Reforming an old stubborn mare

S

snurse

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I want an opinion here: Brief history, broodmare was 9 when I bought her, very people-oriented, extremely handleable but unbacked. Backed her at 9. She accepted saddle and bridle and weight on her back without a murmur =- she'd accept almost anything from a person she liked and she seemed to like me. But, she didn't like being ridden - she'd refuse to go forward, or spin you off etc. I struggled with her for 2 years trying everything from softly, softly to a pretty good whacking. I hated giving up but I did. I admit it, she beat me. I put her back into foal.
Now, once her latest foal is weaned, she'll be nearly 15. I thought time might mellow her but rather her manners are worse. She barges and won't be led. Not only is she physically strong, she is far and away the strongest-willed animal I've ever met. Everything she does is on her own terms. She still loves people, and especially me. She comes whickering across the field to me, she shows a lot of jealousy if I go to another horse, etc.
My question is (got to it eventually): do you guys think there's the slightest chance of starting her all over again? Manners, backing and riding? I love her dearly, but I would love to ride her. I suspect the answer at her age is that she won't change, and she is as she is. But maybe one of you has had a similar problem?
 
Try to get hold of anything written by Mark Rashid - inspirational in the quiet way he talks the reader through finding a way for the HORSE to realise there's a better way. Rooted in thinking like a horse, steely determination (ie MORE than your mare has) and CONSISTENCY. I think she can still be turned around but it will take time. Not even sure I'd take her back to the beginning. She knows the basic stuff but just doesn't feel like doing it. Why should she? No-one has ever made her! I'd find ONE (easy) thing that isn't acceptable and get that sorted. Then the next, then the next. Good luck!
 
I'm not sure it would be worth the effort, but it can be done. You just need to be a stronger character than she is...and I've found old mares don't respond to force or coercion but do respond to persuasion/manipulation!
Can I just ask why did anyone breed from a mare with such a temperament - and are her babies the same?
S
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I think it sounds like some confusion on the original backing process, and she has found a way to avoid it very well!! If it was me i would go back to your groundwork and long rein, longrein, longrein really teaching her to go forward on her own, only when you have got complete respect on the ground in all manor of things would i consider riding her.
 
She's was bred from because she's a graded Dales. Her foals have some of her temperament - mischievous, people-loving, but not her willfulness. Or, if they have, they are so much younger they don't get away with it. The mare was used to ruling the roost for a long time. If I'd caught her younger she'd have been no trouble, I'm sure. It's only MY willfulness that makes me want to have another go - I've got another horse who's a darling to ride.
 
Guess what - I had the Mark Rashid books and lent them to someone. Who then moved away. You know the rest! Will buy them again.
 
Of course you can sort her out, at least to some extent, but it won't be a walk in the park. She's run her life her way for a very long time and from her point of view why should she listen to you? Do you know much about horse society? She's boss mare. That has nothing to do with being agressive or "alpha" (a dog/pack term and nothing to do with horses anyway) it has to do with making good decisions, being a firm leader, and not putting up with any crap from the lowers down. So from her point of view you trying to teach her manners is you, a social inferior, talking back to you. She's not refusing to acknowledge your authority, from her point of view you HAVE no authority. Since things like being saddled don't necessarily "mean" anything to a horse and she sound a naturally brave and accepting animal, that sort of thing just might not annoy/upset her. Very high up horses are often very good about things like that because nothing scares them. Including you.

My advice, honestly, is to get her assessed by a trainer who will work with you from time to time. The mare needs to meet someone who is just as good as she is at reading the social situation and enforcing their will to knock her out of her complete assumption that she is ruler of the roost. This has NOTHING to do with being brutal or force or anything else of that ilk. Quite the opposite - the last thing you want to do is fight with her as odds are she'll win and further confirm her beliefs. It's about psychology.

I'm not saying you need some great trainer standing over you, just someone to make the mare a little less sure and bolster your own position. It's almost impossible to just learn that sort of thing by reading, although Mark Rashid (and a few similar authors) is definitely very useful as backgound research and an education in how horses "tick".
 
Thank you - I know you're right. When we were trying to ride her , the only one who could was my instructor who is both strong-willed and a very strong rider. Even she had a rare old battle with her. As far as leading etc. now, she reads very well who she can play up and who she can't - e.g. she tends to walk properly for men! She's too clever for her own good, but I'm rather ashamed I gave up on her. She knows it too - she behaves worst for me. Mind, then she's all lovey-dovey with me. I'm afraid she's got most humans twisted round her little finger (if she had such a thing).
 
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