(Rant alert ...!) it's NOT my dog's job ...

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Greylegs

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... To teach your dog some manners!!! That's your job!

I have an 8 year old collie/staffie cross who is generally well mannered but has been known to be a bit grumpy with other male dogs. With that in mind we're always careful to ensure he's well under control if we meet another dog when out and about and do out best to prevent them from sniffing our boy's rear end .... Something dogs do, but which our boy really hates ...! But if one more owner, on being asked to call their dog away, says .... "Oh let him get stuck in, my dog needs to learn some manners. ..." I think I'll strangle them with my dog lead!!!! ARRGH!!

We're trying to ensure our dog doesn't growl or snap at unwanted intruders into his "personal space" but, somehow, other owners think it's ok. Why can't people either get their animals under control or teach them some manners .... Drives me nuts!!!!

.... And breathe .....
 
I feel your pain and sympathise. Sometimes people try harder to get their dogs under control when you tell them that yours has an infectious skin disease that is undergoing treatment. They normally keep their dog away from yours then.
 
california dreaming said:
I feel your pain and sympathise. Sometimes people try harder to get their dogs under control when you tell them that yours has an infectious skin disease that is undergoing treatment. They normally keep their dog away from yours then.
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lol, now that's brilliant!

There was a young boxer in the practice the other day - most laid back youngster ever. In the exam room was another boxer, no relation and just coming out to reception. The man with the boxer (said boxer entire and a bit of a bully) squares up to the youngster and puffed himself up and started growling. Youngster and young girl owner already in a corner. Young boxer stood up a bit taller. Older boxer pushes him back even further, man has arm and lead fully extended to let him Young boxer started to growl and bark in stress. Nurse tells man off for letting this go on (quite rightly) and he says "Well the other dog was standing up to him and he shouldn't have". WTF?! How about not allowing your dog to be a bully and then blaming the other dog for standing up to him!?
 
california dreaming said:
Sometimes people try harder to get their dogs under control when you tell them that yours has an infectious skin disease that is undergoing treatment. They normally keep their dog away from yours then.
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Am amazed that noone in my locality has reported me to the rspca or some other ineffective organisation given the number of times I shout out that one of mine has sarcoptic mange! :D
 
OP, you have my sympathy. We have always had people who allow their dogs to run up out of control in my area but the latest seems to be allowing them then to stand and bark in my dog's face. NO, he is not saying 'hello', he is f-ing and blinding at my dog and if you do nothing to stop it then all of my dogs will tell him off and teach him some manners - some of them being more patient/tolerant than others.
 
Worse, the idiots who tell you their dog is friendly, it's ok, as you frantically shout that yours is DA and would they mind awfully recalling theirs!! Of course, I'd be a terrible person if their dog was attacked. Call me nuts, but I'd object to a stranger bouncing up to me too!
 
Well, I'm glad it's not just me. People just shout "it's ok, he just wants to play...!" As if that makes it ok. I seriously heard this from the owner of a massive Great Dane (I mean, I've seen smaller ponies, it was genuinely huge) as it loped over towards my boy, who's about the size of a springer spaniel.

Never thought of the infectious disease thing though. Good idea. I'll try that some time. 😳
 
I walk a succession of foster dogs with issues in dog walking areas. I teach them to accept a muzzle, teach them to watch me and come back close to me when other dogs come near (they are on a training lead at that stage), put myself in a strong protective stance between them and other dogs. In time when they have relaxed enough I teach them to sit by my side or even behind me when another dog approaches. I have stopped shouting at other people as I found it stopped me concentrating on my dog and was mostly ineffective. I also feel if I will have an antisocial dog, why should I stop other happy dogs from enjoying themselves? Not everybody is good at training dogs, some dogs are new to their owners or too young to be fully trained. In an ideal world we would all be top class trainers with beautifully socialised dogs but we live in the real world. I also wonder how much an owner's aggressive response to the situation winds an already reactive dog up?
 
