Responsible breeding??

[stolensilver]

I'm a small scale breeder and try to breed horses I'd want to own and ride if it didn't need to do the day job to pay for them all!

My main criteria are a sound, proven mare than can compete with an amateur against the professionals despite only being ridden part time. This is a tall order for any horse yet it is what most serious amateurs need. A horse who keeps their fitness easily, that comes out of the stable sane and kind no matter how many days they've had off and that remembers what you taught them in their previous ride so you can pick up where you left off. And that has quality and athleticism to be a winner even with the odds significantly stacked against them.

I'm fortunate enough to have two mares who fit that description. The older one was an amazing blood hounding horse who then went on to compete to PSG in dressage and schooled most of Grand Prix with an amateur rider who was learning as they went along. She went from doing a PSG test to being AIed for her first foal at the age of 16. She's still sound and happy and has just had her third foal at the age of 19.

The second mare is only 6. She went Elite at the Futurity and is schooling flying changes, half pass, passage and has just started piaffe. She finds everything easy. She's perfect for an amateur as she's incredibly kind and she only gets ridden three times a week. She should be a wonderful broodmare when she's older. She's just got to get to GP in dressage first.

The criteria I apply when choosing a stallion are that they have to either be world class competitors themselves with proven soundness and a good temperament or have sired or been sired by world class competitors with multiple top level competition horses amongst their close relatives. When you stick to those rules it's surprising how few stallions there are to choose from.

 

[chrissie1]

Have a look at the thread titled 'For all the coblet lovers' posted today.

Hard to say who dam and sire are, hard to say which camp this super chap falls into, responsible or irresponsible breeding.......but if he is in the same dressage class as the fancy warmblood, I just reckon the warmblood could be the one with the blue rosette.

Lovely video, well worth watching.

Have yet to see that thread. But some friends have not long sourced a coloured cob for someone who has taken up riding as a mature person. They had trouble locating one that wasn't already sold, but finally found X, who once they had ridden him a few times has proved to be a saint.

BUT another of their liveries has been schooling him and taken him competing for fun. He has never been lower than second and recently won. He is up against some very well bred horses, with all the tack/lorry etc to match, with trainers there in the warm up giving last minute instructions, but they get beaten by dear little X. Granted the jockey can ride well, but X has no papers, from Ireland but is more than capable. I am sure he was very irresponsibly bred.

 

[maestro]

Perhaps oversimplyfying it but for my breeding only becomes irresponsible if you are not prepared to take on board that you are responsible for what you have bred. I am less concerned about what the mare is (Although she has got to tick enough boxes) than the owner being in a position to look after mare and foal with the money if things go wrong. Breeding must not be taken lightly or on a shoestring, just because you fancy having a foal.

 

[magic104]

Magic, don't you mean "grammar"? Also, could you please spell "tolerance" for me?

Relevance to the thread is?

 

[Wagtail]

Misst
I actually started this post partly because I have just had a colt PTS today, who on paper should have been amazing but in reality wasn't and as I have said I want to know his fate and not that he is being passed from pillar to post also I personally wouldn't want him to have been a horse associated with my name (this sounds harsh but I believe reputation means alot in the horse world).


At what age do you "know" something is not good enough/"right"?

Well with this youngster he had OK conformation, good movement, a nice temp but seemed very short on brain cells and something just said to me from day one that he might not be good enough, I gave him a year to mature a bit and see how he grew (physically and mentally) and to tell you the truth not a lot had changed apart from he had got bigger!! So the descision was made, like you say it is not a nice descision to make and it is heartbreaking when you think about it but that is horse breeding and sometimes things just don't go the way you plan them.

Thanks, I am glad it is reasuring to some people.

Simon

You put a horse to sleep because he was a bit dim? And for your own reputation? How exactly did this manefest itself? What could he not do that you would expect him to do?

 

[magic104]

You put a horse to sleep because he was a bit dim? And for your own reputation? How exactly did this manefest itself? What could he not do that you would expect him to do?

Already replied to pg 2
"Simsar knows his stock through and through and this one had always been a worry for him because it was so dense even with field mates to almost be a danger to them let alone himself so would be totally unsuitable to even be a plod if he couldn't look after himself let alone a rider; I applaud him for taking the responsible action, only wish more breeders would. Bad conformation faults aren't the only sin, a sound and healthy mind (which this one didn't have) is almost more important because it can rebound so disastrously on other people; the only one affected by bad conformation is the horse itself."

 

[Wagtail]

Already replied to pg 2
"Simsar knows his stock through and through and this one had always been a worry for him because it was so dense even with field mates to almost be a danger to them let alone himself so would be totally unsuitable to even be a plod if he couldn't look after himself let alone a rider; I applaud him for taking the responsible action, only wish more breeders would. Bad conformation faults aren't the only sin, a sound and healthy mind (which this one didn't have) is almost more important because it can rebound so disastrously on other people; the only one affected by bad conformation is the horse itself."

Ok thanks.

 

[magic104]

Ok thanks.

The smilies don't work for me, sure they would help sometimes!!

 

[woodtiger]

Excuse me for butting in but just what has it to do with you whether you think it's a good enough reason or not? It wasn't your decision so please don't carp about it as if it was.
Simsar knows his stock through and through and this one had always been a worry for him because it was so dense even with field mates to almost be a danger to them let alone himself so would be totally unsuitable to even be a plod if he couldn't look after himself let alone a rider; I applaud him for taking the responsible action, only wish more breeders would. Bad conformation faults aren't the only sin, a sound and healthy mind (which this one didn't have) is almost more important because it can rebound so disastrously on other people; the only one affected by bad conformation is the horse itself.

We're not all irresponsible to breed from anything with a womb.

This ^^^^

IMO Simsar's the paragon of "responsible breeding". He produced a horse that is not suitable. He doesn't pass it on to cause problems elsewhere, but deals with the problem himself. I think humans could take a leaf from this book too, breeding for the sake of having a baby and getting benefits I think is criminal, but another argument entirely.

In Europe where horses are bred as an industry, a youngster that does not tick all the boxes will be culled. End of story. I currently have a nine-year old showjumper. Ultra careful, turns on a sixpence, he is a 1.20m horse (too small to do big tracks), so would suit a teenager or children on horses, however I am battling with myself about having him PTS -he has hospitalised two people, been evicted from two professional competition yards. I have nowhere to keep him safely. I have him on project horses, and am very specific about the home I am looking for. If I cannot find anyone suitable (with the facilities, who is safe and responsible), he too will be PTS. Incidentally, I believe that his behaviour developed as a result of bad management (abuse even), and it wasn't bred into him.

Too often these days, people will pass on their problems, causing grief for everyone concerned. Simsar, so me you are the epitome of a responsible breeder. Thankyou!