Reschooling ex riding school pony, advice/ideas needed!

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piggyinablanket

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Any one done something similar?
I have the most adorable boy, a 14.1 chunky Newfie X. He has been in a riding school most of his life and he is now with me permanantly. He has been here 8 weeks and is Mum/daughter share.

Now, his problem is that he is 'typical' ex riding school. He is completely dead to the leg, very stubborn, and knows every trick in the book. He hated hacking, would go sooo slow, and would nap dreadfully and reverse. He would simply stop whilst riding and refuse to go forward. He ignores legs, and whip.

So heres my problem. 8 weeks in. I have solved the hacking mostly. He will hack on his own now, but continues to go at a snails pace ignoring legs, flapping, whip, anything! Any tips to get him to walk on? I know he can ! I do praise him but he just seems so bored.
Other than that he is now fab to hack. (If hard work at times even in company)

Schooling is a REAL challenge. I can get him to go, but he hates it. He falls in on the left rein and as he ignores leg aids and whip its so hard to keep him out grr Any ideas?
I can canter him, but any light rein contact at all, (even asking for a circle) means stop. I have to use tonnes of leg and I hate that, it seems like we are not solving the problem by squeezing/kicking :(

We have tried to make it 'fun' I take him different places to school, but it doesnt help. We get the cones out, try gymkhana etc, to no avail. He does love to jump, and does that enthusiastically but I cant jump him all the time. *sigh*

Any ideas or experiences anyone?? I would love to take him to shows next year so we need to sort out his schooling to a certain point! Do you think theres hope? :/


Oh by the way, he is worked 6 days a week varied stuff, so I would say he is semi fit I dont think its a fitness problem. He never breaks a sweat!

TY xx
 
just a suggestion off the top of my head;

when you feel him slowing or need him jazzing up! can you not just pop 1 jump - school... and just entertain him that way??

only thing i can think of as i had the opposite problem re-schooling my last one of getting him to slow down...!
 
To stop the Horse being dead to the leg you need to use the legs as little as possible. Ive seen too many people constantly kicking and getting now where as the horse is turned off. I now use and teach riders to use the lightest aids. First a gentle squeeze and voice, then a harshered squeeze, if no response simply expode and do whatever it takes to get them moving (legs, spur, whip, voice, arms) as soon as speed increases just sit quitely again. This generally shocks the horse into moving and after a few goes they being to learn to go from the lightest touch. People who see me ride say its like jekkle and hyde. Once they go from the lightest aid remembe to only use legs when needed, and dont nag, as soon as you nag with legs you are undoing all your previous hard work to get them forwards off the leg.
 
Thanks Jack 9, I could, but between jumps he goes back to lazy! its typical, dash at the jump, do a lovely one, then back to walk. lol. Could try it though, thanks!

miss_molly, yes, thats the problem. I hate seeing constant flapping/kicking and worse, whipping I just think it doesnt work. I want him to 'want' to be ridden! He does listen to voice, so I will try that along with the gentle approach. Great thoughts, thanks!

ETA I hope no one is around when I have to 'explode' though, I may use norty words lmao!
 
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Have you tried not schooling him for a while? Maybe giving him a bit of a break from it will let him chill out after presumably a lot of time being ridden in a school. After letting him have some time out from it, I would try long reining him to begin with, as you can drive him from behind and not from the leg, so he won’t be used to this and won’t be immune to it. I’d also try lunging, as you can again drive him from behind with the whip and use your voice to encourage him. Once he’s going nicely, then I would start riding him in the school again. In the meantime I would still hack out but try to vary what you do if that’s possible so he won’t get bored – trot/canter in different places, take as many different routes as possible, ride your usual route backwards if you can.

