Saddle conundrum - 16.5 inch HM Flexee or Ghost Piccolo??

[Kirstineridesagain]

I am wondering whether to go for a second hand Ghost Piccolo for £425 pounds or an almost new Heather Moffett Flexee (16.5 inch) for £360 for my Highland. She’s never worn a saddle but will be in the next few months. I haven’t had her measured forvaltning saddle as my budget is low and I don’t want to get a fitter out who will convince be to get another or made to measure saddle. I have someone who can check the saddle when it arrives, but I have no idea if I should go for a 17 inch instead. I was going to test the saddle on my Icelandic too, to see if it’s a good fit (she also needs a saddle). The Ghost is a private sale via Facebook and the Flexee is via EBay. My husband is’ sceptical of buying privately in case I get scammed (she doesn’t seem like a professional seller and nothing dodgy on her profile).

Both saddles are black, that’s why I’m thinking of my grey Highland for these saddles. I want a brown/havana for my chestnut Icey.

I’ll attach a photo of the Highland - she’s about 14-14.1 hands high btw. She has higher withers than my Icelandic.

 

[tda]

I would go for the ghost. I've trialled one but not purchased yet. I did have a Flexee when they first came out for another pony but I never felt quite right in it and sold it on quite quickly

 

[Caol Ila]

I’ve no experience with the Moffet saddles but both my horses are now in Ghosts. They are very adjustable when your horse changes shape, and there is a fitter semi locally, to you as well as me.

 

[Kirstineridesagain]

I’m inclined to go for the Ghost. Thanks both.

Yes, I know Steph Bloom will cover my area so that’s a bonus too.

 

[Kirstineridesagain]

…but husband says risky to buy from a private person online. Is there a way to protect yourself from losing money just in case it doesn’t show up?!

 

[TheMule]

…but husband says risky to buy from a private person online. Is there a way to protect yourself from losing money just in case it doesn’t show up?!

I only buy off Facebook if I know the person, I know that one of my friends definitely knows the person or I can go and pick it up myself. It¡s full of scammers!

 

[Widgeon]

…but husband says risky to buy from a private person online. Is there a way to protect yourself from losing money just in case it doesn’t show up?!

I only ever buy online (distance selling) if the seller is ok with using PayPal Goods & Services - that gives a lot more protection if something is "off". How far away is the seller? If I can't collect in person I always do a detailed web stalk of them - check their social media photos line up with their story, see if they're on any local RC websites etc. Obviously that's not foolproof but it's worked so far for me.

ETA - IME most people sell their second hand niche brand treeless saddles via social media groups, so if you rule out all purchases of that kind I think you will find it next to impossible to get what you need for your budget (sorry)

 

[TheMule]

There is a Ghost Piccolo for not much more than that on Vinted which does at least offer some degree of buyer protection

 

[Widgeon]

There is a Ghost Piccolo for not much more than that on Vinted which does at least offer some degree of buyer protection

Ooh, there's a brown one on there too for £550! https://www.vinted.co.uk/items/7470327919-ghost-veneto-piccolo-treeless-saddle?referrer=catalog

I would never have thought of looking at Vinted for saddles.

 

[Gloi]

Whenever I've bought a saddle on Ebay I've been to pick it up in person to check it out.

 

[Caol Ila]

My Ghosts came directly from Steph, since I wanted something weird, but I have bought other saddles and hoof boots and rugs from Facebook marketplace, ebay, etc., and never had a bad experience. Maybe some of it's luck, but I message the seller, and through the conversation you have, you can generally work out whether or not they are legit. I suppose a really good scammer could catch you out, but I've found people quite genuine.

 

[Landcruiser]

I've bought and sold some excellent saddles on Ebay over the years and never had a bad experience, although it's always "Buyer beware" at the end of the day. Just look out for red flags and check the seller history.

 

[Kirstineridesagain]

We’ll do PayPal goods and services. I had no reason to believe the seller wasn’t genuine, but my husband is cautious (sadly his mum got scammed for huge amounts of money many years ago).

If my budget was up for it I would have done it the «proper» way with saddle fitter advising first etc, but at least I can resell if it doesn’t work out.

 

[Dave's Mam]

I love my Flexxee. Just note they don't come in half inches, so the saddle is either a 16" or a 17".

 

[Kirstineridesagain]

I love my Flexxee. Just note they don't come in half inches, so the saddle is either a 16" or a 17".

Thank you. I’m very curious about it do will try to get one in Havanna for my Icelandic.

 

[NR88]

We’ll do PayPal goods and services. I had no reason to believe the seller wasn’t genuine, but my husband is cautious (sadly his mum got scammed for huge amounts of money many years ago).

