field at 2pm.

Colic is a very serious condition and can be devasting.
 
thank you to everyone who has taken the time to reply. sorry to all those who have lost due to colic. just hope my friends horse did not suffer for too long. RIP.x
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top