Rollkur/Hyperflexion

Prince33Sp4rkle said:
perhaps people could have asked for a cleared explanation of what she meant by finished rather than jumping down her throat?

for me a 5yo is on the brink of when baby work becomes slightly more grown up in the way of going and the questions asked and perhaps that is what OP meant?

agree re treating each horse as an individual but generally most dressage riders aim to have a change mostly established as a 5yo. My PSG horse started them as a 4yo and if done in a fun, easy, happy way i dont think they pressure them at all.

from the way the OP has spoken, it sounds like she has a yard of nice/quality horses, so probably the *sort* to be able to do a change at 4/5yo without it being an issue.

this reads like an absolute witch hunt, you use hyperflexion-we shall strike you down, oh no actually you dont but you DO do changes on youngsters-we will strike you down anyway!
Click to expand...

^^^ I pretty much agree with this :)
 
Prince33Sp4rkle said:
this reads like an absolute witch hunt, you use hyperflexion-we shall strike you down, oh no actually you dont but you DO do changes on youngsters-we will strike you down anyway!
Click to expand...

Given the OP doesn't appear to know what rollkur actually is, and in a separate thread has described bitless bridles as being "kind" because there is no bit, pardon me if then describing a 5y/o as "finished" (without clarification that she doesn't mean "ended", which is the usual definition of the word), makes alarm bells ring in my mind.

Yes, things can be misinterpreted, but that's why you try to be as clear as possible. "They've finished their basic education at 5" would be more in line with what the OP apparently meant.
 
hnmisty said:
Given the OP doesn't appear to know what rollkur actually is, and in a separate thread has described bitless bridles as being "kind" because there is no bit, pardon me if then describing a 5y/o as "finished" (without clarification that she doesn't mean "ended", which is the usual definition of the word), makes alarm bells ring in my mind.

Yes, things can be misinterpreted, but that's why you try to be as clear as possible. "They've finished their basic education at 5" would be more in line with what the OP apparently meant.
Click to expand...

actually, a bitless bridle IS kind (though a hackamore can be EXTREMELY severe) when i say bitless bridle, i mean the dr cook, which is pretty kind:D though , like any training aid/ bit, can be severe in the wrong hands.
 
hnmisty said:
Given the OP doesn't appear to know what rollkur actually is, and in a separate thread has described bitless bridles as being "kind" because there is no bit, pardon me if then describing a 5y/o as "finished" (without clarification that she doesn't mean "ended", which is the usual definition of the word), makes alarm bells ring in my mind.

Yes, things can be misinterpreted, but that's why you try to be as clear as possible. "They've finished their basic education at 5" would be more in line with what the OP apparently meant.
Click to expand...

gosh, have you never written anything that wasnt perfectly clear to every single person reading it?
 
ShowjumpingPrincess said:
hyperflexion is banned in warm up and during competition, but no one can do anything about it when you are at home. Anky Van Gruvsen uses hyperflexion and look how much she has achieved.
Click to expand...

My 12 year old niece trains with anky and her 14.1 goes "lovely" in rollkur and my sister helps her to make sure the lovely pony goes deep enough.......... :)
But then Anky also teaches my niece to lean back so the pony takes more weight from behind......... :eek:
What to say.

NO ROLLKUR poor horses!!!!
 
I've never worked out how to put pictures from my phone onto here :(
Anyway, I don't agree with rollkur but LDR is a different thing and I think it can be very useful. Some horses do carry their heads behind the vertical anyway
 
You can't put photos directly from a phone, you have to either put them on your hard drive or a photo sharing site.

The easiest way is to put them on your computer then go to your User CP (left of your screen) and click on 'Albums' then follow directions to create an album and download the photos you want to put on. Then you can post the link or just tell people to look in your album.

You can do it from photobucket etc but if you do make sure you have your privacy settings locked down. If you put the photos on here then people can't follow them back to see your other photos, which they can do on file sharing sites.
 