Bradsmum said:
Sorry but if I knew my dog was likely to object to other dogs in its space in a public area/footpath, I would put a muzzle on it.
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My dog's objection to a 'friendly' dog haring up to him and bouncing in his face is to scream in terror and throw himself on the floor - not sure how muzzling him would help in that situation. Far better to apply a lead to the 'he's only being friendly' dog with no recall and owner half a mile away...
 
planete- what a sensible attitude. I have to say I walk a pack of four and never get issues like this- nor are mine doing things described, but they all walk off lead and dont have issues so maybe other dogs pick up their confidence
 
Bradsmum said:
Sorry but if I knew my dog was likely to object to other dogs in its space in a public area/footpath, I would put a muzzle on it.
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In my own dog's defence, he doesn't object to other dogs most of the time and can be walked safely and calmly off lead the vast majority of the time. He has never started a fight and is not aggressive towards other dogs if they are not aggressive towards him. But there are dogs out there who aggressively and persistently abuse his personal space, and he takes exception to this. It's the owners I have a problem with. When I can see my boy is starting to get worried by the over enthusiastic attentions of their animals, they seem to think that me allowing my dog to growl or snap is somehow going to teach their animals some sort of lesson. Why can they not just call their animals to heal or get hold of them. I always put my dog on a lead if I suspect he's going to be worried.
 
Greylegs- do what I do if I see any potentially problematic dogs - turn and walk the other way sharply (I do this as part of their training so they know that a shouted name and me turning away means come quick or you'll be left behind!) and call your dog. liklihood is your dog will come with you (hopefully!) and the other dog will lose interest.
 
Greylegs, I do understand your concern and frustration.

Today my dog was on the beach playing joyfully with 10 other dogs. All off lead, playing with balls and each other. It was fantastic.

If you had come on to the beach with your dog what should all us other owners have done? Because in my (albeit limited experience) a dog on a lead is a magnet.

I guess I know the answer, but I'm curious.
 
amymay said:
Greylegs, I do understand your concern and frustration.

Today my dog was on the beach playing joyfully with 10 other dogs. All off lead, playing with balls and each other. It was fantastic.

If you had come on to the beach with your dog what should all us other owners have done? Because in my (albeit limited experience) a dog on a lead is a magnet.

I guess I know the answer, but I'm curious.
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In that situation, I would have probably have seen a large group of dogs playing and taken evasive action by walking away until my dog could have his own space to run in. I wouldn't have let him off the lead and I doubt he would have joined in the game anyway. Our dog loves the beach, (woods/fields/ open spaces generally) but his issues began when he was set upon by dogs who "just wanted to play" and ended up with cracked ribs and other injuries. I don't blame him for being wary tbh .....

( ... not sure what you thought I was going to say ...?)
 
Poor boy, no wonder he's wary.

I thought you might have wanted all the dogs called back under some sort of 'more' control.
 
amymay said:
Poor boy, no wonder he's wary.

I thought you might have wanted all the dogs called back under some sort of 'more' control.
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Nope. Not at all. Other dogs are welcome to play and enjoy themselves. They're not welcome to hassle my dog. If that means I have to avoid potentially difficult situations by taking evasive action, then I do. In our area, there's a dog who our boy especially dislikes and we plan the routes and timings of our walks to specifically avoid it, as its owner keeps to a pretty regular routine.
 
Bradsmum said:
Sorry but if I knew my dog was likely to object to other dogs in its space in a public area/footpath, I would put a muzzle on it.
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But my very DA springer needs occupying (or disappears into the woods for 8 hours after deer) so we have spent a lot of time getting him to focus on retrieving, which he adores. This keeps him out of trouble, he doesn't leave my side until I throw the ball, then he searches for it, retrieves it, stays by my side.....He will stay in a sit til told to move despite distractions (unless a dog is in his face).