I have a similar problem with laziness and my instructor has been getting me to focus on it for a few weeks. My horse had a tendency to slow right down once on the bit so he didn’t have to work hard (sneaky cobs!). What I’ve been doing is literally every time my horse slows down when collected I’ve been giving him a flick with a schooling whip and disregarding the collection in favour of the pace; eventually, I’ve been using the whip less and am beginning to get pace and collection. The first lesson I did this felt a bit out of control but I kept using the leg and the whip, then praising immediately when he responded, even if he moved up a gear instead of just moving at the same gait. I felt a bit mean to begin with, but once he got the idea that he would get driven forward when he slowed down, so he is now maintaining the pace. I don’t mean you should be beating him, lol, I just mean a flick with a schooling whip up to three times if there’s no response, then praising when he does respond.

Another idea is taking him hunting. Cubbing (sorry, autumn hunting) is on at the moment and is designed for horses/riders/hounds that are new to the game, so is a bit quieter than hunting and usually has no jumping and it would be an ideal time to start him. Contact your local hunt secretary to find out some dates; you’ll find them here: http://www.mfha.org.uk/
That should help liven him up! :D
 
I read a good article in Horse and Rider/Your Horse about this problem, and I think the Guinea Pig was someone who posts on here.

The trainer got them to use what they called a wip ***, which was like a big fly whisk thing, so all tassled.

What they did was they had to send the horse forward, and if he ignored the normal gentle squeeze then the rider let looses waving the wip *** about and whooping to get the horse moving. They key was moving forward, didn't matter too much what pace or anything. Then they stopped and the horse was expected to keep moving until asked to stop, when he dropped behind the leg they let loose with the wip *** again until the horse learned that he needed to keep going.

It is the same basic principle that I was taught to use with school horses that are dead to the leg (by a few different instructors including a FBHS) except they didn't suggest a wip ***, the horse got a crack on the bum followed by one on the shoulder followed by one on the bum with a long schooling whip in quick succession. This seems to be more effective than just one smack with horses that are used to getting a tap behind the leg at the RS it is commonly referred to as "rattling their cage a bit" and only needs doing once or twice to prove you mean business.

The key is consistency. You must never let him dawdle and never nag, riding school horses are cunning and will do their best to make you do more work than them!
 
muffino, excellent advice, and much appreciated, thanks! Tried lunging but it didnt have the desired effect, he turns to me and stops even if you wrap the lunge whip round his ar*e he wont move! He will lunge with a rider on board, hes not daft! I have never long reined but I may have to learn :) He is only schooled about one a week ATM its mostly hacking.

Katt, I read about whip wops so made one and tried. He ignored it completely!! Even swinging it about my head didnt even make him look LOL!
 
Crikey he is a hard case!

Try the long schooling whip (one in each hand if necessary) and do the bum/neck/bum thing (it has to be fast). A growl or similar vocal aid at the same time would probably help.

I think Muffininio is right though, I'd give him a complete break from the school if he is that jaded. Some do get that bad. A pony I used to ride was retired aged 16 from the riding school, he wasn't unsound but starting to show his age and wasn't enjoying himself (being a pain, planting in the school or on hacks, refusing jumps etc etc) so they turned him away at grass as a companion. He came back for a "holiday" a year or so later and was like a different horse, keeping up to the lead horse on hacks and really very forward. When he retired you couldn't get him to move for love nor money - chasing him, throwing things at him, nothing worked. He was just stale.

I'd give him a break, make a big fuss of him and spoil him, just hacking and fitness permitting do some hunting, fun rides, xc etc maybe even take him to some gallops or the beach with a horse than can really shift so he can learn to open up a bit.

Check his feed too, and make sure he has enough energy for the work. Also make sure that his back/tack/teeth etc are ok.
 
This is worked for me and my ex riding school pony.

1. Absolutely no school work for 6 months. Most lateral work can be done out hacking anyway......

2. Hack alone and with friends - and make sure all rides are super fun and quick.

3. Hunting - my little mare took to it like a duck to water, and it was the making of her.

4. Sponsored / fun rides - again all a bit fast and furious.

Essentially most riding school horses stop thinking forward - and your aim is to get the fun back in to life and almost get them a bit too wizzy.

Until you get them 'thinking' forward you can kick and beat to your hearts content - all you'll do is make them deader to the leg and more resentfull.

