Saddle fitting plus prolite pad - advice please!

Fiona

Fiona

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Sophie is a 16.2 IDx mare. Her saddle is a bates GP with a narrow gullet plate. I started using a prolite pad underneath her saddle last year as it seemed a tiny bit wide for her, and I thought it would make it a better fit (not acually sure if there is a narrower gullet plate than narrow). Also most HHOers seem to think that prolite is good to use when jumping as it spreads any pressure points.

Anyway, thats the background...

FOr the past week I have noticed a darker mark (she is a grey) on either side just behind her withers. She has been bathed and the mark remains. Doesn't mind pressure with my fingers there or anywhere else on her back (back lady did her back about 2 months ago BTW).

Today OH schooled her for half an hour and I stripped the numnah off it when we got back in the yard. The dark mark exactly corresponds shape of the prolite pad, and even worse (to my absolute horror) there was a ridge of swelling just below the bottom edge of the pad.

Maybe I'm not explaining well, but if my hand was on her spine and I ran it vertically down her side, there was a bump up exactly where the edge of the pad was sitting under the saddle.

Needless to say the prolite has been removed, and hopefully her sadle on its own will still give enough clearance in front. My saddler would come out and see it I'm sure, but he is closed this week (holiday in NI) and won't be available to talk to until next Monday.

I will check her back tonight, though assuming the presure ridge will have dispersed by then. I've never noticed it before by the way, even though I often sponge her saddle area after riding.

Do Bates/Wintec do a narrower than narrow gullet plate???

Has anyone noticed similar pressure ridge on their horse due to a pad/numnah or saddle?

Sorry - thats quite long!!!

Fiona
 
are you sure she needs narrow? i've never known an idxtb that was narrower than a medium, tbh. depending on how much ID, i'd expect medium upwards.
my full tb is in a medium, fwiw, and she's got long dorsal spinous processes and low ribs (according to master saddler.)
i would get a good saddler out to check the fit of your saddle asap.
prolites are very good BUT they will not make a saddle fit, any more than an ace pair of insoles or socks will make a pair of trainers fit you if they are totally the wrong size.
i have used prolites and other pads for years and NEVER had a pressure line or ridge.
 
I'm uploading a couple of conformation pics - she does have very well defined withers (without having the razorblade withers that TBs have). She has had the saddle for about 4 years, and its checked regularly by back lady and saddler.

If I change the gullet plate to the med/narrow the front of the saddle touches her withers so she is def a narrow (in Wintec/Bates measurement anyway).

I can see where you're coming from though, if I read my post (posted by someone else) I would suggest that her saddle was too narrow a fitting as well.

Here she is...

IMG_4324.jpg


What do you think???

Fiona
 
but it isn't just the width of the gullet plate. if you have a saddle with a flared-out panel lower down (i can't remember the name of it, but it is deeper to reach the ribs, so it is supported upwards from about 8" below the spine on each side) then this lifts it, so a medium gullet plate is fine.
i'll try to find a pic of a saddle with panels shaped like mine, it's very specific.
okay, on horsequest saddles, 5th one down is an albion kontrol and there's a pic of it from underneath, you can see that the panel is flared in the middle to reach horse's ribs. hope you can see what i mean!
 
I think? I can see what you mean - unfortunately I don't think that area is adjustable on a cair saddle, and there isn't a very narrow gullet plate available.

She is a medium in other saddles, my dressage and GP saddles (which don't fit OH unfortunately as the seat is too small).

I'll have to see what the saddler says - hope he can come at the start of next week.

Bum
crazy.gif
!!!

Fiona
 
That sort of confo really benefits from a drop panel and full gusset, I would want her in a medium fit personally with the panels adapted to lift the saddle and allow her to develop underneath
 
[ QUOTE ]
That sort of confo really benefits from a drop panel and full gusset, I would want her in a medium fit personally with the panels adapted to lift the saddle and allow her to develop underneath

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree.

She needs a drop panel to give clearance to the wither and balance the saddle - not a narrower gullet. No way that horse should be a narrow - she should definitely be a med/wide.

