Rescuers create horses that need rescued.

Kaylum said:
Really my point has been missed breeding for meat is unnecessary no horse needs to end up being killed in a slaughter house. It's the worlds worst place for a horse to end up. I have plenty of knowledge thanks.
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If you think a slaughterhouse is 'the world's worst place for a horse to end up' you are extremely naive/ill-informed.
Seriously, do your research; you owe it to your horses.
S :)
 
doriangrey said:
This original post makes me angry - :/. I know in my head it makes perfect sense - but rather than having a pop at the odd person who makes what seems an irrational rescue ... just for one second put yourself in the boots of the rescuee. Makes a huge difference to their - not insignificant life. I'm finding it hard at the moment to reconcile what seems to be criticism levelled in this way.
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1. It's not 'the odd person' anymore; there's a growing market for 'rescue' animals.
2. I'm sure a lot of the 'rescuers' do feel good about themselves - but this is at the expenses of, rather than in the cause of equine welfare. Surely they could forego the 'you are such a lovely person, hun' adulation for the sake of the horses they purport to love?
You know it makes rational sense.
S :)
 
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The created that's get a few poor horses, advertise then fleece people is not good. I'm a soft touch too so yes I would probably get sucked in... As for horses going for slaughter, healthy nothing wrong with them yes that is wrong but over bred bad conformation and often poor ill stock why not? Are first highland was rescued from slaughter as thank god potters refused to put down a mare in foal. Emerald gave us 18 years of pleasure before we lost her. All the other trekking ponies were destroyed a great waste and now thank goodness the highland world does not allow this . But dart moors, welshies and new forests all have this.
 
Highlands said:
The created that's get a few poor horses, advertise then fleece people is not good. I'm a soft touch too so yes I would probably get sucked in... As for horses going for slaughter, healthy nothing wrong with them yes that is wrong but over bred bad conformation and often poor ill stock why not? Are first highland was rescued from slaughter as thank god potters refused to put down a mare in foal. Emerald gave us 18 years of pleasure before we lost her. All the other trekking ponies were destroyed a great waste and now thank goodness the highland world does not allow this . But dart moors, welshies and new forests all have this.
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Why is it wrong to send a healthy horse to slaughter? The cows, sheep and pigs we send to slaughter are healthy.
 
I agree, Highlands, with the point I think you are making; there is an over-supply at the meat quality end of the market. We need to reduce incentives to the breeders, rather than rewarding them with cash.
S :)
 
Moomin1 said:
Why is it wrong to send a healthy horse to slaughter? The cows, sheep and pigs we send to slaughter are healthy.
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Nothing, I would much rather a horse had a dignified end then a an uncertain future, just could be a waste as someone might indeed be looking for that animal type and it could gave many hours of pleasure. Just don't like anything being seen as a disposable asset and a easy option.
 
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Shilasdair said:
I agree, Highlands, with the point I think you are making; there is an over-supply at the meat quality end of the market. We need to reduce incentives to the breeders, rather than rewarding them with cash.
S :)
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And increase the incentives to responsible breeders in doing so.
 
Shilasdair said:
I agree, Highlands, with the point I think you are making; there is an over-supply at the meat quality end of the market. We need to reduce incentives to the breeders, rather than rewarding them with cash.
S :)
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An incentive also to geld too, many are left not castrated as its expensive and more than the animals resell value.
 
Highlands said:
Nothing, I would much rather a horse had a dignified end then a an uncertain future, just could be a waste as someone might indeed be looking for that animal type and it could gave many hours of pleasure. Just don't like anything bring seen as a disposable asset and a easy option.
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Of course there are good animals who have potential going to slaughter. However, we have too many horses in this country and not enough homes. Therefore, there are thousands of horses in the midst of a welfare crisis, who are suffering. We cannot help them all, it is just not possible. We should not be lining the pockets of those who are multiplying and multiplying these horses without any thought for their welfare. They shouldn't be disposable but it is a sad fact of our current situation, that many of them will have to be. It's heart breaking :(
 
Shilasdair said:
1. It's not 'the odd person' anymore; there's a growing market for 'rescue' animals.
2. I'm sure a lot of the 'rescuers' do feel good about themselves - but this is at the expenses of, rather in the cause of equine welfare. Surely they could forego the 'you are such a lovely person, hun' adulation for the sake of the horses they purport to love?
You know it makes rational sense.
S :)
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Tbh .. seriously if anything is being 'rescued' (horse, cat, dog, goldfish.. whatever) as long as it is being 'rescued' with the appropriate knowledge, kindness and the funds to do it ... then why the judgement? There have already been posts on here from people who have not been able to rehome animals due to what may seem unreasonable demands about sleeping arrangements, turnout, fencing (not from me I might add). What the **** is going on when you can't give a lost life a home without it turning into some kind of witch hunt? Is a 'rescue' life more important in some way than a 'meat colt', 'brood mare' ... etc etc? Who decides which is the most important, is it the monetary value against emotional value?
 