If my budget was up for it I would have done it the «proper» way with saddle fitter advising first etc, but at least I can resell if it doesn’t work out.

Don't cut corners with saddle fitting. Get a fitter.

 

[Caol Ila]

You will probably need the support of a fitter for the Ghost. In my experience, you can't just plonk them on the horse and have them work straight out of the gate. They are a little faffy to get right. I had to do one of mine working with the fitter remotely, because of Steph's injury and my existing saddle becoming totally unuseable on my horse. I couldn't wait or not ride. This took a lot of back-and-forth messaging and photos. Kind of a ballache, but we got there in the end. I'd definitely prefer to have her there in person, but could not have made the thing work on my horse at all without her on the other end of the phone.

Ghost also has a few different types of tree, and I have found that not every one works on every horse.

 

[Widgeon]

Ghost also has a few different types of tree, and I have found that not every one works on every horse.

Yes - mine only liked the most rigid base (tree equivalent). Couldn't say why but he clearly went better in that than the more flexible ones.

 

[FieldOrnaments]

Sorry to be a negative Nancy but for a first saddle please absolutely get a fitter; those first experiences are so, so important for setting the horse up right. The idea of using any old saddle that vaguely fits for breaking, and doing it 'properly' when the horse is established, is outdated and unfair.

 

[Caol Ila]

Yeah, Hermosa has a fairly rigid one… I think they call it the C. Fin has a Flex base. Hermosa hated the Flex. Fin is more amenable to whatever but moved best in the Flex.

 

[Kirstineridesagain]

Wow, lots happening here while I was busy with horses and concert and baking.

Yes, I will actually get a fitter out for the Ghost as that’s possible - not so sure if I also get a HM Flexee how I can get one but that’s in the future anyway.

 

[mariew]

I have only ridden in hm once and felt like princess on a pea. So far away from the horse!

 

[greasedweasel]

I am absolutely no expert and may get my styles mixed up so feel free to correct me. I’ve “ridden’ in the Flexee on equine simulators, absolutely loved the set back stirrup leathers bars and felt they put you in a lovely position. However are those the ones with leather trees? I thought they effectively collapsed with use? My horse went wrong in work last year, couldn’t get to the bottom of it, whether it was feet, back, saddle, hocks… he’s had five months off and I just bought a HM, one of the old English made “Nursey” versions on EBay (tip if you are searching Moffett is often spelt wrongly) - older Saddle that had hardly been used and came with both types of inner pads so it can be fitted on to a more angular horse as well. VERY early days but I can barely sit on him he’s so forward and moving so well

Honestly, I feel it’s fairly ugly looking and I much prefer the look of a Ghost but for now the HM is a success.

 

[Kirstineridesagain]

I am absolutely no expert and may get my styles mixed up so feel free to correct me. I’ve “ridden’ in the Flexee on equine simulators, absolutely loved the set back stirrup leathers bars and felt they put you in a lovely position. However are those the ones with leather trees? I thought they effectively collapsed with use? My horse went wrong in work last year, couldn’t get to the bottom of it, whether it was feet, back, saddle, hocks… he’s had five months off and I just bought a HM, one of the old English made “Nursey” versions on EBay (tip if you are searching Moffett is often spelt wrongly) - older Saddle that had hardly been used and came with both types of inner pads so it can be fitted on to a more angular horse as well. VERY early days but I can barely sit on him he’s so forward and moving so well

Honestly, I feel it’s fairly ugly looking and I much prefer the look of a Ghost but for now the HM is a success.

I think the Flexee looks better than a Ghost, but have the Ghost on the way and hope it’s going to work. Still curious about the Flexee and may still go for one.

Fitting with the Ghost for my Highland is still a while off as she’s not even had a saddle pad or anything else on her back yet. She seems to take new things in her stride so fingers crossed she’ll be ready to have a saddle on soon.

 

[Caol Ila]

I am absolutely no expert and may get my styles mixed up so feel free to correct me. I’ve “ridden’ in the Flexee on equine simulators, absolutely loved the set back stirrup leathers bars and felt they put you in a lovely position. However are those the ones with leather trees? I thought they effectively collapsed with use? My horse went wrong in work last year, couldn’t get to the bottom of it, whether it was feet, back, saddle, hocks… he’s had five months off and I just bought a HM, one of the old English made “Nursey” versions on EBay (tip if you are searching Moffett is often spelt wrongly) - older Saddle that had hardly been used and came with both types of inner pads so it can be fitted on to a more angular horse as well. VERY early days but I can barely sit on him he’s so forward and moving so well

Honestly, I feel it’s fairly ugly looking and I much prefer the look of a Ghost but for now the HM is a success.