Today, a lovely man asked if he could let off his extremely bouncy puppy to play with mine :eek3: I had to tell him no, one of mine is not friendly. He said his was. I said mine will attack yours, really sorry, I don't want her injured. We weren't taking up the whole field, we kept moving to avoid other dogs, Zak was very focused, but if another dog came up to him, he'd go for it. Sticking a ball in his gob stops him being quite so nasty, so a muzzle is really pointless. Point being, it's not always the answer.
 
The majority of our walks are in places where I hope we will not meet anyone else, as the more opportunities any reactive dog gets to react/aggress the more ingrained the behaviour becomes. At the same time we do use 'safe' areas to train, where other dogs are most likely to be under control or where we can exit/hide quickly if another dog approaches. Last year I was walking on a very wide rural path when a man came along walking his saluki and talking on the phone. There was about 20 yards width between us, my lad was on a lead and wearing his muzzle and this very friendly Saluki trotted straight up to him sending Sprocket, who had up until the dog came really close been doing really well at focusing on me, in the orbit ! I several times asked the man to call his dog away, he made a couple of half hearted efforts, then I shouted at him ' which part of a dog on a lead and muzzle' do you not understand ! He ran over and sort of apologised, but Sprocket was so over threshold at that point, we just had to go back to the car.
So many people with 'nice' dogs don't realise that a lot of perceived aggression is fear based and the last thing you need is any dog, friendly or not, coming up to your dog. I wish the current trend for dog/dog training programmes on terrestrial TV would flag this up in a way that people understand.
 
If yours is extremely dog aggressive it needs to be muzzled off lead (regardless of other training issues), or walked in private land with no other dogs or walked on lead.
sorry- not acceptable to walk it off lead in dog walking areas un muzzled if it is known to be extremely dog aggressive as if there are so many scenarios that could go pear shaped not just through what you see as badly mannered other dogs running up to him.
Sounds like he needs more training or a long line not to disappear off. you can get muzzles you can still treat with.
 
OP, sorry, but I am going to disagree with you. IT IS your dog's job to teach the ignorant and the ill mannered, their place! Boys tend to learn from men. It's rarely the other way around!

Dogs speak 'dog', and if the owner of the errant and ill-mannered lout who accosted you on your walk can't teach their dog manners, then the best person to do the education bit, is your dog! :)

Alec.
 
Alec Swan said:
OP, sorry, but I am going to disagree with you. IT IS your dog's job to teach the ignorant and the ill mannered, their place! Boys tend to learn from men. It's rarely the other way around!

Dogs speak 'dog', and if the owner of the errant and ill-mannered lout who accosted you on your walk can't teach their dog manners, then the best person to do the education bit, is your dog! :)

Alec.
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Sorry Alec .... not when he ends up with cracked ribs and other injuries as a result. My dog is well mannered, friendly and obedient when those around him are too. As you say, "dogs speak dog" but I don't want my dog to have to be in a position of having to defend himself against what he sees as aggression, just because other owners can't get hold of their own animals. There have been many times i've had my boy on a lead, walking calmly, when he's been accosted by loose dogs belonging to other people in spite of my asking them to call their dogs off. I stand by my view that owners should teach dogs good behaviour, discipline and manners and not rely on other dogs to do it for them.
 
My dogs do educate other rude dogs, its not often another dog wants to take on a male Dobermann but those that do are instantly put in their place. I am not talking really aggressive dogs although if something really wants to fight Diesel he will let them have it, both Darcy & Diesel are very tolerant of other dogs and if they are rude and in their faces and take liberties they will be told that it is not acceptable. They show their teeth,growl and will even pin another dog but will not bite, they have been excellent with all my foster dogs some of whom have no social skills but have learnt as much from them as from me. Darcey was fear aggressive when I had her first as a rescue with her brother Diesel but through training she is the sweetest nature bitch you could wish for and loves to meet other dogs.

My previous Dobermann Fred was a nightmare to begin with, very dog aggressive in that there was no doubting he wanted to kill other dogs, with training around social dogs he learnt and like my 2 current ones he was fine around other dogs and would tell off rude dogs but not fight them.

