Questions for engineers, fatties and skinnies...

brighteyes

brighteyes

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Have any proper, scientific, based-on-physics, calculations been done as to the weight horses can reasonably be expected to carry? Is the musculature as ideal as it appears
(since it's so easy to damage their backs and merely a quirk of nature that they are the perfect design for us to sit on)?

Why is it donkeys have a proportionally greater load limit, in spite of their size and build - or is this a myth?

Do we have a RIGHT to get on any animal we feel is perfectly capable of taking our weight?

Has anyone on here ever said, 'No, I'm too heavy for that horse', or lost weight consciously to be able to ride the horse they want/to improve the aesthetics?

Did it work/help?

There seems to be a divide on here, and it isn't just the slim v the less so.

Does anyone try hard to stay the size they are, purely for the sake of their mount? (Hopefully this would be light enough!)

Serious post, so no fighting and accusations of fattist, thinnist or any other ist.
 
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Yes I have said countless times that I am too heavy to ride a horse. Because I am tall most people think I weigh at least a couple of stone lighter than I do.

I haven't lost weight BECAUSE of a horse, but I have enjoyed losing weight to aid my overall riding fitness and yes, I think thinner legs do look better in breeches!
 
Thank you Weezy for the sort of reply I was hoping to get. Let's hope you aren't the only enlightened rider (no pun intended) to answer the thread.

I would like an engineer to give it a cursory glance, too, as the beautiful and unbelievably useful set of coincidences which is 'the horse' seems to good to be true!
 
Regarding research, I believe there has been, although couldn't give you a reference. There used to be a very sciency bod who posted on here a few years back and if memory serves me correctly this came up then.

I said 'no, I'm too heavy to be backing my 4yo', and had a lighter rider do his early work in lieu of me
I am also conciously slimming down as I am overweight and would like to be able to ride more effectively, and quite honestly blubber thighs do not look great in breeches and they definitely hinder your ability to ride
 
When I weighed about 3 stone more than I do now, I wouldnt of gotten on any horse- with the exception of a clydesdale (I didnt know any). I didnt lose weight to begin riding again tho, it was just something that happened along the way.

Last year I said no to riding a friends baby cob, as I felt I would be too heavy (babay, under developed etc)- turns out she weighs a stone more than me!!!!!!- and im sure it would be fine now the horse is matured.

I feel better riding when I am a bit lighter/fitter, but only as i dont get so knackered (lazy arsed share horse!!).

I do think people are a little over precious with weight limits though.
 
I think there is a calculation (I know the rda use one) to work out the weight of rider they can put on each horse. It takes into account the horses' amount of bone, but unfortunatly I don't remember what it is called, sure someone more useful will know!
I do try and stay the size I am, although a little smaller would make breeches look less scary! Not for the sake of my horse though as she could happily carry more than I weigh (I'm just under 10st, she is a pretty sturdy 16hh connie cross!), more vainness tbh - I feel I look better when I'm on the smaller size! If I thought I was too heavy for a horse then I would say, I would feel awful if a horse had to lug me around if I was too heavy for it. I wonder if because I haven't been in that situation it is easier for me to say what I would do though? Like wheezy, because I am tall people tend to guess my weight rather favourably! If someone more knowledgeable tried to convince me it would be fine then I hope I would stand up for my opinion! Tricky though as reading some threads on here, sometimes I think 'well of course the horse can take your weight / you are clearly not too big!', but sometimes (esp looking at pics) I do wonder if some people are rather heavy, esp on some finer horses. Seems to be a real variation in opinion on the weight question if this forum is anything to go by!
 
lol Weezy I am constantly telling my students that horses were not designed to be ridden (and am usually met with puzzled expressions:rolleyes:), that the white line was not there to show the farrier where to put the nails, nor is the girth groove there so we can conveniently use it to hold our saddles in place:D

I refused to ride a client's new horse a couple of weeks ago because it has a dodgy back and I am far too heavy for it. My own horses are all IDs or IDx and are more than capable of carrying me, but skinny little TBs aint.

I am pretty average sized, but I am big boned, and as they say on Silent Witness when they are examining a corpse, "well-nourished" :o

Today I have been to see a potential new horse for a client. She is tall and big with it, and the horse is a 3yo IDx which will make 17.2hh. Perfect:)
 
I can't back it up with any science and I'm mainly going on what I've read about the different breeds and weight bearing capacities, but I've decided that I am too heavy to back my youngster, even though he's a HW cob. I know he'd be able to take my current once he's got the muscle and developed a little more but until then, my plan is to try and sift the weight otherwise I will be getting a lighter rider to back him and build the muscle so that he can sustain me.