Never had problems with prolites and always used one for jumping (jump saddles fitted with prolite).
 
My horse is a similar stamp and hes in a wide saddle. His withers arent as high though. I am certainly no expert but I would say you need a different saddle, sorry.
 
drop panel and full gusset is what i was trying to remember.
i think you might have to accept that the bates is just the wrong saddle for her. not all saddles can be made to fit all horses! i wouldn't put that one on her again if she were mine.
 
What are drop panel and full gusset - do not want to pontificate to saddler about what might suit her if I don't know what I mean
tongue.gif


Saddle has fitted her well until recently - I wonder do the Cair airbags gradually lose their 'bouyancy'???

Fiona
 
It means the panel is dropped down, giving the withers plenty of clearance (think the panel starts lower down from the top of the pommel)

Gusset are where the front of the panel is made wider, which helps lift the front of the saddle.

If you were talking in wow terms, you'd be after a panel with tabs and front gusset if you look on their website it might help you visualise on other saddles.
http://www.fteltd.co.uk/wow/wowpaneltypes.htm
 
Fiona, i can't see how a narrow gullet saddle could have fitted her, unless cair was pumped up as full as possible to lift it up off her withers. she doesn't look anything like a N fitting! ask saddler to fiddle with cair panels if you are convinced it did though.
 
Sorry to butt in, but is dropped panel the same as cut back pommel? As that is what I was going to suggest. I agree, she doesn't look like a narrow. I think there are very, very few horses in this world that truly fit narrow saddles. It sounds like the Prolite pad is raising the whole saddle, meaning that the points of the tree are now applying pressure, as they are 'resting' higher up than they would otherwise be.
 
No - a drop panel is where the the panel area where the points sit is extended further down the front of the saddle - this builds the saddle up more in front for horses with higher withers. the tree is also more shaped in front to accommodate the drop panel.

a cut back pommel is where the pommel is cut further back - again to accommodate high withers but this sometimes doesnt suit the saddle or the rider.
 
Just to add my point of view, i agree with others, your horse is not a narrow. To me it actually looks like she has muscle wastage under the saddle area, indicating the saddle doesnt fit. If you take that part of her conformation, it doesnt fit with the rest of her, which is much chunkier and wider. She is not a narrow little wiry horse at all. The area under the saddle looks very poor and weak to me and it just doesnt fit with the rest of her.

A dropped panel basically is a fatter panel that fills in the hollows on TB type horses, behind the shoulders. Without this it can be tempting to go too narrow in the tree to clear the wither, when basically what the horse needs is a wider tree and a deeper panel.


Your horse has a reasonably long wither too, which is maybe why your saddler has gone narrow, in order to clear it. But this is wrong! IMO you need a different saddle, more suitable for your horses conformation than your current saddle. A cair panel cannot be altered to make it fuller. You need a tree at the correct width, with a cut back head to help wither clearance in conjunction with a deeper panel to lift the saddle away from the wither.
 
Another vote to back up everyone else. That horse isn't a narrow, she's probably wider than medium. You need a saddle designed to accommodate high, long withers. By using a saddle that's too narrow in order to clear the withers, you will create loads of other problems with pressure points.
 
Thanks for the link CotswoldSJ - very helpful pics on that site.

General reply - I never said she was a 'narrow' fitting. I very plainly said she is a med fitting in my dressage saddle and GP saddle. However my OH rides her in a bates GP saddle (which has been professionally fitted to her), and to get the required amount of wither clearance we had to change the gullet plate from a med to a narrow over the winter. I asumed she had just lost weight (most horses do over the winter).

I have examined the saddle carefully today. The panel 'shape' is very nice (nearly dropped you might say), but if it were a flocked saddle I would say that the flock had become very thin and compacted at the front, and would need redone. Obviously as it is a cair saddle it doesn't have flock in this position, so I will have the saddler out and see what he says (I may then find out why this saddle has stopped fitting her, or I may not, but rest assured she will be ridden in a saddle which fits her).

Fiona
 
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