OP get a good trainer, walk your dogs with other friendly but polite dogs, socialise him as much as possible and do not allow him off lead if there is the slightest chance he would attack another dog, we cant control other peoples dogs but we can train and control ours.
 
It's your problem op if your dog is aggressive with other dogs, not other people. I see so many neurotic owners freaking out as soon as they see any other dogs approaching their dogs. So many times I've heard "he's not good with other dogs". This is how there are so many unsocialised dogs with issues these days as they're never allowed off lead or to interact Normally with their own kind.These issues are usually caused by the owners.
 
GeeGeeboy said:
It's your problem op if your dog is aggressive with other dogs, not other people. I see so many neurotic owners freaking out as soon as they see any other dogs approaching their dogs. So many times I've heard "he's not good with other dogs". This is how there are so many unsocialised dogs with issues these days as they're never allowed off lead or to interact Normally with their own kind.These issues are usually caused by the owners.
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I agree with this, with so many of you on here having the same problem with other dogs it's hard not to think the real issue is the paranoid owners not their pets.....the vast majority of dogs that I meet are totally fine, either say hello or just meander past and I simply don't ever meet dogs that ever cause a problem.
 
To be honest, whilst I do agree with the OP, there are some situations where only a dog will get through to another dog. My friend has a rescue terrier, a border terrier x Patterdale (currently at mine whilst my friend is away), who was never socialised as a younger dog - she is now 2. She is quite a bolshy little madam and can be very gobby, obviously we are working on her dog manners but we recently had a huge helping hand courtesy of our neighbours staffy. We had been chatting to the neighbour about what was going on and he offered to let this staffy meet the terrier, the staffy was an older bitch who tended to mother other dogs. We went out for a walk with the dogs, as predicted the terrier ran up to the staffy gobbing off and bouncing all over her trying to get her to play. The staffy promptly pinned the terrier on her back and told her off, then started playing with her when she had quietened down, any time the terrier was getting too rowdy she put her back in her place. That day has put us weeks ahead in our training hence me thinking it is a good solution to have as a tool, but it should be mutually agreed between both parties beforehand not some random encounter with a strangers dog in the park.
 
bonny said:
I agree with this, with so many of you on here having the same problem with other dogs it's hard not to think the real issue is the paranoid owners not their pets.....the vast majority of dogs that I meet are totally fine, either say hello or just meander past and I simply don't ever meet dogs that ever cause a problem.
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Many times yes, but not always. The terrier on my above post can be a right little cow bag if she takes exception to another dog, and she goes from zero - bitch in less than a second. Both her owner and I are extremely aware of keeping our energy level down as not to affect her in any way.
 
GeeGeeboy said:
This is how there are so many unsocialised dogs with issues these days as they're never allowed off lead or to interact Normally with their own kind.These issues are usually caused by the owners.
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Yep, but to be specific, the first owners. When I'm owner number two doing my very best to rehabilitate a dog that completely missed its critical socialisation window, forgive me if I don't want 'he's only being friendly' setting us back weeks or months of training.

I may be a bit sensitive about this subject at the moment and here's why: back in about October time two off-lead labradors swarmed one of my dogs. I saw them enter the far end of the field and immediately turned round to go another way but they ran the full length of the field to get to us, completely out of the owner's sight. They slammed in to my dog at speed, knocked him off his legs and then pinned him down on the ground. His response was to scream and pee himself in fear. They were not aggressive - no wounds, no puncturing bites - but they were using their combined body weight to knock him about, squash him and were mouthing at his neck and standing on him to pin him down. I kicked one off him, my other dog bit the second and then stood her ground snarling to keep them back.

I was left at the start of the racing season with a sled dog who is now understandably terrified of dogs rushing up behind him. He is not presently safe to race. My other dog is now far quicker to wade in on a potential threat as well. All because one arrogant bloke has failed to adequately train his fat, ill-socialised dogs but still thinks he has the right to inflict them on other people.

Excuse my rant, that one has been stewing for a while!
 
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