Ranting about chifneys + general lack of horsemanship - discuss

[barkinghorse]

I have to say that the only reason i DON'T use a chifney is because i worry what will happen if he gets away from me and stands on the rope...
I have to take Will everywhere in a bridle, as he is a very bolshy 16.3 TB who in the past has jumped on me and run across my back!!
I actually got to a point where i would thread the lead rope threw the headcollar and let him go if he went to dive on me. Now he seems to be a lot better as he's got older, but sometimes i still think about a chifney to stop him going up. Again, it's the worry of possible damage.
Jo xx

 

[filly190]

Quick fix solution which does not stop the actual problem. Training and time would be better, but living in the real world they do give control and safety of a person when handling a difficult horse.

 

[Jemayni]

I really cannot see the problem with chifneys! My horse has only reared whilst being led a few times - but when hes at a show he will just bolt when you're leading w/o a chifney. and I am sorry but I would prefer my horse to inflict an injury on itself to go flying into the crowds of people around the show rings, he could kill someone! Or if I was at a smaller show, he could get on the road, kill himself and drivers! What is the problem with me using a chifney?

 

[emma69]

I have used a chifney before and would again if the circumstance warrented. One of the horses that I used it on was a bad mannered stroppy prat, who had got away with far too much with previous owners. He was big and muscley, a rearer, and he knew it, and I value my, and other people on the yards safety so used a chifney on him. He soon learnt to lead perfectly, and there was no need for it's continued use. In this case it was used to break a bad habit - the bit if used correctly does not come into action unless the horse mis-behaves, sitting in the mouth it is not harsh and doesn't hurt them.

A regular bit is not designed to come into action when you are leading, it is designed to work when you are mounted, on a larger horse you are pulling the bit down, and it won't work properly, which is why they are not used instead of chifneys.

I have also used it on livery horses (with the owner's consent) when I was expected to handle them - as their non-regular care givers, I didn't have the ability to teach them manners, and was not going to put myself / vet / farrier etc in danger if they were known badly behaved horses. To a one, the chifney prevented bad behaviour

 

[Tia]

My quote: [ QUOTE ]
Why a chifney is used is not really relevant - how it is used definitely is!

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Reply:
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Sorry but this is clearly the opposite of all common horse sense . Until you understand the cause you are only dealing with the symptoms.


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Hmm I have no idea what you thought I said, but I reiterate - the reason for using a chifney is neither here nor there. If the horse rears, if the horse barges, if the horse runs its handler down, if the horse swings around to kick, if the horse starts to buck.........any of these examples and many many others are all possible reasons for someone using a chifney. I would think that any decent handler would understand the cause of why their horse does what it does and is taking action to rectify the symptoms and the cause. A totally unmanageable horse may not allow his handler to introduce the frightening thing to him hence he will buck, barge, kick before he has even had gentle introduction to whatever.

No sorry but thinking back on some of the loons I have dealt with - I can't agree with your disdain for chifneys. They are very valuable and give the horse a sharp bringing down to earth and encourage it to think rationally....something which often cannot be accomplished whilst the horse is flying about in the air like a lunatic.

 

[Tia]

[ QUOTE ]
Interesting that most people are also either saying use a chifney or get towed around in a headcollar and rather glossing over the using a bit option.

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Because a chifney is designed for leading - a regular bit is designed for riding in. A normal bit will do absolutely nothing to pull a rearer down - all that will happen is that the bit will fall into the hollow of the mouth and not be touching anything.

 

[Twiglet]

Also - my groom is freelance and her health is her living - she doesn't have the time to reschool other people's bad mannered or sharp horses to prevent herself getting injured. If the owners suggest that their horses are better led in chiffneys, then I believe she is right to use one in order to protect herself and her clients' horses.

 

[teapot]

Yard where I am, I've seen a chifney used a couple of times.

Was for a horse that was having the farrier, and had started to play up. He was being shod (needed doing) in the yard whilst we had a kids summer camp on - he couldn't be done in the other yard as he wasn't to be left on his own. He started acting up, and generally being a prat of 17hh worth of horse. Instructor had to lead him out in the chifney. So from what I know about them (have never used one myself) - they do have a place in the tack room.

Regarding the catching bridle - we used one on the shire x tb who was about 16.3 and had the shire build. At times he was an utter pig to bring in and take out of the field. So just as a safety precaution we used it so that whoever was doing him (normally one of the older, more experienced staff) wasn't going to be dragged, run off with. Also had it for one of the stallys who was a bit loopy at times

 

[Evadiva1514]

I have used chifneys in the past for both horses i have worked with and one of my own horses, and i would definitely use one again in the future. Im afraid like any piece of equipment, everything is open to abuse.

My horse was particularly difficult to handle in certain situations. I couldn't hold him in a headcollar nor a bridle and my last resort was a chifney. After a few sessions in hand he gradually got better and over a period of months i used it less and less. Like another user said the bit does not come into action unless required.

I found a bridle pretty useless when trying to lead barnaby and came to the conclusion that everytime he got away from me he won, so i believe the chifney was one of the turning points in our relationship. I didn't subject him to fear or force. He realised that it was no longer such a good idea to barge and push past me and we became a lot closer as a result of this breakthrough, to the point where i no longer needed it at all.

 

[burtie]

Never owned or used one, always used the horses normal bridle for the odd occaision a bit more control was needed. But then I've never had a horse who reared whilst being lead, other the occaisional very excited youngster.