A couple of people have said the whole 'no you'll be fine, he's a heavyweight cob after all!' and if he was 6 and finished growing, I'd probably agree. But he isn't. I can carry some heavy loads now but I wouldn't have been able to as a child. I think it's a similar sort of thing :)
 
I ride a fjord, and he can carry a lot of weight. I am dieting so that we can both have an easier time, and I limit the amount of riding I do (no all day rides yet!). I would not get on anything finer, such as a TB, or anything smaller than him. I will soon be light enough to hop onto my friend's exmoors, as they also take a decent weight as well.
 
I am 5ft7 and 9st4lbs ish -with a BMI that hovers around 19/20. I am encouraged to put on a little more but I refuse because a) I don't look good carrying a little more and b) my pony is only 13.1h. She jumps 1m20 with me, so I know I'm not heavy, but theres no point in testing what she can carry, when I can control my weight.

I do think we owe it to our horses to ensure that if we are going to ride them, we help them build the best muscles to make carrying us easier. Thats why I always ensure mine are worked properly, with a good topline.
 
I've owned two 15.1s at the same time. One of them I campaigned successfully round the local SJ to 3'6 and XC to 3', the other I have never ridden. The one I rode was a 10 yo Section D with over 8 inches of bone, the other was a young AA mare with only 7 inches.
 
look up Dr Deb Bennett (if you dare lol!) on the interweb. she's a paleantologist and biomechanics expert-has alot of interesting and unpopular things to say about rider weight and also optimum size for riding horses. she's very knowledgeable and certainly not afraid to say what she thinks.
 
i'm not an engineer, i'm not fat, and i'm not skinny... i'd say i was 'normal' weight. i'm 5'5" and just under 9stone. i'm currently dieting to lose another 10lbs, because i'm carrying a bit of post-baby-flubber on my tummy and bum, and it's not very attractive... but also because i'm getting back on raff after he's had almost a year off (having baby then he broke his leg) very soon.

he's 15.1 hano x polish WB. neither fine nor heavy, but is probably heavier end of the middle range when he's muscled up (his saddle goes up to w/xw when he's fit).

i'm very very conscious of the weight i put on his back, so much so, i chose his saddle as it was the lightest one i could find that fitted.

i don't know why i'm such a worrier about it, but i REALLY do worry. it doesn't help that i've had to learn all about horse's back and anatomy for my saddle fitting and Bowen training and realise how much they AREN'T designed to be ridden... i must get a grip... i'm sure he's fine carrying my weight... *slaps own face*

i think all horse owners have an obligation to their horses to consider what weight they are putting on them, to make sure their saddle fits and disperses that weight correctly. and also that the horse's body is sound (esp back). also, are we as riders 'sound' too? so many people go through life (many getting back people out for their horses) ignoring their own backs/bodies... if we're wonky, any weight we're putting onto the horse is also wonky... which in turn causes them to become wonky... etc.

gah, that was a lecture. soz. :D

in short. yes OP i think about it all the time :)
 
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Donkeys are carrying weight at the walk though, not being asked to jump large fences or perform paiffe & passage, so I don't think a direct comparison can really be made
 
I put my welsh D out on loan as I felt I was too tall and too heavy for her.
I know her inside out and after 4 or 5 years together, she'd served me well and taught me everything...and if I'm honest back then I'd gone a little heavy on the partying and boozing front and had put a fair amount of weight on then. Lost it now, but I still would feel too heavy and big for her.

So yes...I have refused to ride a horse due to weight.

Similar to the bosses daughters pony now...I will ride her on occasion, but she's a fine 14hh arab x native type and I do feel it's far too much weight on her to be fair to ride her more frequently.
 
Binky01 said:
I put my welsh D out on loan as I felt I was too tall and too heavy for her.
I know her inside out and after 4 or 5 years together, she'd served me well and taught me everything...and if I'm honest back then I'd gone a little heavy on the partying and boozing front and had put a fair amount of weight on then. Lost it now, but I still would feel too heavy and big for her.

So yes...I have refused to ride a horse due to weight.

Similar to the bosses daughters pony now...I will ride her on occasion, but she's a fine 14hh arab x native type and I do feel it's far too much weight on her to be fair to ride her more frequently.
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i LOVE the horse in your sig Binky. very very very yummy. x
 
I have lost weight to ride at a particular level and I also consider the weight of a rider on a horse.
The weight issue was most relevant to me when I started eventing on my mum's horse, a 15.2 TB mare, I was on the plus side of 13st, I didn't feel too heavy, but I happened across weight watchers one night and there it was in black and white!
I lost 44lbs in total, and the improvement in xc times and sj scores were noticeable.
I remained slim to ride a 14.2hh (stayed at 9st9lbs) but I found this very difficult to maintain, pony was sold (not because I was too heavy!) and gradually my weight crept up again. I am now a decent constant weight, which I am able to maintain, suits my lifestyle and is reasonable on my horses, however I do have upper weight limits on all my horses and people can be offended when told they are too big to ride them.
 