And don't be emailing them. No offence, but sharing photos of minors that aren't your own is not really a good idea, even with the best intentions.
 
ShowjumpingPrincess said:
i dont know what time you posted this, but i didn't ignore you! last night i had to go and rug up my horses and then i went to bed and i didn't even have enough time for breakfast this morning as i had to get up at 5.45am to get ready for competing today! i've only just got back!

how am i ignorant?
Click to expand...

I raised it at 6.30pm, and you replied to the post after mine, but maybe you just didn't see it. I was responding to:


ShowjumpingPrincess said:
a horse isn't really 'finished' dressage wise (can walk,trot,canter nicely, do flying change and able to collect and lengthen its stride) until it is around five, and this is not what i would class as a 'youngster'. we never would work a horse using this method whether we have bred it ourselves or bought it already started until it is at this age. some horses we buy that were started late don't have this method until they are 7 years old which is definitely not a youngster! it all depends on what stage of training the horse is at but we would never do it to break in a horse.
Click to expand...


I guess I misunderstood you... but I personally DO still class a 5 yr old as a youngster, relatively speaking.
But then, I take my horses very slowly, probably far too slowly for a lot of people. :)

It's not a witch-hunt, as far as I can see.

Ignorant? For roundly condemning practices which you know little about, I guess. Rapping, for instance. You seem to draw a direct line from some awful trainer who thought your mare needed to learn to feel what poles were like hitting her legs (WTF??? 'allergic to wood' horses are prized for good reasons!) and then bashed her around the head. That's awful, but naff all to do with rapping, surely?

I would never ever rap a horse myself, but I had a v v experienced trainer who did it twice, ever (in about 5 years of training me on various horses) and both times the results of doing it ONCE lasted for about 6 months... that is a lot better than a lot of training methods imho.
 
kerilli said:
I raised it at 6.30pm, and you replied to the post after mine, but maybe you just didn't see it. I was responding to:





I guess I misunderstood you... but I personally DO still class a 5 yr old as a youngster, relatively speaking.
But then, I take my horses very slowly, probably far too slowly for a lot of people. :)

It's not a witch-hunt, as far as I can see.

Ignorant? For roundly condemning practices which you know little about, I guess. Rapping, for instance. You seem to draw a direct line from some awful trainer who thought your mare needed to learn to feel what poles were like hitting her legs (WTF??? 'allergic to wood' horses are prized for good reasons!) and then bashed her around the head. That's awful, but naff all to do with rapping, surely?

I would never ever rap a horse myself, but I had a v v experienced trainer who did it twice, ever (in about 5 years of training me on various horses) and both times the results of doing it ONCE lasted for about 6 months... that is a lot better than a lot of training methods imho.
Click to expand...

oh sorry :) there were loads of posts last night so i guess i cant have seen it, but i really didnt ignore you!!:D
 
Kerilli is right, it isn't a witch hunt - however, OP is very young and, fwiw, I think has debated and argued in an undefensive, honest, slightly ingenous way which I find rather refreshing :) So I think we can probably cut her a little slack from time to time about not being very clear in her logic, not expressing herself as clearly as she could and, ok, being plain old wrong some of the time :D

I'm with you, OP, about rapping anyway - it crosses the line for me, however venerable and experienced the proponent :) Plus, I'd prefer a 13 yo to be anti-rapping until they discovered a good reason to change their mind than the other way around ;)
 
What happened to the pictures? I like pretty ponies- inspires me to smarten mine up :O ! Failing that i feel more of CS just to make this thread more colourful. I prefer the threads with pictures. :-P

Rapping hyperflexion draw reins etc all can go one of two ways. Non are good / ideal but different horses builds shape sizes etc.

Think part the problem is op is coming with a very blinkered mummy & daddy method are right and - understandably at 13- has no experience other than her parents.

How was your competition op? Was it dressage or sj?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top