 

[wizzi901]

not for everyday use I agree but I keep mine in case! i have not had to use it for over 7 years on anything of my own but a couple of friends have needed help with bulshy or pure mucked up animals they have inherited. Usually used as a short term measure to install some sanity and safety for those handling these types. I am pleased to say that usually from that we have then progressed to a pressure halter and again the chifney goes away.

More used for a safety point of view for all concerned and I find horses if they are used CORRECTLY and gently when required you dont do any damage and horse actually knows the boundaries for behavior.

Horses will always be stronger than a human its a simple fact. Going to do much more harm with out of control horse and also that could lead to much more damage in the long run.

THey have their place but I hope they do not become an everyday accessory EVER!

 

[eventingdiva]

We use a chifney on a couple of the horses at a dressage yard i work at. one we use it on is a serious rearer, and he is a lot better with the chifney on. the other is a big, rude, gobby little sod, these horses dont get turned out, and he wont go on the walker or be lunged, so on days he's not ridden he is walked out in hand and allowed to pick on grass. We always use the chifney when doing so otherwise we cannot hold him. he also p*sses around on the end of the lunge line and having the chifney in his mouth certainly helps you out, otherwise he could be quite dangerous. Yes we have tried with his bridle on, but it doesnt have the same effect, and we're not willing to risk ourselves getting hurt, when the chifney is there and ready to be used!
[ QUOTE ]
there are no problem horses.......only problem people

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also, not true, we have and have had some sh*tty horses, we're not perfect, but i dont believe its us, some if them just dont want to work with you x

 

[SpruceRI]

I have used my Chifney several times on my current horse when she was younger. She's used to take upto 5hrs to load in my lorry. Not because she was scared/nervous, just bloody minded. She used to get almost to the top of the ramp, then rear up, spin round and canter off down the footpath with me on the end of the rope. Went from headcollar and rope, to me being on the end of a lunge line, gloves to stop the rope burn, hat for when she pulled me over, then having her in her bridle, lunge line round her nose, over the top of her head, helpers or no helpers - it didn't matter, she always did it.

After much advice, the chifney was suggested. Shoved it in and lead her round in it a bit. Led her up to the ramp, got nearly the whole way up as usual, she stood up, I held the rope as normal. Eventually the chifney took action. She looked surprised, came back down onto 4 feet, and humbly went into the lorry. I don't know who was more shocked, her or me? Anyway, she wore that chifney for about 5 more loads, never reared again, meekly loaded each time and has done ever since. 10yrs later, I still take it where ever I go, but have never needed it.

At the time I used it I was told not to jerk at it, as it can break a horses jaw, so perhaps that's what people mean about being in 'kind hands'?

As far as I'm concerned a naughty horse is/can be a dangerous horse so having good manners is important to me. People do seem too wimpish to instil manners in their horses a lot of the time, thinking they are being kind, which does irk me.

 

[happyhack]

only ever used chifneys on rearing yearlings to get them out of the habit.

 

[Weezy]

And that madhossy explains HOW, in the RIGHT hands, chiffneys can be very useful!

 

[Alibear]

Just a point you'll see people leading perfectly well mannered horses in chiffneys.

The reason if the chiffney isn't there it's not well mannered horses aren't daft and know what they are.

My old mare was loaded in a chiffney for 10 years the occasions we tried without set us back months. (she'd go from loading in 10 mins back to her previous 3hour battle which involved trying to kill any humans, thing was she awalys laoded first time for the trip home in a headcoller!)

I personally find them a doddle to use and very effective.

 

[kick_On]

the offer still stands for you to lead my horse

in headcollar
BUT i'll take bridle option everytime and if he's had box rest out will come chiffney, but i wait to be proved wrong

My old farrier, first time he shod horse refused to put bridle on and he was tanked off with

he never did that again

IMO you have to have more horsemanship know how, to know when to use chiffney correctly, not less

 

[annaellie]

Why use a chiffney, I bought a 17.2 tb gelding who used to rear and box down on you I knew this before I bought him the staff on the yard were terrified of him and he had excellent breeding and I bought him for next to nothing they just wanted rid as he was dangerous to every one around him. I tried all sorts of things and had the opinion chiffneys were cruel. till one day this horse reared and boxed down spun and began bucking at me and got away I had tried all sorts of bits by this time i moved onto another yard and the yo owner who i had known for years said either put it in a chiffney or move him as he was wild I reluctantly put him in one and never looked back 1 year later he was completley out of it and walked by anyones side like a gentle giant. They might not be the nicest of bits but you have to look at the whole pitcure of why someone would choose to use one in my case it was the saftey of the handlers others on the yard and the saftey of the horse.

 

[Sparklet]

Never used a chifney but had the very good fortune to own very well mannered horses. However saying that I would definitely use one if necessary.

Our field is 400m down a muddy dark track and on a wet, windy evening bringing in is not a barrell of laughs. My exceptionally well mannered horses will not run beyond the pull of the headcollar - and may dance about a bit but will not go up nor run over the handler.

A friend of mine was asked to bring in a little 13.1 pony - half way back he set his neck and ran. She got dragged along behind him until she twisted her ankle and had to let him go. He frequently breaks away from his owner and only last week managed to get down the drive onto the road. This pony knows he can get away and would be an ideal candidate for a chifney - it is dangerous to have him careering round the yard and he is only a little fella. Imagine if he were 17.2

For those worried about the horse breaking away and standing on the rope - why dont you loop it through and hold both ends so it will come free if the horse gets away?