You are in for the long hall - but time and patience are your friends - and this time next year you will be reaping the rewards.
 
if he is fit, i do this with my horse as he is very dead to leg and bored very easily, lucky the school i use is on the edge of the wood, i don't want to keep using my spurs as he will get used to that... i do 10 mins in the school, then a quick trot down the lane in to the woods, then back in the school for 15mins and so on, this spices things up for him and it defo works!!

i would also give him a rest for a week or two. if he is fit then it won't be drastic just leaving him in the field for 10 days and then coming back to work might be more exciting... and similar thing happened to my friends horse, he got expelled from 5 stables and she turned him out for a month and he was like a different horse!!

also, what r u feeding him??
hope this helps
 
No probs, you have my sympathy with a lazy, clever pony, lol! With the lunging, is there anyone who could walk with him to begin with, so he gets the idea that turing into you is not an option? This may take some time but it's worth persevering with.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about schooling a the moment and would focus on getting him moving out hacking first. Then once he's got the idea, try the same methods in the school, although this may be a few months down the line.

Long reining is well worth learning and I've always found it helpful when breaking/schooling. In fact, I may do some tonight :)

As others said, also try a few fun rides, beach rides, hacking alone and in company.

I would definately try getting him to a few hunt meets - if that doesn't put a rocket up his bum, nothing will lol! :D
 
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amymay said:
This is worked for me and my ex riding school pony.

1. Absolutely no school work for 6 months. Most lateral work can be done out hacking anyway......

2. Hack alone and with friends - and make sure all rides are super fun and quick.

3. Hunting - my little mare took to it like a duck to water, and it was the making of her.

4. Sponsored / fun rides - again all a bit fast and furious.

Essentially most riding school horses stop thinking forward - and your aim is to get the fun back in to life and almost get them a bit too wizzy.

Until you get them 'thinking' forward you can kick and beat to your hearts content - all you'll do is make them deader to the leg and more resentfull.

You are in for the long hall - but time and patience are your friends - and this time next year you will be reaping the rewards.
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Fab advice!!! Agree completely!!!
 
Have you tried riding in spurs?

Not to use more force, but I have found some riding school horses respond well to lightly used spurs just because they are different from what they are used to. If you do try them do not be tempted to get rough with them, if they don't have an effect take them off.

One at the RS I got to can be a right bu99er - typical riding school knows every trick in the book type, but if you pop on a pair of spurs and a double bridle he turns from crafty naughty cob into superstar dressage pony :rolleyes:
 
Thank you all so much! Some great advice. I dont actually feed him anything other than honeychop at themoment, and the odd apple and carrot, as the grass goes I could try feed. He is a good doer so I will have to be careful. It may be an idea to stop the schooling, I have to ride in the paddocks and winter + wet paddocks = no schooling anyway! I will keep hacking daily though or he will end up like a marshmallow pony!
this is he BTW
No surprise if I say this was a jumping session, lol (novice daughter riding) This is what is frustrating as he CAN move!
charlie038.jpg

charlie087.jpg

I will certainly heed the advice, heres hoping it works, as we just adore this pony!
 
Oh to add, I have never hunted ever, and have nobody to go with and no transport :( For some reason it scares me, I have this image of gung-ho horses/riders and me falling off a lot LMAO!
And i cant use spurs. I have a terrible habit of turning my toes out and my lower leg shoots back all the time (grr) I wouldnt use spurs until I can pack that in! ( a whole other thread there lol)
 
I think the best think you could do would be to give him a complete break from schooling as you won't achieve anything whilst he is ignoring you. Keep persevering with the hacking - you can practise transitions on a hack to improve his responsiveness. Also, why not try doing something different with him such as lungeing? You can them train him to go forwards using voice commands. Also, I think just spending a lot of time with him on the ground will help him to trust you as riding school horses aren't used to having that one to one attention. Handle him sensitively and he will start to respect you. 8 weeks isn't very long at all, so I'm sure with time as you get used to each other you will see an improvement.