I have no idea if HM ones have leather trees or not, but my experience of leather treed saddles was why I had to buy a Ghost in a hurry, probably not exactly the one I would have wanted if I had the luxury of time, but it was the colour of a TARDIS, and I did not. I just needed something then and there, and Steph had this.

The leather tree saddle basically collapsed, and no matter what I did to fix the thing, with shims and correction pads and all that, it pressed down and caused large white patches behind her withers. Like within a week. It was fine one day, then not fine. I think the leather just softened and gave up, not helped by heavy use.

I think the Flexee looks better than a Ghost, but have the Ghost on the way and hope it’s going to work. Still curious about the Flexee and may still go for one.

Fitting with the Ghost for my Highland is still a while off as she’s not even had a saddle pad or anything else on her back yet. She seems to take new things in her stride so fingers crossed she’ll be ready to have a saddle on soon.

Ghosts can look like anything you want.

This one is my gelding's. I wasn't having a massive saddle-related freak out, so this one is all custom, rather than firefighting.

 

[Boulty]

Flexee do indeed have a leather tree. I like the placing of the stirrup bars and how they encourage you to sit (or rather my dodgy knee does) although some people hate them but after having 3 saddle fitters retire or move away plus a change of horse I did move away from them (to something that in all honesty didn’t suit me as well but flexee weren’t really quite the right shape for that horse and wouldn’t have invested in one of the more pricey models without someone to do in person fitting… also I don’t like some of the rabbit holes HM herself has now gone down and don’t wish to support her financially).

In all honesty I’ve still got a pre gullet one kicking around that I’m planning on using as a “this is what a saddle is” type of thing / possibly to have first few sits in to make saddle fitting a bit easier / more productive.

The one thing I would say if you do play with a flexEE is to access at least some basic some info on how they are supposed to fit as the difference in how they sit with & without rider on can be significant. They will sink down in front with a rider on (the memory foam models especially as the foam warms up) and so to be level with someone sat on them they need to start off looking a bit tipped back. (I found maintaining good clearance of the withers one of the challenges of using this type of saddle even with the gullet plate, flocked version, although frustratingly none of the HM fitters ever seemed to want to play with the flocking which in hindsight I think should have been done)


NB saying all the above with no saddle fitting training whatsoever, just used one for about 5 years.

Still completely unsure of what I’m going to end up with as a proper saddle myself for current horse but that’s a (end of) next year problem!

 

[sbloom]

The more I learn about saddle fitting (16 years in!) the more I see how subtle the art is, of getting BOTH horse and rider optimised. Having the rider sitting well (gold standard is - neutral pelvis, supported without tension or discomfort, leg draped with heel able to come under hip for flatwork, and sitting over the horse's COG ie at the base of the wither) has such a HUGE benefit for the horse, but it's difficult to achieve remotely. Not impossible, but much more difficult. I like the options a brand like Ghost offers for altering the fit for the rider without needing a completely different saddle which may or may not work for the horse.

Many brands are designed around what the owner likes in a saddle and what works for them, and just doesn't offer the options for different riders, even if they're great for horses (not saying either way, it's just worth considering). Unless the saddle is definitely in correct balance for the horse for starters (some leeway) and the seat fitted for the rider, then any saddle can feel perched. Ghost do put you up a little higher but this does mean more scope to get the rider into a neutral pelvis and the leg under them - sitting close contact on a very wide back pushes many riders back onto the seatbones and the leg then comes forwards.

Oh and nearly all treeless come down more in front with a rider up than do treed saddles, but both can depend on the support the pelvis is looking for - I once actually wondered where the front of the saddle had gone at one fitting, the chap's pelvis just pushed the front of the saddle down so much, like 3"...and that was treed and flocked!

 

[Nudibranch]

Fwiw I do like the Flexee. I've used the pre gullet and now adjustable gullet version but you do need a proper shim pad with them. And the recommended Nuumed one is no longer manufactured (I think). I find them comfortable, horse goes nicely, certainly don't feel perched.

BUT customer service is dreadful. I ended up buying second hand; I sent numerous emails trying to buy from them brand new and they were ignored! Mine is wearing out as its a synthetic so I am thinking of moving on to something like a Ghost instead.

 

[Dave's Mam]

Fwiw I do like the Flexee. I've used the pre gullet and now adjustable gullet version but you do need a proper shim pad with them. And the recommended Nuumed one is no longer manufactured (I think). I find them comfortable, horse goes nicely, certainly don't feel perched.

BUT customer service is dreadful. I ended up buying second hand; I sent numerous emails trying to buy from them brand new and they were ignored! Mine is wearing out as its a synthetic so I am thinking of moving on to something like a Ghost instead.

Sales for the Flexees is now with another company. Happy to send you by PM.