Nothing wrong with slaughtering a horse for meat and I would hope it was healthy if it is destined for the human food chain. Far better for it to be slaughtered here than to be transported live abroad in horrific conditions.

'Rescuing' a meat colt is no different than buying a puppy farmed pup as already mentioned, it just makes room for more, simple, and the one pocketing the money just produces more because it gets him or her cash. A very straightforward equation. It's not judging, it's something that shouldn't occur because it's a perpetual cycle which ensures it keeps happening. :frown3:
 
doriangrey said:
Tbh .. seriously if anything is being 'rescued' (horse, cat, dog, goldfish.. whatever) as long as it is being 'rescued' with the appropriate knowledge, kindness and the funds to do it ... then why the judgement? There have already been posts on here from people who have not been able to rehome animals due to what may seem unreasonable demands about sleeping arrangements, turnout, fencing (not from me I might add). What the **** is going on when you can't give a lost life a home without it turning into some kind of witch hunt? Is a 'rescue' life more important in some way than a 'meat colt', 'brood mare' ... etc etc? Who decides which is the most important, is it the monetary value against emotional value?
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The point is, that people buying these neglected ponies from their unscrupulous creators means there's a market. Therefore, the 'breeder' continues to allow more and more and more foals to be born and neglected. It's a vicious cycle.

Would you buy a puppy from a puppy farm?
 
Casey76 said:
Many times the colts end up in worse places with their "rescuer" than if they had been sent to a quick, painless end at an abattoir.
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But the same can be said of any inexperienced buyer of any horse. I would rather advocate an experienced horseperson who has the expertise and financial means to secure the future of a "rescue" horse than a "pony for christmas" type buyer acquire a horse from a reputable seller. I dont think it necessarily follows that meat man = good, "rescue home" = bad.
 
doriangrey said:
Tbh .. seriously if anything is being 'rescued' (horse, cat, dog, goldfish.. whatever) as long as it is being 'rescued' with the appropriate knowledge, kindness and the funds to do it ... then why the judgement? There have already been posts on here from people who have not been able to rehome animals due to what may seem unreasonable demands about sleeping arrangements, turnout, fencing (not from me I might add). What the **** is going on when you can't give a lost life a home without it turning into some kind of witch hunt? Is a 'rescue' life more important in some way than a 'meat colt', 'brood mare' ... etc etc? Who decides which is the most important, is it the monetary value against emotional value?
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Firstly, many rescuers don't have the appropriate knowledge, or the long term interest to commit to looking after these animals. I have lost track of the number of behaviourally difficult 'rescues' which are advertised free to a good home due to 'a change in circumstances'. They are nearly always 'not novice ride' and yet are of such poor type and quality that no experienced rider would be interested in them. Better they not be rescued.

We need to value all lives - by not funding indiscriminate breeding of low quality horses 'rescues' in an already saturated market.

S :)
 
Fun Times said:
But the same can be said of any inexperienced buyer of any horse. I would rather advocate an experienced horseperson who has the expertise and financial means to secure the future of a "rescue" horse than a "pony for christmas" type buyer acquire a horse from a reputable seller. I dont think it necessarily follows that meat man = good, "rescue home" = bad.
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But financially secure experienced horse people/ decent riders won't touch these low end rescues with a barge pole. Ex racehorses, yes, because they'll do a job for them.
Not usually these natives/cobs.
S :)
 
Fun Times said:
But the same can be said of any inexperienced buyer of any horse. I would rather advocate an experienced horseperson who has the expertise and financial means to secure the future of a "rescue" horse than a "pony for christmas" type buyer acquire a horse from a reputable seller. I dont think it necessarily follows that meat man = good, "rescue home" = bad.
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It matters not whether 'some' of the 'rescuers' of these horses are experienced horse people. The point is they are keeping the market going, which in turn will mean that the bunny hugging, no idea people out there are still able to 'rescue' more. As I said earlier, it's a case of 'save a life, condemn hundreds of others to neglect'.
 
doriangrey said:
Tbh .. seriously if anything is being 'rescued' (horse, cat, dog, goldfish.. whatever) as long as it is being 'rescued' with the appropriate knowledge, kindness and the funds to do it ... then why the judgement? There have already been posts on here from people who have not been able to rehome animals due to what may seem unreasonable demands about sleeping arrangements, turnout, fencing (not from me I might add). What the **** is going on when you can't give a lost life a home without it turning into some kind of witch hunt? Is a 'rescue' life more important in some way than a 'meat colt', 'brood mare' ... etc etc? Who decides which is the most important, is it the monetary value against emotional value?
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We'll put Doriangrey!
In fact you could argue that rehousing from a rescue centre perpetuates the problem, and let's face it, not all the rescue centres are that brilliant.
 