Because I am fairly short (5'3") I have always been asked to ride ponies - normally ones which have been acting up for their child owners. However, as my own horse is 16hh and I'm not really skinny (just over 8stone) I quite often feel a bit big on anything under 13.2ish. I have 'sat' on a few ponies at 12hh/12.2hh and feel far too big to do anything more than walk/tiny bit of trot. I'm sure I wouldn't do any harm as they have all been native types, but yes, I have quite often refused to ride (certainly refused to jump) small ponies.

I also reschooled an ex-racer (15hh very fine) and felt too big on her too!
 
I've said no to riding some horses because I felt too heavy and have also lost weight in order to ride (I'm still trying to do so).

I stopped riding my pony when I felt I was too heavy for her. She was 13.2hh, 16years old and I was 11stone, this was for very light work only, there's no way at 22 I would let anyone over 8 stone on her now.

At my absolute heaviest I was riding 3 cobs for light schooling and slow hacks they all had more than 9 inches of bone and had good conformation etc but I stopped riding one as I felt too big.

I'm currently bringing my horse back into light work after injury and managed to lose a stone before I started riding and would really like to lose another three stone even though I know he is still able to carry me with ease.(vet/physio/saddler have all confirmed this as I wanted to make sure before restarting ridden work).
 
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I think that there are so many variables involved that it would be difficult to set an exact figure for weight carrying abilities, living tissue can change and bone/ligament/tendon strength varies between individuals. Obviously the lighter the rider the better for the horse, but there is also the issue of conformation, fitness and condition to take into account.
Interestingly there was a study done on endurance horses which found that horses carrying heavier riders managed as well as those with lighter riders; but those carrying extra condition themselves often went lame:- http://www.shady-acres.com/susan/tevis95-96.shtml

also some info here:- http://iceryder.net/weight.html
 
brighteyes said:
Why is it donkeys have a proportionally greater load limit, in spite of their size and build - or is this a myth?
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I'm believe that it is because they have different conformation over their back. Their back is less dipped than a horse, almost roach backed. And roach backed horses are better able to carry weight than sway backed horses, it is just that they are a bu99er to fit saddles for and are often an uncomfortable ride.

It is basic mechanics. An arch shaped bridge carries weight well, better than a flat or u shaped bridge. To do with the application of force and stuff.
 
I agree with touchstone, there are far too many variable to make a simplisitic equation for how much a horse can carry. Basing a judgement on bone alone is just crazy! A horse with 9" bone could have a short dipped back and not be able to carry as much as an Arab with very fine bone who had a strong sprung back.

I watch my weight so I am able to continue to ride my older horse, I don't think it would be fair to put weight on now she's older and still in quite constant work.
 
Is it not also the case that a horse that is well schooled and working properly will be stronger over the back than one which is hollow and on the forehand, and therefore capable of carrying a heavier rider? (assuming both horses are of a similar height and build). I remember an instructor saying something along these lines to me when I was worried about being too big for the pony I was riding at the time.
 
Lenehorse that is true, the best way to demonstrate is get on your hands and knees and put a little kid on your back. If you tense you stomach muscles and lift your back they are quite easy to move with, dipping you back and taking the weight that way is very uncomfortable and makes moving rather precarious!
 
omg now you have all got me worrying!
i bought my horse for me and my daughter, he is a 14.3 cob
my daughters a little skinny thing - im 5ft8 and weigh 13 stones - but my instructor is fab and im sure shed have told me if there was any concerns - wouldnt she????????????
 
narkymare said:
omg now you have all got me worrying!
i bought my horse for me and my daughter, he is a 14.3 cob
my daughters a little skinny thing - im 5ft8 and weigh 13 stones - but my instructor is fab and im sure shed have told me if there was any concerns - wouldnt she????????????
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I'm sure a 14.3 cob will be fine, the Icelandic ponies in the second link I posted are only 13-14 hh and can carry grown men, and I think your instructor would have said if she/he had any concerns.
 
As a rough guide, a mature riding horse(draught breeds can carry less)can comfortably carry 20% of its normal body weight for extended periods.HOWEVER ,the saddle MUST NOT apply more than about 1.5 lbs per square inch of load bearing contact or the circulation in the skin and muscles will be reduced below an acceptable level.
 
Not sure about calculations etc...

But I have refused to ride a horse before now (riding school must have been taking the rip when they asked me to get on an 11hh welsh mountain pony even though I am only 5ft 4!) :mad:

I consciously try and stay the weight I am (about 10st) (or under) because of my girl - she is 14.2hh and is prone to lami, so I hate to think of putting any extra weight on her feet - I'm quite grateful I think if I didn't have her, I'd be eating much more chocolate than I do! :p
 
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