Hope this helps. :)
 
Sounds just like my first lad; he doesn't stop and laugh when you hit him, does he? I had to do the jeckell and hyde thing; it ended up with me being the only one who could get him moving. Try cross country with him, it might just be his thing, then do lateral to encourage him to move away from your leg.
 
He sounds quite a lot like my horse and it is a really difficult problem to overcome. I think I'm only really just starting to get there after 8 years of owning her, but we can now do walk to canter transitions which is a real achievement.

I had a lesson with Your Horse magazine and a lady called Nicole Golding who is a Monty Roberts trained instructor. It was very interesting and if you PM me your email address I can send you a couple of the articles she gave me on dealing with horses that are dead to the leg. Here is her website http://www.whisperingback.co.uk/

I haven't really continued with the methods she taught but it was food for thought and has made me ride my horse differently.
 
amymay said:
This is worked for me and my ex riding school pony.

1. Absolutely no school work for 6 months. Most lateral work can be done out hacking anyway......

2. Hack alone and with friends - and make sure all rides are super fun and quick.

3. Hunting - my little mare took to it like a duck to water, and it was the making of her.

4. Sponsored / fun rides - again all a bit fast and furious.

Essentially most riding school horses stop thinking forward - and your aim is to get the fun back in to life and almost get them a bit too wizzy.

Until you get them 'thinking' forward you can kick and beat to your hearts content - all you'll do is make them deader to the leg and more resentfull.

You are in for the long hall - but time and patience are your friends - and this time next year you will be reaping the rewards.
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Baa
 
Oooh and also I would second peoples recommendation of hunting. It really isn't scary and I'm a wimp most of the time. In having a go I think I found my horses calling in life and it is amazning how much she has perked up already after our first days cubbing this year. It teaches them that going forwards is fun.
 
Wonderfull advice from AmyMay.
I would just add that come sapring when you do take him back in the school,do it when you have te arena to yourself and do fun things(PC games,jumping ect) so that once you have him thinking forward again you can translate it to the school enviroment.
 
I put my TB mare on loan to a college, she was well school and enjoying life before she went, she returned after 4 weeks hating life, dead to the leg, hard in the mouth and didnt even want to see me if i had food for her. I turned her out in a field at home and just left her there to be a horse again, to graze and do what she wanted to do. I went everyday to see her but i only stood at the gate, didnt go up to her. After 2 months of this she started comming to the gate when i was there. She did this for a week and i then decided to bring her in a few times a groom her. After that i just got straight back to ridding her (after having teeth and back checked (her back was sore)) we she never looked back.

So what im trying to say is that maybe let him hav a holiday? Just be a horse, do what he wants to do, it might give him his sparkle back?

Also totally agree with amymay.
 
Thanks Guys, It all makes sense. I guess in a way he has been a bit of a project, I wanted to get him reschooled and going well without actually considering whether he needed a break or really wanted to or not bless him. He has bonded smashing, no doubt about it, he comes straight to me in the field, he wouldnt be caught the first 2 days but now he is waiting for his hack in the morning :) Im sure he will come right now I have some great info/help, He is with us forever all being well so theres no hurry. Looking at this rain there will be no schooling in the paddock for quite some time now!!!
 
Do you reckon theres any chance its a tack issue? Many ex riding school ponies end up with horridly sore mouths so any pressure on the bit tends to make them stop, it also stops them working forwards aswell.

Could you try riding in a headcollar? - I'm aware I may get shot for the suggestion.

Would you considering turning away this til maybe march? give the poor bu99ar a break ?
 
artysteph said:
?????? :/

Thanks Aniseed thats great! Have Pm'd you
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NP is agreeing with me - Baa like a sheep :D

And would also agree with ensuring correctly fitting tack - if you've not alleady done this with a master saddler.

I would also add - don't turn him away. Keep him in work - albeit light for a while if you prefer. Clip him out in the winter and ride him as much as you can. Colder weather makes many horses more on their toes - and the lazier horse finds a less warm climate easier and more inverating. So again, it will be easier to get him going forward.
 
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