Shilasdair said:
Hi all
Please don't buy rescues, as you are creating the demand for them, which unscrupulous suppliers/dealers will profit from.

I understand that you do it with the best of intentions (and a certain feel good factor from posting about your good deeds, perhaps).

But think - the supplier is using your 'fuel' money or '£50 fee' to produce the next larger crop of neglected, ecto and endoparasite-ridden, malnourished and badly conformed equidae thanks to your help. You are colluding in equine misery. :(

If they are well cared for meat horses - let them go for meat. If they are not, report the owners to the police, BHS, WHW, Etc, and let action be taken against them to prevent a recurrence.

Please don't fund this.
S :)
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1st Point - We are getting to the point with these ponies where we are being "played". I think there is now a trend in rescues and the "20 colts to go for meat unless . . . " is a sick twisted way for these people to get rid of their unwanted, sick etc animals so they can just breed more.

2nd Point - having had the misfortune to see some poor poor animals being starved, denied vet treatment etc etc very recently - you are misguided if you think any of the authorities "will act to prevent a reoccurance".

I have no moral problem with horses going for meat - however the current situation with meat ponies is that they are not regulated in any form. DEFRA are not interested because they are not " farm" animals.

Trading Standards are not interested in checking any passports or chips - i have this in writing.

So yes, we're not stupid, we know the score but until there is something that prevents animals being treated this way - let's save a few from the misery.

PS the lady who saved the pony hardly sounds like a frigging novice, she's got the room and obviously the TLC so why not ?
 
Moomin1 said:
It matters not whether 'some' of the 'rescuers' of these horses are experienced horse people. The point is they are keeping the market going, which in turn will mean that the bunny hugging, no idea people out there are still able to 'rescue' more. As I said earlier, it's a case of 'save a life, condemn hundreds of others to neglect'.
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My response was not related to this principle and was specifcally drafted to avoid anyone assuming it was. It was instead directed at the specific post that implied rescuers give the horse a poorer destination than the meatman. My response was that this is not necessarily accurate.
 
Shilasdair said:
But financially secure experienced horse people/ decent riders won't touch these low end rescues with a barge pole. Ex racehorses, yes, because they'll do a job for them.
Not usually these natives/cobs.
S :)
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Not true! Wouldn't touch an ex-racehorse but would definitely go for a native or cob.
 
cobgoblin said:
We'll put Doriangrey!
In fact you could argue that rehousing from a rescue centre perpetuates the problem, and let's face it, not all the rescue centres are that brilliant.
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Are you for real?! How does rehoming from a rescue centre perpetuate the problem in any way whatsoever?! Rescue centres (reputable ones anyway) do not line the pockets of the unscrupulous breeders and dealers of these horses. If anything, they do everything in their power to strip them of their business.
 
Shilasdair said:
But financially secure experienced horse people/ decent riders won't touch these low end rescues with a barge pole. Ex racehorses, yes, because they'll do a job for them.
Not usually these natives/cobs.
S :)
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And the experienced people who would buy low end horses to bring on and sell don't because the market is so skewed by these throwaways that it's impossible to make any money by properly producing even the slightly better made ones.

It's the same with ex racers these days. So many of them available free or for peanuts, that it's impossible to find a good home at a price that makes them worth retraining. I gave up buying them for that reason.
 
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cobgoblin said:
We'll put Doriangrey!
In fact you could argue that rehousing from a rescue centre perpetuates the problem, and let's face it, not all the rescue centres are that brilliant.
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If you take a horse from a rescue centre then you are not perpetuating the problem. Those horses have been seized and the neglectors have not profited. If you buy a horse directly from the neglectors then you are perpetuating the problem by lining their pockets.

To have a horse from a rescue centre, they have already been treated for whatever issues they have, and they have been rehabilitated. Your home and knowledge is checked and they give you the horse only if you are suitable.

The neglectors couldn't give two hoots about the homes they sell their horses to.
 
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